Emergency(Medical) & First aid kit
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DD, not to pick a fight, but to balance the view a bit.
I've been an FA for longer than I care to admit, and my experience with MDs is not like yours.
In the medical emergencies I have been involved in on board, medical personel has invariably shown a willingness to help that was above and beyond.
And in most of the serious cases, the outcome for the passenger involved could have been very different with only FAs to provide the care.
You know what p!sses me off most about getting doctors to attend on board?
The way they are subsequently treated by my company! Maybe other companies have a good system for it, but with us it's a thousand thank yous from the CC, a bottle of bubbly and bye bye.
Highly embarassing that, and it's the only thing that sometimes makes me hesitate to make that PA call.
I'm deeply grateful to all doctors who are willing to step up to the plate when they are not on duty. And impressed by their ability to improvise.
Dave, have you ever considered that arrogance can be a lot like beauty?
Mainly in the eye of the beholder?
I've been an FA for longer than I care to admit, and my experience with MDs is not like yours.
In the medical emergencies I have been involved in on board, medical personel has invariably shown a willingness to help that was above and beyond.
And in most of the serious cases, the outcome for the passenger involved could have been very different with only FAs to provide the care.
You know what p!sses me off most about getting doctors to attend on board?
The way they are subsequently treated by my company! Maybe other companies have a good system for it, but with us it's a thousand thank yous from the CC, a bottle of bubbly and bye bye.
Highly embarassing that, and it's the only thing that sometimes makes me hesitate to make that PA call.
I'm deeply grateful to all doctors who are willing to step up to the plate when they are not on duty. And impressed by their ability to improvise.
Dave, have you ever considered that arrogance can be a lot like beauty?
Mainly in the eye of the beholder?
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Flaps, methinks you have hit the nail on the head. Doctors know enough about things to improvise.
My dangerous friend, I see you are from Brighton. You will no doubt have heard of the great Douglas Chamberlain. He was basically the first arrogant doctor in the UK to stick his neck out (and he was not very popular at the time for doing so) and let paramedics like you run around in your green uniforms saving lives which would otherwise have been lost. Of course they were still just ambulance drivers then, but a good bunch, and very keen to expand their skills. Dr Chamberlain even let - nay encouraged, or required - you to come on our business wardrounds, and you learned how to do as you were told and follow procedures, for that was basically all you were qualified to do.
Every now and then the paramedic would cock up because he failed to follow procedures set out by the arrogant ones. I remember one lad in particular. This paramedic had noticed that if you give atropine, the heart speeds up. If you give diamorph, the heart slows down. He probably didn't know why, but he knew it happened all the same. So one day he failed to follow the procedures set out by some arrogant doctor and stuck somebody with atropine who didn't really need it. Heart rate went through the roof. What's a boy to do? Well, boy wonder decided he would squirt a large bolus of diamorph in, and slow the heart down it did. Quite a lot in fact, and the respiratory rate too.
Fortunately the paramedic got the patient to A&E in time, and the arrogant doc who had heard of naloxone saved the day. The paramedic didn't even know what naloxone was, and why should he? He was only supposed to follow procedures, which he spectacularly failed to do.
Anyway, we all had a laugh about it later, but that paramedic was never to be seen on the coronary care unit again. He is probably still bussing old dears to their day care centre.
Great people paramedics, the do a lot of good, but if you are going to think out of the box, you really need to apply to med school first. One is starting up in Brighton I hear, and it's not as hard as most people think
I was on a flight the other week where some old guy collapsed on the way to the toilet. The cabin crew were quite frankly useless, I was amazed. But like most people, he got better on his own. That's probably why doctors are not needed on flights. But when somebody is truly ill, you unfortunately really need a doctor or nurse to make that kind of evaluation.
Flaps, the previous time to that when I got up to help, the CC took one look at me and told me to sit down! Too much booze in the lounge had left me the worse for wear, I was sicker than the patient
My dangerous friend, I see you are from Brighton. You will no doubt have heard of the great Douglas Chamberlain. He was basically the first arrogant doctor in the UK to stick his neck out (and he was not very popular at the time for doing so) and let paramedics like you run around in your green uniforms saving lives which would otherwise have been lost. Of course they were still just ambulance drivers then, but a good bunch, and very keen to expand their skills. Dr Chamberlain even let - nay encouraged, or required - you to come on our business wardrounds, and you learned how to do as you were told and follow procedures, for that was basically all you were qualified to do.
Every now and then the paramedic would cock up because he failed to follow procedures set out by the arrogant ones. I remember one lad in particular. This paramedic had noticed that if you give atropine, the heart speeds up. If you give diamorph, the heart slows down. He probably didn't know why, but he knew it happened all the same. So one day he failed to follow the procedures set out by some arrogant doctor and stuck somebody with atropine who didn't really need it. Heart rate went through the roof. What's a boy to do? Well, boy wonder decided he would squirt a large bolus of diamorph in, and slow the heart down it did. Quite a lot in fact, and the respiratory rate too.
Fortunately the paramedic got the patient to A&E in time, and the arrogant doc who had heard of naloxone saved the day. The paramedic didn't even know what naloxone was, and why should he? He was only supposed to follow procedures, which he spectacularly failed to do.
Anyway, we all had a laugh about it later, but that paramedic was never to be seen on the coronary care unit again. He is probably still bussing old dears to their day care centre.
Great people paramedics, the do a lot of good, but if you are going to think out of the box, you really need to apply to med school first. One is starting up in Brighton I hear, and it's not as hard as most people think
I was on a flight the other week where some old guy collapsed on the way to the toilet. The cabin crew were quite frankly useless, I was amazed. But like most people, he got better on his own. That's probably why doctors are not needed on flights. But when somebody is truly ill, you unfortunately really need a doctor or nurse to make that kind of evaluation.
Flaps, the previous time to that when I got up to help, the CC took one look at me and told me to sit down! Too much booze in the lounge had left me the worse for wear, I was sicker than the patient
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Anecdotes, Anecdotes
I am not here to enter into a discussion of paramedics vrs. hospital staff. This is not the place, or the time, Slim. A doctor has at least 5 years of medical school, where as paramedics have 6 months classroom training over 3 years. Your story, Slim while making interesting reading, is not entirely true. Yes the paramedic did make a lot of mistakes, but there again all of us have done at some time in our lives. The person in question was sacked. I realise that people only think that we are glorified white van drivers, but actually had to also attend 1 month of advanced driving instruction. Actually even the smallest, most petite female ambulance staff would be a safer/faster driver than 99% of men who haven't gone through the training. It is worth doing.
Everyone has anecdotes, and stories that will back up their own point of view. As you can see in almost every thread that there is anecdote, after anecdote. If you want, I could reel off a list of anecdotes about how come I feel doctors are overpaid, and arrogant. I am sure that people might of had different experiences than mine.
I will just rely one such anecdote. While flying for Rod Eddington,one of my crew came to me and told me about a pax who was in a lot of distress. After hearing the crew, talking to the pax and his family, and also speaking to Medlink on the radio, it was requested that we PA for a Doctor, in order to administer drugs from the M5 medical kit that are IV only. After the call went out, I got a call from my purser in Club World saying that there was a doctor in her cabin, but the doctor said something to the effect that he would go and look at the pax in distress but only after he had finished his lunch. (The end result was there was another MD on board, and after seeing the pax we were diverted for a medical emergency, and the pax was in an ambulance on the ground almost before the other doctor would have finished his steak, and cheeseboard.)
The whole point of what I was trying to say was that the training that cabin crew get (at the airlines I worked for at least) is a high standard. The crew only need a little confidence and they would then be able to handle a whole range of situations with ease. It is only because the medical situations do not happen often and the crew do not get much practice.
I don't mean to upset anyone, and yes I do know Mr. Chamberlain, and consider him a friend.
Everyone has anecdotes, and stories that will back up their own point of view. As you can see in almost every thread that there is anecdote, after anecdote. If you want, I could reel off a list of anecdotes about how come I feel doctors are overpaid, and arrogant. I am sure that people might of had different experiences than mine.
I will just rely one such anecdote. While flying for Rod Eddington,one of my crew came to me and told me about a pax who was in a lot of distress. After hearing the crew, talking to the pax and his family, and also speaking to Medlink on the radio, it was requested that we PA for a Doctor, in order to administer drugs from the M5 medical kit that are IV only. After the call went out, I got a call from my purser in Club World saying that there was a doctor in her cabin, but the doctor said something to the effect that he would go and look at the pax in distress but only after he had finished his lunch. (The end result was there was another MD on board, and after seeing the pax we were diverted for a medical emergency, and the pax was in an ambulance on the ground almost before the other doctor would have finished his steak, and cheeseboard.)
The whole point of what I was trying to say was that the training that cabin crew get (at the airlines I worked for at least) is a high standard. The crew only need a little confidence and they would then be able to handle a whole range of situations with ease. It is only because the medical situations do not happen often and the crew do not get much practice.
I don't mean to upset anyone, and yes I do know Mr. Chamberlain, and consider him a friend.
