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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

500N 25th Jan 2014 21:51

" One wonders how they would have fared had the Japanese been successful during WWII (heaven forbid!http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...milies/eek.gif)."

Well based on history, the Japanese didn't far too well when they clashed
with Abos in the past.

Now WWII with many Japs and many guns would have made a difference
but the Abos certainly wiped out a few Japs on boats with spears.

I wouldn't like to be hunting Abos in any bush country, they are that good.
(Well, they were !!!).

Airey Belvoir 26th Jan 2014 00:19

When the Japanese stormed through Malaya they were generally welcomed with open arms by the Malays because the Japs were seen to be throwing off the colonial yoke of the British and they would gain their independence.


That turned out really well. Say one thing about the Japs; they didn't hold any truck with favouritism - atrocities were dealt out to everyone.

parabellum 26th Jan 2014 00:59


When the Japanese stormed through Malaya they were generally welcomed with open arms by the Malays because the Japs were seen to be throwing off the colonial yoke of the British and they would gain their independence.

Airey, how about:


When the Japanese stormed through Malaya they were generally welcomed with open arms by the communist Malays, (known locally as CTs), because the Japs were seen to be throwing off the colonial yoke of the British and they would gain control of the country, having already started a programme of intimidating the villagers with threats and acts of violence.

dat581 26th Jan 2014 01:13

Along the same lines as above the aboriginal peoples if this country should be great full the British colonised Australia instead of any of the other European powers at the time. Have a look at the state of all the non British European colonies around the world and none except maybe New Caladonia come up to scratch. I'd say if any other power turned up all the aboriginals would be dead. Of corse you can't actually say this in public without being screamed at as a racist.

MTOW 26th Jan 2014 01:21

War in Australia (any Oz Politics)
 
And by 20,000 or more Indian troops who switched sides to serve the Japanese in the Indian National Army, some quickly enough to join on the fighting before Singapore fell.They provided many if not most of the guards who guarded the British and Australian POWs at Changi. And they were welcomed back on India after the war as heroes.

Ethel the Aardvark 26th Jan 2014 09:21

Now this thread is heading down the aborigine knocking direction again I hope you all proudly wore your Australia established 1788 t shirts

500N 26th Jan 2014 09:41

"your Australia established 1788 t shirts"

Talk about a storm in a T Cup over nothing.

What if we objected to the Aboriginal flag on a T Shirt,
would that take it down ?

What if Aldi had also had T Shirts with the Aboriginal
flag on them, would the same apply ?

500N 26th Jan 2014 09:44

Ethel
Re "Now this thread is heading down the aborigine knocking direction again"

What is wrong with knocking Aboriginals and what is wrong.

We do it to ourselves.
They do it to themselves
They do it to us.

Are we not allowed to point out failings in society anymore ?

Note - I spend time with Aboriginals and see both the good and bad,
a fair bot caused by Whiteys but not helped by the Abos themselves.

Ken Borough 26th Jan 2014 10:09

It is racial villification (and against the law) to knock racial minorities in a discriminatory way. The same applies to any minority. There are some here who are sailing a bit too close to the wind. := :ugh:

500N 26th Jan 2014 10:16

Ken

"to knock racial minorities in a discriminatory way."

Where have I knocked racial minorities ?

Abo is not a derogatory name, it is an abbreviation of the term Aboriginal
which is what they are called.

They use it (AND black) in front of me so if they use it, how can it be derogatory ?

On the other hand, I can understand the term "Long grassers" being classed as derogatory.

I look forward to your thoughts.

FYI, I'll ask them when I am back up there in a few months what they think.
I had a good discussion a few weeks ago about them using the term "Whitey" !!!

Ken Borough 26th Jan 2014 10:27

500N

The word is unacceptable and detractors slang. You and others may not think that or even mean it to be so but it is. It is offensive. If you don't believe me, DR Google can help you.

It matters not if indigenous Australians refer to us as 'Whiteys' or 'Skips' or any other term of endearment. We are not regarded as a minority, and therefore can't be racially vilified. To use another example: if a bar owner puts a sign in his establishment saying 'This is a gay bar. If you're not gay, we'd prefer you to go elsewhere.', he is not being discriminatory but if he had a sign 'This is a bar for heterosexuals. If you're gay, we'd ratter you go elsewhere', he is discriminatory. Heterosexuals are not a minority group do can't suffer that kind of discriminating that homosexuals may suffer.

Does that make my point any clearer?

500N 26th Jan 2014 10:33

BTW, as a rule, I have found dealing with them to be fine.

You treat them as normal people, respect them and don't talk down to them
and they will do likewise. That also means understanding the hierarchy of
Aboriginal society.

You treat them in an off handish way, they will respond the same way.

Two examples.

I was in Arhnemland on a 7 Safari with two mates from Melbourne.
We had an Aboriginal guide (an old man) and we were hunting on
another clans land, a family group that lived close by.

About 3 - 4 days in, my two mates asked me to ask the White Professional
hunter why the Aboriginal Guide didn't talk to them much where as he spoke
to me quite a bit. I asked and was told straight up that it was because I treated
him as a normal person, always said good morning in the morning, always offered him a smoke, spoke to him in English instead of pigeon english etc.

I honestly hadn't noticed as that is how I deal with all of them but he had noticed and reacted accordingly.

The second occasion, the "family group" had shot a buffalo themselves
but didn't have knives to cut it up and had borrowed one of our knives from the vehicle while we were away. When we got back, they raced over to return it and we offered to help cut it up. When dong so, the White Professional
hunter started at the back end, i hooked in and started at the head.

I took the tongue out and as I did (it is considered a delicacy by Aboriginals), all the kids rushed forwards with wide eyes, hoping for it.

Without thinking, I turned, looked for the old man, (the elder) and gave it to him and he acknowledged the fact, not that I noticed then.

On the way home back to our camp, the White Professional hunter
commented that that was one of the best things I could have done as
it showed respect for his position as elder and it went a long way to
making life easier on all of us according to the PH.

So, people can bandy about that this, that or whatever term is racist
but IMHO, the majority have never spent any time with Aboriginals
and wouldn't know WTF life is like both in cities and in rural outstations
for them.

It's only because so and so has deemed the term to be racist that people say it is.

Adam Goodes today used the word "our mob". It is used a fair bit by Aboriginals I have dealings with.

Personally, I think "our mob" is derogatory but hey, they want to use it, fine, go for it.

Rant over !

Worrals in the wilds 26th Jan 2014 10:38

I think you're on shaky ground re your analogy. You can advertise a venue as gay friendly, but AFAIK specifically excluding heterosexuals contravenes the Act, as would excluding Catholics even though they're the Christian majority by numbers.

Anyway, see you(se) all later, fortunately I'm going bush. So much for a day of celebration; Australia Day always seems to end up in a sweaty, pointless punch-on. :ugh: Worse than bloody NYE.

500N 26th Jan 2014 10:39

OK Ken, I won't call them Abo then, I'll use another term they use that more than Abo and which probably describes them better, Black.

Or are you now going to tell me that using Black is racist ?

I suppose someone is going to say in 5 or 10 years time that TO (Traditonal Owner) is a derogatory term and that we have to change to whatever the latest "in" word is then. (FYI, I think TO is a bad term).

Minority, majority, your (as in my) intent when using a word has far more bearing on it than anything else and what my Aboriginal friends say and think of me carries far more weight than anything else.



rh200 26th Jan 2014 10:52


Does that make my point any clearer?
No it just means your trying to force your viewpoint on every one else. And google has nothing to do with it, its has no shortage of false hoods.

Aborigine is the word for any indiginouse person on any place. Abo is just a shortage for that. The problem with some words its how its used, another words the tone. There are several words to describe "abo's" which are clearly used and have been defined as offensive in their intent. These start with c and and some various other ones.

Whilst the law can be taken a few ways, using "abo" can be also be taken a few ways. Australians have a long history of being lazy and shortning words. People can't just go and invent what they feel is offensive.

500N 26th Jan 2014 11:13

OK Ken, I just looked up a few documents on dealing with Aborigines.
Two of the documents contradicted each other !!!!!

FYI, one of them did say that "Abo" was derogatory and I know it
is seen in that way by some so I will acknowledge that, I was being
a bit pig headed.

However, have a read of what I have copied from the document below.

"The Aboriginal English words ‘blackfella’ and ‘whitefellaare
used by Indigenous Australian people all over the country

some communities also use ‘yellafella’ and ‘coloured’. Although"
less appropriate, people should respect the acceptance and use
of these terms, and consult the local Indigenous community or
Yunggorendi for further advice.

Then it says (and this is a direct quote)
More appropriate
• Aboriginal people/s, Indigenous people/s, and Torres
Strait Islander people/s
• Culture groups
Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people understand their
own history and identity, and recognise that physical features do
not determine Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander ancestry.
Less appropriate
• ‘Part-aborigine’, ‘full-blood’, ‘half-caste’, ‘quarter-caste’,
‘octoroon’, ‘mulatto’, ‘hybrid’"

Now, I hear EVERY DAY "‘Part-aborigine’, ‘full-blood’, ‘half-caste’"
used by them.


I mean, they and you talk about derogatory words, then you see this
in the documents"The fact is that Indigenous Australia is multicultural. Australia before the
invasion
was comprised of 200-300 autonomous language groups ........."
Er, Invasion ?????
Talk about offensive to some :rolleyes:
The whole thing is a load of BS, a bloody mine field so I go by what MY Aboriginal friends say is OK.

dat581 26th Jan 2014 11:22

Well Ken you are pushing the usual leftard line that you can only be racist if you are white. Thus any minority can say whatever they like but not White Australians. If your from Cabrimatta and Asian and celebrate being australian that's great. If your white and from Cronulla and feel the same your a racist. The same tired old leftist politics of division.

parabellum 26th Jan 2014 11:28


It matters not if indigenous Australians refer to us as 'Whiteys' or 'Skips' or any other term of endearment. We are not regarded as a minority, and therefore can't be racially vilified.

Utter tosh Ken, the size of your gang makes no difference, if it is racially offensive it counts, doesn't matter if you are David or Goliath.

500N 26th Jan 2014 11:34

Ken

"It matters not if indigenous Australians refer to us as 'Whiteys' or 'Skips' or any other term of endearment. We are not regarded as a minority, and therefore can't be racially vilified."

That is the biggest load of horse shyte I have ever read.

First, "It matters not if indigenous Australians refer to us as 'Whiteys' or 'Skips' or any other term of endearment."

So, an "indigenous Australians" referring to me as a 'Whiteys' or 'Skips'
is a " term of endearment" but not if I refer to them as "Blacky"

FFS, you can't have it both ways mate.

So you have to be in the minority to be racially villified so you ?

So does that mean I can call Yanks Yanks, whatever they are Spics or Specs,
The French Frogs, the Germans Krauts, the British Poms, The Australians Aussies and the New Zealanders Kiwis since they are all in the majority ?????????

No wonder people's heads are spinning with all this PC BS.


Since you suggested Google, not Google is going to turn up the right documents, see this from Wiki.

It does NOT mention anywhere the word MINORITY.

It also says it is NOT about name calling but causing others to hate .....
read it below.

So, I don't think I have racially villified anyone, I might not have used words
that everyone thinks are appropriate but well, we will agree to disagree.


"Racial vilification is the term in the legislation of Australia that refers to a public act that encourages or incites others to hate people because of their race, nationality, country of origin, colour or ethnic origin[citation needed].


Public acts of this type are illegal according to e.g., the Racial Vilification Act 1996 of South Australia.


Vague provisions of the law that criminalise racial vilification caused criticism.



In 2006 a controversy sparkled over a court decision not to prosecute an Australian aborigine girl according to the Vilification Act for calling someone "white slut". Critics classified this as an example of reverse discrimination, while Attorney-General of Western Australia Jim McGinty commented that "The laws are not about cracking down on name calling. What they are about is racial hatred in the most vile and serious of manners." [1]"

500N 26th Jan 2014 11:42

Ken

FYI, while reading both documents i quoted from, BOTH documents
state that the term "indigenous Australians" (the term used above)
should not be used but instead indigenous Australian peoples"
should be used.

Quote

No more classifying people
More appropriate
• Indigenous Australian peoples
• Aboriginal peoples

So suggest you get your own terminology correct first before trying to jump down my throat.

And looking at the way the word "Aboriginal" or derivatives is used
by a few of us here, we are all "wrong" in the way we are using it !!!


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