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Grayfly 27th Dec 2019 07:57


Originally Posted by Effluent Man (Post 10648027)
It's a fox for fox sake, get over it. I ran one over a couple of years ago, as a bonus I also ran over the two hounds that were in hot pursuit. As an extra bonus the local hunt paid me two hundred and fifty quid hush money!

Obviously not enough.

yellowtriumph 27th Dec 2019 09:16


Originally Posted by Cornish Jack (Post 10647805)
ATNotts, the last election had a good turnout despite less than ideal weather though I have experienced similar in May. For the UK as a whole I think the weather in December could prevent many reaching a polling station.

I would bet that they will reach an agreement to bring it forward to May.

Given that it would be held under the same corrupt system as this last one, why would that be of interest or concern?
Irrespective of which time of year a GE is held, it will still allow a Party without a majority of individual support to 'engineer' a 'Landslide'. Democracy may not be dead but it is mortally wounded in this Nation.

Iíll try for the third time, who do you think won the election held on December 12th?

Cornish Jack 27th Dec 2019 10:19

For the third time, define "won"!
Johnson's cabal claimed a 'landslide' victory having garnered fewer votes than just the two main English opposition Parties combined! If we look at the Nation entire, it was even worse! In spite of that, our 'democratic' system manged to engineer a 'majority' of over 70 seats.Had that occured in a 3rd world 'banana republic', there would have been outrage ... but here in our 'civilised' political environment, it is accepted as 'Representative Government'. I am fully aware that it is 'the system', but 'the system' is corrupt!
If your personal sense of morality is prepared to accept corrupt governance, without comment, so be it. Mine doesn't, nor will it, as long as the few remaining brain cells function. My simpleton's version of 'majority' is the greater of two, or more, opposing totals. Just to remind you :-
Conservative - 13,966,565

Labour - 10,295,607
LibDems - 3,696, 427
Total - 13,992,034
Those are FACTUAL totals ... so, who WONthe poll?

Bee Rexit 27th Dec 2019 10:29


Originally Posted by Grayfly (Post 10648031)
Obviously not enough.

or true.

10 character limit.

flocci_non_faccio 27th Dec 2019 10:38


so, who WONthe poll?
The Conservative Party. What bit of that are you failing to understand?

As I've previously stated however, I'd have been more than happy to have had PR in place in 2015, as we'd currently be looking back at nearly 5 years of a CON/UKIP coalition with Nigel Farage as deputy PM.

Krystal n chips 27th Dec 2019 11:05


Originally Posted by flocci_non_faccio (Post 10648116)
The Conservative Party. What bit of that are you failing to understand?

As I've previously stated however, I'd have been more than happy to have had PR in place in 2015, as we'd currently be looking back at nearly 5 years of a CON/UKIP coalition with Nigel Farage as deputy PM.

Your support for totalitarian Gov't is duly noted.......... the example shown being an unequivocal benefit of not having PR.


Fly Aiprt 27th Dec 2019 11:12

Guys,
We all know which party won the elections and who the PM is. We also approximately know the percentage of pro vs anti brexit.
So we do know what "the will of the people" is, and why the PM preferred elections to a referendum.

Now time to move on. Negotiations.
What about the EU proposing (imposing) to sequence the talks ?
And poposing in this order, fisheries etc., then goods trade, then services ?

Pontius Navigator 27th Dec 2019 11:27

What on earth is CJ doing making unattributed quotes in support of his own undemocratic views.

Our system has flaws, the value of a vote varies hugely from constituency to constituency. An equable balance would see more Liberal and fewer SNP MPs. It would also see no majority Government and probably a near permanent alignment to Socialism.

Would a one party system, like Russia, be better than a two-party system like the US?

Cornish Jack 27th Dec 2019 11:30

What bit of that are you failing to understand?
It would appear that i was typing too quickly so I'll do this bit v e r y s l o w l y to aid comprehension.
Given two totals in competition for the greater, the bigger number is considered to be the winner ... with me so far?
The total number of votes cast for Parties opposed to the Conservatives was MUCH greater than the total for the Conservatives. Still with me?
Ergo (nice bit of Latin, to indicate serious, intelligent debate!) the Conservatives lost the competition for popular support. QED (What did the Romans ever do for us?)
However, our (i.e.the UK) political system is able to translate such trivial nonsense as vote-counting, via the arcane wizardry of 'power-broking', into a ludicrous travesty of citizen's representation touted as a 'Landslide Victory'!!! If that isn't Humpty-Dumpty territory, I don't know what is!
Still, all is peaceful in the realm of the unthinking ... Don't rock the boat! ( especially this close to sinking!)

MFC_Fly 27th Dec 2019 11:32


Originally Posted by Cornish Jack (Post 10648140)
What bit of that are you failing to understand?
It would appear that i was typing too quickly so I'll do this bit v e r y s l o w l y to aid comprehension.
Given two totals in competition for the greater, the bigger number is considered to be the winner ... with me so far?
The total number of votes cast for Parties opposed to the Conservatives was MUCH greater than the total for the Conservatives. Still with me?
Ergo (nice bit of Latin, to indicate serious, intelligent debate!) the Conservatives lost the competition for popular support. QED (What did the Romans ever do for us?)

So by your theory, Lewis Hamilton is not the F1 World Champion, because if you add up all the points of all the other drivers in the competition they got more :D

Sallyann1234 27th Dec 2019 11:52


Originally Posted by MFC_Fly (Post 10648143)
So by your theory, Lewis Hamilton is not the F1 World Champion, because if you add up all the points of all the other drivers in the competition they got more :D

Amusing, but not a valid comparison.

I just wonder whether CJ's complaints about FPTP would be criticised as strongly now if Corbyn had become PM?

yellowtriumph 27th Dec 2019 11:55


Originally Posted by Cornish Jack (Post 10648140)
What bit of that are you failing to understand?
It would appear that i was typing too quickly so I'll do this bit v e r y s l o w l y to aid comprehension.
Given two totals in competition for the greater, the bigger number is considered to be the winner ... with me so far?
The total number of votes cast for Parties opposed to the Conservatives was MUCH greater than the total for the Conservatives. Still with me?
Ergo (nice bit of Latin, to indicate serious, intelligent debate!) the Conservatives lost the competition for popular support. QED (What did the Romans ever do for us?)
However, our (i.e.the UK) political system is able to translate such trivial nonsense as vote-counting, via the arcane wizardry of 'power-broking', into a ludicrous travesty of citizen's representation touted as a 'Landslide Victory'!!! If that isn't Humpty-Dumpty territory, I don't know what is!
Still, all is peaceful in the realm of the unthinking ... Don't rock the boat! ( especially this close to sinking!)

So you canít answer my simple question.

Effluent Man 27th Dec 2019 11:55

Bee Rexit, I would offer to show you the bank statement with the cheque from Waveney Harriers if I could be bothered with the opinions of Essex Man.

yellowtriumph 27th Dec 2019 11:58


Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 (Post 10648158)
Amusing, but not a valid comparison.

I just wonder whether CJ's complaints about FPTP would be criticised as strongly now if Corbyn had become PM?

I can of course only reply for myself, but as much as I would have been appalled at Labour winning the last election I would have accepted the result without hesitation.

Effluent Man 27th Dec 2019 11:59

Yellow triumph.

if you add all the votes of Remain supporting parties there are roughly a million more than Leave ones. The percentage is around 53/47 . That is assuming that all Labour voters were Remain and all Tory ones Leave. That is being kind to Leave because it's generally reckoned that due to Farage standing candidates in Labour held seats more Remainers stayed faithful to the Tories than Leavers did to Labour.

under_exposed 27th Dec 2019 12:08

The total number of votes cast for Parties opposed to the Labour Party was MUCH MUCH greater than the total for the Labour Party.

Fly Aiprt 27th Dec 2019 12:46


Originally Posted by yellowtriumph (Post 10648166)
but as much as I would have been appalled at Labour winning the last election I would have accepted the result without hesitation.

Will this good sport attitude still hold when it comes to the results of the PM achievements in the fisheries/trade deal negotiations ?


Cornish Jack 27th Dec 2019 13:12

So you canít answer my simple question.
:confused::confused::confused: Say again - if necessary, 'words twice'!
or, on second thoughts, don't bother!
What on earth is CJ doing making unattributed quotes in support of his own undemocratic views.
Perhaps you would care to be unique among JB contributors and DEFINE 'Democracy'?
the value of a vote varies hugely from constituency to constituency
I think he's got it - bygad he's got it¨ (with acknowledgements to Alan Jay Lerner)
Would a one party system, like Russia, be better than a two-party system like the US?
Even allowing for standard JB thread drift, I have some difficulty accommodating that line of discussion - but feel free to talk among yourselves :confused:

Cornish Jack 27th Dec 2019 13:18

The total number of votes cast for Parties opposed to the Labour Party was MUCH MUCH greater than the total for the Labour Party.
Well spotted, sir! ... and your point was?

Fly Aiprt 27th Dec 2019 13:34


Originally Posted by yellowtriumph (Post 10648224)
The results of the negotiations are not dependent on what I think about the matter.

Not sure I'm understanding your response.
You said you would accept the result of the elections no matter what it would be.
The negotiations are to be conducted by the PM resulting from the elections, will you accept them no matter what you think about them ?


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