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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

500N 28th Jan 2014 02:44

"I really don't know what 500N actually means but it seems to me that he/she needs to either check his facts OR write with more clarity! :="

I said of which "more than half those able to vote" which you confirmed
with your numbers of 6.9 mil and 6 mil.

Weak debating point ?
Hard facts of deaths at sea during one period (Labor) versus another (LNP).

I see you haven't responded to the Aboriginal posts by myself and others.

I would call those who don't respond to have weak debating points.

Ken Borough 28th Jan 2014 02:52


I can't be bothered responding to some of the stuff here for there are none so deaf as those who don't want to hear. It's pointless and very much akin to trying to fart against thunder. I've better things to do than spend much of my waking time glued to my iPad trying to 'convert' the 'unconvertible' :ok:

500N 28th Jan 2014 03:10

Well Ken, you are wrong on that point as I am not "unconvertible'.

I have had my views changed on a couple of topics by people on PPRuNe.

Sounds like you are the "unconvertible' one since two other posters agreed
or partially agreed with me and the basis for my posts was personal experience
of Aboriginal society, not some "I'm offended by proxy lefty WASP" who probably hasn't had a whole heap to do with that part of Australia,

I don't see it as your role to "take offence by Proxy" for Aboriginal people.

Ken Borough 28th Jan 2014 03:16

I don't see it as your role to "take offence by Proxy" for Aboriginal people.
Relax old chap! I'd hate to see you blow a piffle valve. For the record, I do not take offence for minorities: they are the ones offended and I will sometimes speak in their defence. Also, I'm not a WASP. I fail to meet that definition on account of my religion, deo gratias.

Now, I'm off to spend some quality time on my boat - the weather's just perfect in my part of the world. :O

Ethel the Aardvark 28th Jan 2014 08:46

Mr Borough, don't tell the catering mob you are on a boat what ever you do! We will have all the pig offal and torpedo stories all over again. And just when I thought they were mellowing

Dark Knight 28th Jan 2014 22:32

Bosnich: exactly what I said; Fubaar just gave a more expanded explanation.

500N 28th Jan 2014 23:04

The ABC might have overstepped the mark once too often and
is now in the sights of the PM ?

How long will they last as they are and I wonder if this "shot across the bows"
makes them pull the collective heads in ?
The Age

Abbott accuses ABC of working against Aust

Tony Abbott has launched a scathing attack on the ABC, questioning whether it's working in Australia's interests and saying it should stick to straight news gathering.
"It dismays Australians when the national broadcaster appears to take everyone's side but our own and I think it is a problem," the prime minister told Macquarie Radio on Wednesday.
"You would like the national broadcaster to have a rigorous commitment to truth and at least some basic affection for the home team, so to speak."
Mr Abbott has been critical of the ABC for broadcasting the claims of asylum seekers who claim Australian sailors forced them to hold hot engine parts, burning their hands. He was also critical of its role in breaking the story about Australian spying on Indonesia, which caused a major diplomatic crisis.
The spying allegations came from US security agency documents leaked by whistleblower Edward Snowden.
"The ABC seemed to delight in broadcasting allegations by a traitor, this gentleman Snowden," he said.
"The ABC didn't just report what he said, they took the lead in advertising what he said. That was a deep concern."
He wants the ABC to be a straight news gathering and reporting organisation.
They are entitled, like all news organisations, to report "credible evidence", he said.
"But you shouldn't leap to be critical of your own country."

RJM 29th Jan 2014 05:45

It's getting interesting.

A few weeks ago there was speculatikon in the Australian that Abbott wasn't going to make a move against the ABC until it became absolutely obvious what was going on. Abbot could then appear to be responding to public pressure, or at least be reflecting widely-held public opinion, rather than having a go on his own initiative.

The RAN/burnt hand business is just the latest inu a series of own goals by the ABC. Perhjaps, as ex-ABC staffer Geoffrey Luck has said, the bias is so deep at the ABC that the people in the ABC can't recognise it.

For example, Mark Scott said not long ago that he had 'no idea' of teh political leanings of his staff. More than that, he asked how he would possibly find out?

It's quite clear to most of Australia that most of the ABC leans Left. Listen to Jon Faine and Fran Kelly spit and sneer at anything Liberal on their radio shows. Watch Tony Jones, Emma Alberici and to a lesser extent Leigh Sales trying again and again to set up Liberal interviewees, but pitching soft full lobs to those of their own side.

The ABC haughtily referred to the lack of real evidence to expolain its refusal to cover the Vitorian policwee investigation into Gillard's acrtivities, yet they made a meal of the burnt hand business, based on one statement by a disappointed asylum seeker to one junior reporter.

In siding with the asylum seekers against the RAN, the ABC alienated vast numbers of Australians.

What news editor - if the ABC has such a thing - let that story through without proper checking?

The ABC has itself to blame entirely for what is coming to it.

I think Abbott has chosen his time well.

500N 29th Jan 2014 06:08

Did anyone read the commentary in the Age byMichael Gordon, Political editor, The Age re Abbott's outburst ?

A very telling line at the bottom,

Tony Abbott's ABC outburst sits uneasily with ideals of a robust democracy

"Either the Prime Minister is out to deflect attention from other fronts – like the secrecy that shrouds his ''stop the boats'' strategy – or ABC funding is in his sights.

Agree, he has chosen his timing well and it is self inflicted.
Hopefully, Abbott won't just "cut and gut" them but set up a structure
where it hopefully won't become a lefty mouthpiece in the future.

RJM 29th Jan 2014 06:24

I hope so.

Jonathan Holmes (ex ABC, now a stringer for the Fairfax tabloids) had a similar piece in the Age today.

Immigration Minister Scott Morrison speaks out ... and shoots the messenger

He says:

"Claims of ill-treatment of asylum seekers by Australian navy personnel has led to another round of ABC bashing."

No mention of Navy-bashing.

Holmes suggest that "Rather than yet more ABC-bashing, let's put an end to secrecy on the high seas.”

Holmes must be a bit thick. Part of the success of the present strategy is its secrecy.

'We're going to play hide and seek, but you have to tell me where you're hiding'.

Thank God Holmes isn't part of the ADF.

RJM 29th Jan 2014 06:29

The Prime Minister's main concern is that the ABC ''appears to take everybody's side but our own'', and lacks ''at least some basic affection for the home team''.

This astonishing proposition – that coverage should be somehow skewed by nationalism, or patriotism – sits uncomfortably with the ideals of a robust democracy with a free, fair and fearless media.

As the Prime Minister knows, it is not the ABC's job to take sides, but to report fairly and accurately. Like any media organisation in the digital world, it is also to interpret, analyse and explain.

From: Tony Abbott's ABC outburst sits uneasily with ideals of a robust democracy
Michael Gordon knows very well the point Abbott was making. He wasn't asking for ABC bias in favour of Australia, just fairness across the board.

And as for

it is not the ABC's job to take sides, but to report fairly and accurately.
can't he see that that taking sides is exactly what the ABC does do, consistently.

SOPS 29th Jan 2014 06:56

About time. I wrote to the PM a few months ago about the ABC. The reply I received from his office was interesting, to say the least. It was pointed out in the letter what the ABCs charter is, and how, if I felt at any time I thought they were not following it, I should make a complaint at an address provided. And if I felt that reply was not adequate, to contact the PM again at any time.

I think Tony has been watching and waiting.

Airey Belvoir 29th Jan 2014 07:32

Since the polls started to confirm that the next Government was going to be a Coalition one and that there was absolutely nothing that the Labor/Greens rabble could do about it, the ABC set about to discredit Abbott and his party.

It's almost as if they had some sort of suicidal tendencies as they must have known that retribution would follow as sure as night follows day - even if it was only a curtailment of their spending abilities. One rather suspects that Sky will be rubbing their hands at the thought of getting the overseas broadcasting contract.

Surely the ABC didn't think, as it appears they did, that they could swing the mood of country and retain the cretinous mob that now sits on the opposition benches.

Serves the buggers right. Maybe they'll now get back to being the trusted and revered broadcaster that they once were.

500N 29th Jan 2014 07:47

I hadnt thought about the abc losing funding for overseas contracts.


Andu 29th Jan 2014 09:20

I predict that Labor, with the overzealous and all too willing assistance of the ABC, will be successful in selling to many in the electorate the claim that the Libs are using (make that abusing) the current union scandals to talk up a case for destroying the union movement.

500N 29th Jan 2014 09:27


Not too sure TA will go that far - a in destroying the unions,
(unlike Cain going after the BLF).

I think he'll use the corruption et al to reign them in and
weaken the power they have.

Toyota is going to help in this because its a case of get rid
of some work conditions or lose your job totally. In Vic in
the past, most have just shut up shop, I think Toyota wants
to stay here.

To silence Shorten, he'll have Police and / or Royal Comm
investigate and that will stop Shorten from speaking as he'll
shoot himself in the foot.

Airey Belvoir 29th Jan 2014 09:58

Sleazy ‘banese was on the ABC this morning moaning about if they’re going to investigate the unions then they should investigate big business as well.

Total plonker - that’s only admitting that they know there’s a problem with corruption in the unions.

Andu 29th Jan 2014 10:17

500N, I didn't say TA was going to do (or even try to) it, just that, much as they did with Work Choices, Labor and the ABC would succeed in making many believe that that is his agenda. Maybe even enough to swing an election.

500N 29th Jan 2014 20:59

Turnbull came out fighting for the ABC !

Was a bit surprised myself.

500N 29th Jan 2014 21:16

Possibly the hidden Agenda re the ABC ?

Found this in the NT News and The Australian.

So he could say that they are not doing what they are supposed to be doing.

What amazes me is the fact that it was Permanently awarded to the ABC
by Labor ????

Seems strange, whatever happened to competitive tenders ???

"THE Abbott government could axe the ABC's Australia Network Asian broadcasting service in the May budget.

Cabinet has discussed ending the public broadcaster's contract to provide Australian news and entertainment to the region, The Australian reports.
The network provides television services across the Asia-Pacific region, but also is used as a vehicle for "soft diplomacy'' - building goodwill overseas through news and entertainment.
But the newspaper reported that cabinet ministers believe the ABC's coverage of Australia in the region is overly negative and fails to promote the nation as originally intended in the Australia Network's charter.
In 2011, the Labor government permanently awarded the ABC the contract. Sky News had also bid for the contract."

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