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parabellum 23rd Nov 2012 02:00

Target shooters, hunters etc. etc. can get a licence, a pistol licence can be obtained but takes lots of hoops. Personally have a mint condition .303 #4 Mk2 and a 1908 Carl Gustafs Stads 6.5x55mm, both shoot beautifully and I have plenty of ammunition too! All locked up and separated out etc. Casual ownership of unlicensed weapons is illegal though.

Buster Hyman 23rd Nov 2012 03:22

Gotta laugh at The Age. They are finally reporting the PM's Slater & Gordon debacle, but are not allowing a comments section. They're also running a report card on the State Liberal Govt. with a very popular comments section. Free speech? My arse!!!

Worrals in the wilds 23rd Nov 2012 04:48

Delicate little petals, aren't they. :rolleyes:
That said, I find that most of the online newspaper comment sites I've tried to read rapidly descend into troll fests, with the ALP and Liberal trolls bashing each other with inane insults. I get the impression that like talkback radio, most of the time no matter which paper, it's the same trolls. :bored:

I suppose they keep some derranged people happy and safe at home (rather than staggering around the streets muttering :}) but I never find much worth reading in them. Can anyone recommend any sane ones? :8


Those of you who did need to figure out a way to get that fundamental right back, if you ask me, which I acknowledge, you didn't.
I have a firearms license and it's not too much hassle. Paperwork, criminal check and a half day safety course will get you a basic license in Qld. IMO most of the community are in favour of this level of control, though there is a bit of argy bargy about semi automatic weapons.

What's also important to remember is that Australians don't have 'rights'. There is no Bill of Rights and neither the federal nor the state Constitutions provide them either. Even many Australians don't realise this.

sisemen 23rd Nov 2012 06:28


That said, I find that most of the online newspaper comment sites I've tried to read rapidly descend into troll fests, with the ALP and Liberal trolls bashing each other with inane insults. I get the impression that like talkback radio, most of the time no matter which paper, it's the same trolls.
So that's where they went to :E

CoodaShooda 23rd Nov 2012 06:33


Australians don't have 'rights'
Other than those that apply under all those UN Declarations we signed up to. :E

And. apparently, the right of any left leaning person to seek compensation for being offended by the views of a right leaning person...........

Sorry, that should be the right of anyone who considers they have been discriminated against to seek redress.

Possibly not in the constitution but certainly enshrined in law.

Worrals in the wilds 23rd Nov 2012 10:05

That's still 'proposed'. :E My hope is that a few of the union heavy lawyers will explain to Bipolar how this may impact on their operations (using pictures and a Law For Dummies guide) and the whole thing will quietly fade away. :suspect::}

The UN never trumps local law. If they get massively annoyed they can throw a country out, but apart from that all they can do is grumble. The UN has no actual legal control over a member state.

As for laws; whether about discrimination or other matters they can be rescinded by parliament. This is different from Rights, which IIRC can only be rescinded by referendum. We don't have those.

sisemen 23rd Nov 2012 14:13

Having watched Lateline tonight I kinda got the impression that it's another one of those swings.

Gillard seems to be very much on the back foot again following her 'triumph' of the mysoginist speech; Bowen looks totally like yesterday's man with his continuation of the totally f**ked up immigrant policy; and Abbott looked like he'd got his mojo back.

MTOW 23rd Nov 2012 21:55

She'll never go willingly, so it will be interesting to see how the faceless men of Sussex Street engineer the change of leader in such a way as to to force her to go. (Maybe one of those missing files will turn up with hard evidence so damning it can't be ignored?)

What will be even more interesting will be to see whether the currently developing in so many ways investigations of her "young and naive" period continue after she's gone. If there's no flame involved with all that smoke we're seeing, that's one hell of a smoke generator someone's got out there!

I find myself asking: "If they roll her, where will she go?" About the only place I can think that's twisted (and crooked?) enough to take her in is the UN, where she might be able to do a Helen Clarke, although, even that's debatable, as most people there would need an interpreter to understand her **unique** form of spoken English.

I suppose she could always spend her time writing her memoirs. Now wouldn't they be interesting?

CoodaShooda 23rd Nov 2012 23:24

I think the ABC starting to run an 'unhelpful to Gillard' line will become regarded as the tipping point in the AWU affair. (Bill Leak's cartoon of Gillard placing Leigh Sales on her list of misogynist nut jobs is a classic.)

However, if her involvement in the slush fund does lead to police charges, I assume it will be along the lines of 'conspiracy to defraud'. Such a charge, if laid, would presumably take quite some time to bring to court - well past the next election.

I'd suggest the best scenario for labor, if police announce they are investigating her actions in the affair, would be to have Gillard declare her innocence and willingness to co-operate fully with the police but to step aside as PM while the police complete their enquiries.

If she toughs it out, the ongoing taint of suspicion will impact further on the build-up to the election and potentially bring down a house of cards that appears to be occupied by Roxon and Shorten too.

If the police announce they have no reason to investigate her in this matter, she can legitimately claim to have been vindicated - but the less charitably inclined voter will still find fault in her unwillingness to have provided straightforward answers when the matters were first raised by McClelland et al.

At present, I can't see her taking labor to the next election; although, if I was a Liberal/National supporter, I'd be wishing she does.

sisemen 24th Nov 2012 00:24

With McTernan pulling her strings I would imagine that the scenes in the PMs office right now would resemble something like the opening scene in this.....


Clare Prop 24th Nov 2012 03:34


Croozin 24th Nov 2012 05:07

I can't understand why thousands of AWU members aren't screaming from the rooftops demanding their money back. Are they so rusted on Labor that they'll accept that they've been robbed and do nothing about it for fear that it will damage the Pardee?

With Royal Commissions popping up everwhere, maybe we can forget about the AWU imbroglio for a moment (or at least put it on the back burner) and consider if Kevin Rudd's and even Barbi Bryce's reputations will survive if the Heiner affair is ever properly investigated. From what little I've read about it, the old Goss Queensland Labor Government's got at least as much to answer for as the Catholic Church has.

Clare Prop 24th Nov 2012 06:09

Maybe because these workers have been told what will happen to them if they step out of line.

I know what it's like to have a shop steward bail me up by the throat against a hot packing machine and threaten to burn my house down because I wouldn't join the union. I didn't give in to it and like all vicious, pathetic, stupid bullies they were so confused that someone had stood up for themselves against them that they never quite knew what to do with me after that and left me alone.

But most people who worked in that place were too scared to speak up and risk their personal safety like I did.

I have yet to be convinced that there is any need whatsoever for unions in this day and age with all the legislation that we have in place now.

Worrals in the wilds 24th Nov 2012 09:26


I know what it's like to have a shop steward bail me up by the throat against a hot packing machine and threaten to burn my house down because I wouldn't join the union.
The people who give the union movement a thoroughly bad name. :yuk: Gotta ask; was it in Australia?


I have yet to be convinced that there is any need whatsoever for unions in this day and age with all the legislation that we have in place now.
We can agree to disagree :). The unions got a lot of that legislation in, and without them (or another form of worker collectivism) I believe those privileges would be quietly whittled away in the name of shareholder profit and 'efficiency'. Until the early eighties construction companies budgeted for fatalities. That no longer happens (in the west, anyway :() and is no longer considered acceptable. The eighties wasn't all that long ago.

Buildings still get built, stuff still gets constructed and many construction companies still make zillions (and good luck to them) so the fatalities can't have been all that necessary. Even in nice companies (and many companies are nice) middle managers sometimes come up with crazy lil' ideas that make their budget look better and threaten the health and safety of their workers. They didn't usually mean that to happen, but these days a lot of middle managers are small picture people (My Bonus! My Budget! There's a musical in that :}:}) and a bit real world deficient. A friendly visit from the union complete with selected bits of legislation tends to help them see the flaw in their argument. No picket required. :cool:

Cookies must be enabled | Herald Sun
In tonight's news, the Newman government has 'backed away' from this report. I believe the ETU's response and mobilisation has been a key part of that, particularly with respect to reliability issues and infrastructure maintenance.


Most employers don't have a big punch on with their unions. Most agreements get agreed to with a bit of argy-bargy and don't end up with lockouts and picket lines on the 6pm news. Most of the time, unions and business work together and figure it all out. Of course that doesn't make the news; 'today, Smith Logistics and the TWU came to an agreement after compromising about overtime rates and a new mould-free tea room'. Boring...:bored::} As an example, the recent Leighton's lockout at the Royal Brisbane Hospital made front page news. The resultant return to work a few days later was on about page five. :zzz:

I've been dudded by union reps before, though not to the extent you were :sad:. However, bad eggs don't make the whole egg factory rotten. Bad eggs need to be found and thrown away so the producer's reputation doesn't suffer. There's been too little of that, and the movement is reaping what they sowed through laziness and complacency. There are parallels with the churches wrt abuse.

Where I think the movement has strayed most is in becoming the feeder rank for the ALP. I don't mean people who work, get into the movement and then stand for politics, but these people who become union organizers as a job (without actually doing the 'job' first :hmm:) and then got springboarded into the Labor Party. First and foremost, Trade Unions should be about worker rights. Second and secondmost, third and thirdmost...you get the idea. :} When people start seeing it as a back door into politics and the movement accepts that, then the problems start and everyone involved starts looking very fake.

Those problems are now very much in the public eye and IMO they have a lot to do with the ALP currently being about as popular as herpes (at least with herpes you had a good time somewhere along the line :\). That doesn't mean the movement is irrelevant or invalid, but IMO it does mean that a bit of spring cleaning is in order. Right about now. :hmm:

sisemen 24th Nov 2012 16:09

It would seem that we may be in for an interesting week in politics.

The Opposition has promised that they will be pursuing the Gillard 'slush fund' corruption with vigour. And it would seem that the ABC with it's new found conscience will follow it up.

Gillard, surely, will have to make a statement in Parliament before the end of the Parliamentary Session. And if she does and she lies and is proven to lie (don't forget that there are documents and witnesses reappearing daily) then she's gone. Even some of her Ministers, let alone the back bench, are starting to get nervous.

Could this be the Kevvy Come Back? It will give some very entertaining election advertising if he does make it.

MTOW 24th Nov 2012 21:04


And if she does and she lies and is proven to lie
She's a lawyer. Not a very good one, it would seem, but a lawyer none the less, so I doubt she'll make such a basic mistake as that. Instead, stand by for convoluted, self-serving statements so complex and looooong in avoiding giving a straight answer that they will make Bill Clinton's infamous speech on the meaning of the word "is" during the Lewinski affair (sorry, couldn't think of another word than 'affair') pale into insignificance.

We may be hearing things along these lines as well: "Eye dyd not have ... (pick an inappropriate action - quite a few to choose from) wif that man, Mr (pick a name, any name - there are apparently quite a few to choose from)".

I don't think it will be the Libs who nail her, but Labor, but they'll only be nailing her because of the Libs' effective campaign. Julie Bishop's stocks have risen quite high over the way she's handled herself in this matter. A few years ago, I thought of her as accident prone and a real lightweight. Unlike so many on the government benches, she's improved with experience, to the point where I wouldn't be surprised if there weren't some in the Lib ranks who see her as a possible leadership candidate to take the wind completely out of Labor's 'misogynist' attacks.

Worrals in the wilds 24th Nov 2012 21:50

Yeah, Bishop's been good.
Of course she's also a lawyer and unlike Gillard, Bishop was a barrister, so she's used to appearing in court and cross examining people.

Laurie Oakes was in major deflection mode yesterday (column summarised as 'never mind this week in politics, let's not talk about that. How about a referendum'? :suspect::suspect:) When Laurie starts deflecting it's a sure sign that the ALP are getting nervous.

Could this be the Kevvy Come Back? It will give some very entertaining election advertising if he does make it.
How on earth could they trust him though? He leaks like a colander and throws tanties when he doesn't get his own way. My hunch is that if it comes to a leadership challenge they'd find someone bland and inoffensive.

CoodaShooda 24th Nov 2012 22:36

Bruce Wilson coming out and saying that she's blameless doesn't appear to have placated the baying mob. But it has given the support group something to latch on to.

Demonising Blewitt only throws doubt on Wilson's claims and keeps the story near the front page. Which conman to believe?

Looks like this has a way to go yet.

Captain Sand Dune 25th Nov 2012 00:29


Bruce Wilson coming out and saying that she's blameless
Well then, game over then folks!! If Bruce Wilson says she's blameless then it must be true.:hmm:
Julia B has got her sights squarely on Juliar. Should be an interesting week coming up.

Baying Mob Member

Andu 25th Nov 2012 05:07

Lead item on Channel 10 news tonight - "NOT a bomb threat" as two men described as "radical Muslims" are arrested by police at a Sydney mosque, where, according to the same report, major problems have been simmering between two separate Muslim groups "for some time". (I'm guessing here, but could differing Syrian loyalties be at the root of these "differences"?)

"Nothing to be seen here. Move along."


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