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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

Captain Sand Dune 3rd May 2014 11:50

And the Super Hornet. Also, I think the C-27J buy hasn't been overly influenced by the need to 'Australianise'.

bosnich71 3rd May 2014 12:55

One of the first major 'Australianise' job that I know of was the AQS 901 modification to RAAF P3C Orions sonic systems back in the late 1970s'.
The American sonics were removed and a joint Australian/British system fitted
All aircraft were returned on time after modification and the system worked as advertised.
Not a major project when compared with some of the high cost ones that came later but an example of how things could be done.

Andu 4th May 2014 08:19

I find myself hoping (against hope?) that some of the leaks that Tony Abbott and Joe Hockey are teasing us with pre-budget prove to be scare tactics, designed to condition people such that when the real thing is announced, many will be relieved to find that it's not as bad as they thought it was going to be.

I don't think I'm alone in hoping that they'll simply dump ALL retirement benefits for ex-politicians - (office, office staff, Gold Pass free travel, comcar etc.). It remains to be seen if they'll have the balls to do so. I suspect they'll come up with some half-arsed reduction in these benefits, possibly only for future politicians, leaving the Old Guard unaffected.)

SOPS 4th May 2014 09:58

I agree Andu. I find some of these proposals a little far to the right, even for me. I just hope they are scaring people, so the real thing does not look too bad.

Andu 4th May 2014 10:58

I think there'll be more than a few people out there who'll be happy, when the budget is eventually delivered, that however unpopular any measures the Libs may introduce may be, the Liberal government will be actually DOING something.

Among the voting public, (and I have to include myself to some degree in that), perception is almost as important as fact. (The *** Labor Pardee under Rudd and Gillard went so far as to make perception their primary aim - far more important in their eyes than boring old results.)

The perception, for many, is that, apart from stopping the boats, it's been business as usual in Canberra, just as it was when Labor was in power, since the September election.

parabellum 4th May 2014 11:35

Well, for years the ploy in all such situations, world wide, has been show them sixpence and on the day give them a shilling. Hopefully this is the case here and the ALP will finish up with a fair amount of egg on their face.

7x7 4th May 2014 12:18

Or tell 'em you're going to increase taxes by 25% and then only increase them by 20% - and they fall at your feet thanking you for being so generous. I hope that's what Hockey and Abbott are doing here.

Saltie 4th May 2014 21:44

War in Australia (any Oz Politics)
My daughter did a maternity leave contract in the public service a few years ago. After working in private enterprise, she was gob-smacked at how many people it took to achieve so little work. But she was also surprised that virtually everyone who had only worked in the public service honestly believed that they were working hard. If Hockey goes ahead and culls the PS, there'll be wailing and gnashing of teeth in more than one way.

500N 4th May 2014 21:52


I think you get various people in the PS.

Those who THINK they are working hard - but really output is peanuts
Those who ARE working hard - and just shit up and get on with the job
Those that ARE or WANT to work hard but are hindered - speak up, get pissed off and go somewhere else !

Some good people in the PS but also some real dead wood that due to
various rules almost have a job for life !!!

Worrals in the wilds 4th May 2014 22:04

But she was also surprised that virtually everyone who had only worked in the public service honestly believed that they were working hard.
Agreed. I came from the private sector (and later returned to the private sector) and was gobsmacked. My theory is that all public servants should be made to complete six months of private sector work every ten years (similar to long service), so they could get a reality check. :}

If Hockey goes ahead and culls the PS, there'll be wailing and gnashing of teeth in more than one way.
The problem is that if it's a repeat of what's happened in Queensland they won't cut the cockroaches, particularly the middle/upper management variety. Cockies have a knack of scurrying under the furniture at just the right moment, while the decent people doing the actual work get left in the firing line.

500N 4th May 2014 22:10


Agree re they get rid of the wrong people.

And this is partly (IMHO) because the people who are up top
are not always the best managers / workers and have weaseled
themselves up there.

Same problem will exist if they cut DMO.

Captain Dart 5th May 2014 00:36

Meanwhile, the other War in Australia rumbles on...

Young Brisbane mum charged with supporting terrorism

500N 5th May 2014 01:04

"trying to board a plane carrying cash and equipment including camouflage gear for her husband fighting in Syria"

Oooohhhh, dangerous stuff, camo gear :rolleyes: :ugh:

Ken Borough 5th May 2014 01:30

There's an interesting poll question at smh.com.au: 'Do you think it is reasonable for companies to have access to the Treasurer in exchange for donations to the Liberal Party?'. Unsurprisingly, only 3% of respondents have said 'yes'. Should the Roal Commission into Union slush funds be extended to include slush funds of political parties? The only problem as I see it is that the issue is so vast, a timely report would not be possible.

Read more: PM Tony Abbott defends Joe Hockey's fund-raising activities

500N 5th May 2014 01:37

What is the difference between that and paying $500 - $5000 a head to go to a dinner ?

Not much.

It doesn't matter what anyone says, it will go on.

Ken Borough 5th May 2014 01:49


The political scene of today requires a good clean out. In days of yore, politicians and cabinet ministers in particular were not chattels for which one paid a fee for access. TA reckons there's one way out: the taxpayer funds political parties. He is wrong: the parties should fund themselves as they used to until comparatively recently. It's bad enough that they receive quite a few dollars for each vote they receive. Crazy! People like Menzies and Calwell must be rotating in their graves at the mendacity, dishonesty and vanity of the modem day politician.

I wished I resided in Hockey's electorate so that I could try to make an appointment, as a constituent, to see him. Anyone fancy my hypothetical chances? There ought not be any price attached to access. After all, politicians are elected to represent their constituents. How many of them, and who of them, can honestly say that they really do this?

CoodaShooda 5th May 2014 04:39


If I may correct a couple of errors.

The concept of payment for access to political or government leaders is neither new nor limited to Westminster style government. Indeed, when the NT Government was pushing into Asia, I proposed that we adopt the ancient Asian tradition of "squeeze". Sadly, the minister did not think demanding cash for service was a politically sound idea....but he did see the joke.

Abbott was not advocating tax payer funding of political parties. He said it was an unacceptable alternative to party fundraising.

I'd suggest, as a constituent, you'd have a good chance of seeing your local member to discuss local issues. Although you might first be screened by an electorate secretary.

It's meeting a Minister to discuss ministerial matters that attracts the premium.

Had to admire Gary Grey for keeping a straight face this morning when he claimed there were no instances of corruption or cash for favours in the history of the Federal Parliament.

gupta 5th May 2014 04:51

And now, just to even things up, Bill Shorten can be accessed for a fee:
Labor offers business leaders exclusive access to Bill Shorten for $3300
So it's not a purely Liberal thing

bosnich71 5th May 2014 05:16

5000 ....... the dangerous stuff is ....
"when word spread on social media,of the woman's arrest,a group of hard line supporters gathered at the police station clamouring for her release".

Still it's only 10%..... at the moment anyway.

rh200 5th May 2014 05:31

5000 ....... the dangerous stuff is ....
"when word spread on social media,of the woman's arrest,a group of hard line supporters gathered at the police station clamouring for her release".
Actually the dangerous thing is when one said group start to get large enough that the authoritys have to play hard ball to bring them into line, and can't because an outside country will threaten to invade to protect its interests.

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