Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Ground & Other Ops Forums > Medical & Health
Reload this Page >

James Reason on medical error

Wikiposts
Search
Medical & Health News and debate about medical and health issues as they relate to aircrews and aviation. Any information gleaned from this forum MUST be backed up by consulting your state-registered health professional or AME. Due to advertising legislation in various jurisdictions, endorsements of individual practitioners is not permitted.

James Reason on medical error

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 19th Feb 2012, 09:26
  #1 (permalink)  
Moderator
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 14,216
Received 48 Likes on 24 Posts
James Reason on medical error

(I'll bollock myself later for a double post, as I also posted this on the CRM forum).

I just heard the trailer for this...

BBC - BBC Radio 4 Programmes - Doctor - Tell Me the Truth

Should be half an hour worth listening to I'd think. Hopefully will be available on iPlayer for a while afterwards for those with something else planned for a Monday night!

(James Reason, for those who don't know, is the originator of the "swiss cheese" model bedded into most CRM training now.)

G
Genghis the Engineer is online now  
Old 19th Feb 2012, 10:58
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: gone surfin'
Age: 58
Posts: 2,333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Haven't heard the show yet, but expect they're tlking about "Significant Event Analysis."

It's something positive that we picked up from the aviation industry. In our surgery, we partake in the process weekly, and it's infinately better than what we used to do - (standing at the bar saying "phew, had a close one today.")

Of course, building stuff into the system to stop us mere humans making mistakes in the first place, also helps.

gingernut is offline  
Old 19th Feb 2012, 15:55
  #3 (permalink)  
Moderator
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 14,216
Received 48 Likes on 24 Posts
I got the impression from the trailer that he was most likely going to be talking about open no-blame reporting of failures.

His book "The human contribution" has some fascinating stuff about medical errors and how they can be prevented. A lot seemed to concentrate upon the willingness to identify, rectify, and report mistakes.

Building stuff into the system to prevent error is more Atul Gawande's territory to some extent.

G
Genghis the Engineer is online now  
Old 19th Feb 2012, 19:45
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: london
Posts: 741
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Sadly there is no such thing in the uk

Two years ago the chief medical officer launched an on line reporting system for anything from concerns through near misses to deaths

But it isn't in any way confidential so you have to be a bit silly to use it. Bullying is rife in hospitals and sadly some managers would use a report against the author. As for the lawyers......

Medicine always thinks it is safe and state of the art but in terms of crm and reporting and modifying practice we remain in the dark ages
homonculus is offline  
Old 19th Feb 2012, 20:49
  #5 (permalink)  
Moderator
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 14,216
Received 48 Likes on 24 Posts
I suspect that may well be Professor Reason's point - but I plan on listening to the programmes to find out.

G
Genghis the Engineer is online now  
Old 21st Feb 2012, 21:11
  #6 (permalink)  
Moderator
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 14,216
Received 48 Likes on 24 Posts
Postscript, having listened to episode 1 - it would appear that Prof. Reason agrees with you completely Homonculous.

G
Genghis the Engineer is online now  
Old 21st Feb 2012, 21:42
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: gone surfin'
Age: 58
Posts: 2,333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Bullying is rife in hospitals and sadly some managers would use a report against the author. As for the lawyers......

Medicine always thinks it is safe and state of the art but in terms of crm and reporting and modifying practice we remain in the dark ages

Yes, perhaps I'm being to optimistic.

Significant event analysis was meant to be for "the greater good."

Unfortunately, it is used more of a threat..."I'm thinking of raising a SEA about this.."
gingernut is offline  
Old 22nd Feb 2012, 03:21
  #8 (permalink)  
Psychophysiological entity
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Tweet Rob_Benham Famous author. Well, slightly famous.
Age: 84
Posts: 3,270
Received 34 Likes on 17 Posts
I recall a pal telling me about a surgeon that took out ever increasing lumps of his patients, most of them dying as a result. No one dared challenge Sir whaterverhisnamewas. Until finally, a chap with balls stood up and said the Emperor has no clothes. He was senile, but waaaaaaaaay too important to be criticized.
Loose rivets is offline  
Old 22nd Feb 2012, 04:45
  #9 (permalink)  

Plastic PPRuNer
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Cape Town
Posts: 1,898
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
That was Ernst Ferdinand Sauerbruch (3 July 1875 – 2 July 1951) in Germany.

A great surgical pioneer and Nazi opposer who developed Altzheimers.

Hardly relevant to today....

Mac the Knife is offline  
Old 22nd Feb 2012, 21:42
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: london
Posts: 741
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Sadly I came across similar when training but it is very unlikely nowadays due to appraisal

Those who recall the Bristol babies scandal may be interested to know the brave anaesthetist who blew the whistle was hounded out of the UK
homonculus is offline  
Old 23rd Feb 2012, 08:08
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: gone surfin'
Age: 58
Posts: 2,333
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I was hoping things had moved on a bit since the Bristol case, and I, for one, was a great advocate for audit, significant event anlaysis etc etc, and I was, at one time, greatly enthused by the likes of people like Aiden Halligan, who told me that he had learnt an awful lot around safety, from the aviation world.

It does mostly rely on self reporting, and I'd have to agree, we've never really got to the point of a "no blame culture," some of us were hoping for. (Although, things are gradully improving.)
gingernut is offline  

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.