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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

Howard Hughes 23rd Feb 2012 07:20


But those of us on wages will all be working for three bucks a day, no penalties and no say at all, because that's the 'flexible work solution' all their little mining and commerce buddies want.
Erm... Did you not just witness what happened at Qantas? 'Fair Work' (sic) Australia I believe it's called!

The ALP are completely incompetent, the Greens are a don't-go-there so we're left with no viable option. They should print the ballot papers up with a box marked 'none, because they all suck.'
We will not be a truly democratic nation until we have the right not to vote!:ok:

Fliegenmong 23rd Feb 2012 07:40

"there's still opportunity to launch attacks on Abbott."

Of course it could not ever just be because of Abbott could it? Oohh noooo

WITW has it, summed up quite nicely indeed.....pete reith rubbing his hands together in anticipation now...attack dogs at the ready

A lot of people still terrified of Work No Choices....I know abbott tore up the paper and all the rest....but you just never know with abbott when it is a gospel truth or not do you? :=

I bet BB & The Leprechaun can hardly contain themselves....:uhoh:

Or say Rudd did get up.......Abbott falls further behind.....the Libs change leader to Turnbull.......That may be a little healthier state of affairs

Oh wait no the Libs would never do anything as unconscionable as knife a leader :p

Worrals in the wilds 23rd Feb 2012 08:11


Erm... Did you not just witness what happened at Qantas? 'Fair Work' (sic) Australia I believe it's called!
Absolutely. It was a disgraceful of a Labor goverment to capitulate to that collection of incompetent spivs. I thought Keating was right; the government should have stayed out of it and left them to flounder. With friends like these etc. etc... however, the Libs would have done exactly the same thing.

Anyway, the Qantas dispute threads probably have their own dedicated server in PPRuNeland and I've contributed enough on the subject already (one of the QF PR poppets referred to me and Sunfish as 'resident insomniacs', which I was kind of pround of ;)).

Straw poll for the fun of it...
Say you are a Caucus member and had to vote on Monday. Local issues aside, who would you vote for? Jools or Krudd?
Me, Gillard (albiet grudgingly).

Others?

Buster Hyman 23rd Feb 2012 08:15

Nothing to see...move along.... http://smiliesftw.com/x/roflmao.gif

sisemen 23rd Feb 2012 08:25


....but you just never know with abbott when it is a gospel truth or not do you?
I'll take that as a comment! At least with Jooliar you absolutely KNOW that when she opens her mouth it's not gospel truth :eek:


who would you vote for? Jools or Gillard?
Doesn't really matter. They're done for whichever they choose.

Worrals in the wilds 23rd Feb 2012 08:29

True. I think the rest of them realise that. Maybe they could do a cage fight or something; at least that would be entertaining.

Fliegenmong 23rd Feb 2012 08:41

It's a bloody great relief from seeing Campbell & Anna I can tell you that!

:bored:

Worrals in the wilds 23rd Feb 2012 08:53

Yeah, but it's given Anna an excuse should she be annhilated...it was all the Feds' fault! :*

Fliegenmong 23rd Feb 2012 08:57

Yeah true....and that's a shame.....
And God help the State if 'One term' Ron runs....after the fiasco of his mayoralty here

CoodaShooda 23rd Feb 2012 11:01

Having problems with your mayors, Fleigs?

Ours is being sentenced on Monday, having been found guilty of assaulting his neighbours with a golf club. ( Potential mandatory gaol sentence, despite the broader community feeling sympathy as he had the neighbours from hell.)

His deputy is being spoken to by Police following complaints from a couple of school girls that they regularly see him parading around his place naked when they walk to school.

We're only a month away from local gummint elections, so their colleagues elected a retiring alderman as the temporary mayor. But now he's donned the robes and chains, he's reconsidering his retirement plans.

I'm starting to wonder whether democracy wasn't invented by a Greek practical joker.

Lex Talionis 23rd Feb 2012 11:22


I'll take that as a comment! At least with Jooliar you absolutely KNOW that when she opens her mouth it's not gospel truth
That is the exact problem we face.Very true that with both Rudd and Gillard we know we are not getting the gospel truth but with Tony Abbott we won't know until after we find out we have been shafted.A case of the devil you know :=

Absolutely. It was a disgraceful of a Labor goverment to capitulate to that collection of incompetent spivs. I thought Keating was right; the government should have stayed out of it and left them to flounder. With friends like these etc. etc... however, the Libs would have done exactly the same thing.
Agreed,Keating was right and the Government should have called the Irishmans bluff and within a week or fortnight at worst the board would have called for his resignation.

I'd say that there are probably a lot of Australian embassy staff around the world relieved that Kev is not Foreign Minister any longer.

I'd also say it's fair to say that at this very moment the mining company execs are smiling while quaffing a very smooth cognac and enjoying a nice cigar.

CoodaShooda 23rd Feb 2012 11:54


A case of the devil you know
Lex

It's a big ask for the electorate to re-elect a mob that is widely perceived as being the worst government Australia has ever had; Whitlam, Fraser and McMahon notwithstanding.

Gillard is well aware of this and her hope has been to turn things around over the next 18 months. While the theory is politically sound, on their collective performance since 2007, I'd suggest this is a big ask.

I doubt many of us are viewing an Abbott government with rose coloured glasses. But it's got to the stage where the majority of voters seem to be saying "anyone but labor/greens".

More than a few are no doubt saying "How can we trust labor's claims that Abbott is bad, when they've lied about so much else?"

Forget the carbon tax lie, just look at what Team Gillard has been trotting out in the last 36 hours compared with their statements over the past 5 years.

Smith seems to be the only senior Minister with a skerrick of common sense in his public utterings. But I'm expecting his ongoing mistreatment of Commodore Kafer (sp?) will eventually come back to bite him if he puts his head above the parapet.

The damage to the labor brand is not currently coming from the Rudd side.

david1300 23rd Feb 2012 12:15

Worrals - help me please
 
@ Worrals - please explain this to me: "...Straw poll for the fun of it...
Say you are a Caucus member and had to vote on Monday. Local issues aside, who would you vote for? Jools or Gillard?
Me, Gillard (albiet grudgingly)."


Aren't Jools and Gillard one and the same? Or is it now that the really real Juliar (I will never lie to the electorate again) is going to emerge from the trainwreck.

Maybe that's the problem we are facing - whether it's KRudd or Juliar, there is no real difference - all deceit and dishonesty anyway.

Lancelot37 23rd Feb 2012 12:21

Wouldn't it be best fo Australia if Gillard gets in? She is hated so much that Labour will be kicked out next year, hopefully.

Worrals in the wilds 23rd Feb 2012 12:36

D'oh and double d'oh. http://images.ibsrv.net/ibsrv/res/sr...s/embarass.gif Call it a Freudian slip, but yeah, you got me. Thanks and edited accordingly. Blame either my own personal bias creeping in or the cut price plonk Bipolar Nicola wants to put an end to. Maybe that's not such a bad thing... :}

I'd say that there are probably a lot of Australian embassy staff around the world relieved that Kev is not Foreign Minister any longer.
Not to mention RAAFies, airport staff and anyone else who has had the displeasure of dealing with the man. The trouble with being an arrogant jerk in Australia is that word leaks out very quickly, because there's only one degree of separation. Everyone knows a bloke. That's why most pollies, singers, movie stars and other b grade celebutards make sure they mind their manners. Not our Rudd though, he's far too important for that. :ooh:


I'd also say it's fair to say that at this very moment the mining company execs are smiling while quaffing a very smooth cognac and enjoying a nice cigar.
I'm sure they are, and that's neither the fault of the Libs or the electorate, or even the fault of the mining companies. Their goals are clear; dig stuff up and make money out of it. Use three dollar a day minions where the country's law allows it, otherwise pay the minimum allowed by local government and adhere to their pesky safety regulations as required. It's not the fault of the Libs, who have a clear 'pro big business' manifesto. Can't blame them for that, they make no secret of it.

IMO it's the fault of the current ALP, who have alienated everyone but the true fundamentalists. They can only run the 'vote for us cos the others are worse' argument for so long, before the majority say 'well, you may be right but we'll give it a shot, because you leave us with no alternative.'

I believe we're about to see that in Queensland. No-one (even their own true believers) likes the opposition all that much because they're not very likeable; no-one thinks they'll be very good, but equally, Labor have blown it so very badly that people will take that chance. When even people who go to work draped in Eureka flags are feeling ripped off, betrayed and used...you know there's trouble in the camp. Asset sales that were sprung on the state the day after the election; a public service hamstrung by incompetent Labor flunky appointments, money wasted on trendy shite while the Royal Brisbane Hospital struggles along with radiography machines out of the stone age and waiting lists for the waiting list administered by people who still don't know if they'll get paid this fortnight thanks to the payroll debacle...these are the legacies of Qld Labor.

They are also the legacies of a hopeless conservative opposition who preferred to spend their time knifing each other than coming up with a viable alternative, so make no mistake, they're equally culpable.

Maybe annihilation at the polls is the only way the ALP will realise that they've lost touch.

Maybe even after that they won't get it, because the ALP machine is now dominated by flunkies, advisors and other straight out of uni types who went into the machine a week after graduating. With a few notable exceptions, the last generation of real union organizers (ie people who worked in real jobs in real industries before getting involved) are now in their mid fifties and being marginalized by professional agitators. There's nothing wrong with having a degree but there's a lot wrong with being a professional politician, ie someone who has done nothing else. That's what we're seeing on both sides, and aren't they ugly. :ouch:

Ever met any of 'em? I'm sure most of you have and from both sides of the house, whether local, state or federal. Aren't they babes in the woods? Aren't they koalas (not to be exported or shot at :E)? Don't they have a wide eyed stare every time someone brings up something relevant, bit of an 'Oh wow, what's that mean? Where's my aide to rescue me, this irritating person is asking difficult questions about stuff that happens outside the chamber' look? Of course in a matter of seconds the aide races in, removes the MP from difficulty and their sweet little world continues on its axis, while our dingy little world continues with the same problems. The MP pats him or herself on the back for 'consulting with the electorate' and the hoi polloi are left with an even sourer taste in their mouths.

They have all made themselves an irrelevance, the elected oligarchy who choose to become politicians in their late teenage years and for the most part, have done nothing else.

Fliegenmong 23rd Feb 2012 13:12

I'd say you're not far off the mark Lex...

Cooda, me old :ok:

That sounds truly territorian!!

Wrote to Ron 2 weeks ago....Told him his was the worst since Dennis O'Connell.......

radeng 23rd Feb 2012 14:23

As a Pom, it sounds to me as if you guys in Oz have got our problem - trying to decide which lot of pollys is the least bad.

Fareastdriver 23rd Feb 2012 16:05

Isn't that the problem with any democratic country?

RJM 23rd Feb 2012 18:28

We're lucky in the sense that despite the ridiculous goings-on in Canberra, we have huge holes in the ground full of iron ore of which China will buy as much as we can shovel into ships. Even our hopeless ALP minority government hasn't been able to screw that up.

Andu 23rd Feb 2012 20:22

Worrasls, re your last post: do you have a bug planted in my living room?

You've made some very valid points there. In particular, we should borrow a rule from the ancient Greeks and the Romans: no one should be allowed to serve as a member of parliament before he or she has
(a) reached a minimum age (in today's world, I'd suggest 40) and
(b) passed a set number of hurdles (in today's world, I'd suggest holding a job in private enterprise for a few years would be one such hurdle)

...oh, and (c) one last rule, the 'slam the stable door after the horse has bolted' rule): under no circumstances should any woman be allowed to serve as a member of parliament if her name is Sarah Hanson-Young. :ok:

tinpis 23rd Feb 2012 21:32

Parliamentary pensions should be means tested. Same as my miserable stipend bloody well is

criticalmass 23rd Feb 2012 22:42

I watched Rudd's presser when he landed in Brissy. That wasn't a speech about leadership of a party; that was an unashamed election campaign speech.

Would Rudd be prepared to resign and potentially bring down the Labor government, resulting in a new federal election?

alisoncc 23rd Feb 2012 22:57

Australian politics has got to the point where you don't vote for the person who will do the most good for the country, you vote for the person who will do the least harm. Within that context Gillard, Abbott and Brown have no chance.

frigatebird 23rd Feb 2012 23:01

Fliegs, Worrals, love the passion and the penmanship.... shows you're interested in the outcomes....and you express MY thoughts so well....:ok:
No matter how turned off by the shenanigans, I could never NOT mark a ballot paper, even if I have to eschew the major parties on occasion..

Can't help thinking that some Cousins in the Republican Party in the U.S. must be feeling similar, as they select THEIR next party figurehead - but at greater expense than the Party-Politicians-Select-Their-Own-Leader System in effect here. (All the while in full public view tho..)

Andu, if you ever need a seconder for bringing back those Roman rules, then just show me where to sign.

CoodaShooda 23rd Feb 2012 23:47

Ladies and Gentlemen

May I remind you that this is an Australian Politics Hampster Wheel.

There is no place here for broad and general agreement. :p


PS Is anyone else missing some of our past, regular contributors? :O

david1300 24th Feb 2012 00:19

@Worrals - thanks. Although I suspect that we may have some differing political opinions, I really appreciated your last post (sorry, make that latest post - I don't mean to inadvertently bump you off).

tinpis 24th Feb 2012 00:32

Wish I could write like this

Labor has been reduced to its miserable parts a mewling, puking party with no coherent leadership, no record of achievement. Nothing but spite and bile and self-interest. _____Piers Akerman

sisemen 24th Feb 2012 00:54

I find it astonishing that the level of bile and vitriol keeps rising by the hour. The ALP is certainly on a course for self-destruction - if it hasn't reached that stage already. Ultimately this is not good for a democratic Australia. And God forbid that the watermelons take over the role as second party.

It makes one wonder how it was that so many people trusted this lot of incompetents with the running of the country.

I'm now starting to feel angry at what they are doing, not amused and entertained as I was before. :mad:

Worrals in the wilds 24th Feb 2012 01:36

No dramas david, and thanks. :)
Good quote, Tinpis, sums up the current state and federal mobs very well, unfortunately.
"PS Is anyone else missing some of our past, regular contributors?"
It usually takes them a few days to rock up. I don't think they're normally 'every day' PPRuNers.

Flying Binghi 24th Feb 2012 04:03

Brisbane airport excitement...
 
.

Happy supporter.....

http://blogs.news.com.au/images/uplo...manonevote.jpg





Daily Telegraph Tim Blair Blog


.

rh200 24th Feb 2012 05:30

I think the GG should sack them, and bring on an election and let the people decide. I'm sure the Libs get back in, as the people will be thinking when you sort yourselves out you can have another go.

Abbott may be as boring as batsh!t and not lingistically gifted, but I think he would most likely be ok. Frankly I not into all these grand vision "gunna" types. Most of the anti Abbott stuff is hype.

Howard Hughes 24th Feb 2012 08:00


Straw poll for the fun of it...
Say you are a Caucus member and had to vote on Monday. Local issues aside, who would you vote for? Jools or Krudd?
Me, Gillard (albiet grudgingly).
As much as I don't like Prime Minister Gillard, if I was placed in that unenviable situation I would probably vote for her. I think Mr Rudd will be trounced on Monday, if he even shows up!

Next step will be resignation and by-election, despite what he is saying to the contrary, he is going to 'stick it up her' anyway he can.:ok:

I hope for the future of the Labour party they don't go with Shorten in the future, otherwise it will be more of the same.:rolleyes:

I think the GG should sack them, and bring on an election and let the people decide.
The Governor General should have withheld assent long ago on some of their policies, he (as it says in the Constitution) also should have stepped in when clearly we ended up with a Government that we did not vote for.

Sadly this GG has been asleep at the wheel...:{

alisoncc 24th Feb 2012 09:00


Straw poll for the fun of it...
Say you are a Caucus member and had to vote on Monday. Local issues aside, who would you vote for? Jools or Krudd?
Kevin. Gillard is so two faced I find it hard to believe anything she says, and Rudd is the only chance the country has to keep Abbott out. Turnbull I would vote for if he led the opposition.

Frank Arouet 24th Feb 2012 09:42

The GG is very well aware of the state of affairs and it will come to bite her on the bum in due course for her conflicts of family and duty. Perhaps Great Britain should invade Australia like they did in Ther Falklands if the Queen's representative isn't up to the job?

I hope Gillard wins. Abbott then will definitely win the next election.

Abbott is the only bloke promising an election to decide the minority government business. If Gillard and the Independants were game they'd do the same. But they're gutless.

If anyone wants a better government and can't bring themselves to vote for Abbott, just vote for the Greens like last time. That should ensure a total clusterfkuc.

Good luck to you all, I'm thinking of becoming a Kiwi.

radeng 24th Feb 2012 09:58

Surprised no one has mentioned something called

"Krud Kutter brand biodegradable stain removers"

Maybe Joolyah could do with that.....

Fliegenmong 24th Feb 2012 10:06

I fail to see how this bunch clowns, who can see how much more popular Rudd is than Jools so blindly side with her....(Publicly at least), I mean do they so desperately wish to return to the opposition benches?

I live in fear of abbott and the faceless Libs though......that is a scary thing, a deeply disturbing thing.

The punishment the 'Born to Rule' bunch will dish out on the Aust. populace for ever voting them out in the first place will be extreme....

What do you suppose they may call it?? The Pineapple agreement? Well, we won't know about it at all until after the election will we? Just like There'll never be a carbon tax, or never ever a GST.

No doubt Tone will tell us he has a mandate to insert said Pineapple agreement as hard and fast as he can...even though it was dead and buried and absolutely gone forever and for good.

I had lunch out on the verandah today with a few of the younger crowd (I'm less than 40 OK.... Just... but less) I guess they're mid 20s I suppose, one male one female. If it weren't for the current soap opera, the conversation would never have turned to politics, but when it did, to say I was stunned at their ignorance, of A) who and what, B) our political system, would be a very big understatement,................and they vote!!!!!......And if they are like that there must be others!, many others!...and these were educated bright kids who call ME old!!

Both had never heard of my mate The Mad Hatter! Since rectified :E

On the 24th March Bob may well allow me the pleasure of casting a vote neither for the remarkably inept bunch of idiots here now, or for the undoubtedly equally as inept bunch that most unsuccessfully try to convince me otherwise.

Andu 24th Feb 2012 10:10

Am I the only one who feels that all the main players in Labor are living in what amounts to a parallel universe? I get the feeling that 70% or more of the Australian population simply doesn't give a tuppeny you-know-what who leads Labor - it just doesn't matter; whoever runs Labor, it's still the same slow motion train wreck heading inexorably towards the collapsed (very high) bridge. (However, I spent some time in Campbelltown yesterday and I think I may have crossed paths with quite a few of the other 30%. Talk about 'parallel universes'!!)

I share the grave misgivings others have expressed of William Shorten Esq. He's like a rat with a diamond tooth, and to me, he represents everything that's wrong with Australian politics today - a professional union rep/politician who's never held a real job in his life. I think my earlier comment about anyone aspiring to hold political office being required to have achieved a minimum number of 'ticks in the required box' of life experiences is one we as a nation should aspire to (not that will ever happen - it would gut the very heart out of the ranks of the parliamentary office holders of both major Parties, in particular Labor).

Wiley 24th Feb 2012 10:19

Fliegenmong, I was speaking with my uncle from Queensland yesterday and he expressed very similar concerns to the ones you mentioned - the absolute ignorance of politics of so many people - people who get to vote thanks tour crazy mandatory voting system.

He said he was amazed at the number of people he'd run across who thought Bob Katter was a candidate in the coming Queensland State election. And as I said, al these people get to vote.

JB Mods 24th Feb 2012 11:07

david1300 please re-post your last comment without the personal dig at the end. That is the way these threads start to go downhill and then get locked so don't do it.

david1300 24th Feb 2012 11:15

Thanks for the guidance.:ok: Will do a little later :)


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