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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

Ovation 24th Sep 2012 02:40


Mmmmmm, you need to stop following Andrew Bolt's blog and check the reality.
Andrew who? Don't have time for Bolt any more. Too busy reading all about Union embezzlement at michaelsmithnews.com and Gillard's attraction to married men PickeringPOST, with names on the list than most never knew of.

Anyway, I'm sorry to burst your bubble Owen, but my information comes from a close friend, ex Petty Officer RAN (retired), then with AFP, then finally with APS. He was a senior APS officer at Adelaide airport until he finally retired.

He did many flights escorting failed asylum seekers back to their home country, back in the days when there was such a thing as border security. Where you you then Owen?

Perhaps somebody would like to post some figures pertaining to overstays VS asylum claims who arrived by AIR. Owen? Anybody?

hellsbrink 24th Sep 2012 02:55


Australia is large enough to welcome all immigrants, no matter what their mode of transport is.
How much of the country is habitable?

CoodaShooda 24th Sep 2012 03:02


How much of the country is habitable?
Pretty much all of it, if you have the money to burn and ignore any prior claims to ownership.

hellsbrink 24th Sep 2012 03:14

So that means a huge lump of it isn't habitable, Cooda, since it's desert or rainforest and there isn't the infrastructure, etc, there to support "civilised" habitation and that won't be there for decades IF they had the nerve to try and say they were going to start making it habitable. That is IF someone could figure out where all the water, food and 'leccy would come from to support such a rapidly growing population....

Unless, of course, Owen is suggesting that the immigrants get dumped in the desert with no leccy, water, sewerage, food, etc. There's 18% of the landmass they could have.......

owen meaney 24th Sep 2012 03:16


but my information comes from a close friend, ex Petty Officer RAN
Well that ends the discussion then:E

Where you you then Owen?
Probably Somalia, or depending on the year, Iraq.

There are "empty" towns all over rural Australia.
Clive Palmer said it best, let them in and put them to work.

prospector 24th Sep 2012 03:24


Australia is large enough to welcome all immigrants, no matter what their mode of transport is.

China was large enough for all its people at one time too. Bulging at the seams a bit now though.


There are "empty" towns all over rural Australia.
Clive Palmer said it best, let them in and put them to work.
Why are they empty? perhaps because there was to much activity, and people, for the land to support.

owen meaney 24th Sep 2012 03:38


Gillard's attraction to married men PickeringPOST, with names on the list than most never knew of.
MMmmm, when you look at the list and the sequence of affairs, one could say "she slept her way to the top", of course we wouldn't even think that would we?

Buster Hyman 24th Sep 2012 04:05


Clive Palmer said it best, let them in and put them to work.
He's also going to build the Titanic II, but don't let me stop you quoting him....
http://msnsmileys.net/r/smileys/ROFL/Rofl_3f.gif

owen meaney 24th Sep 2012 04:37


Why are they empty? perhaps because there was to much activity, and people, for the land to support
No, those are not the reasons, it's to do with urban drift.

CoodaShooda 24th Sep 2012 04:43


Unless, of course, Owen is suggesting that the immigrants get dumped in the desert with no leccy, water, sewerage, food, etc. There's 18% of the landmass they could have
Think you mean 81% Hellsbrink. :E

Should be no problems letting them in and putting them to work. It worked in the post-war era and we got the Snowy Hydro scheme out of it.

All we need is government with some visionary infrastructure in mind and the means to fund it, a union movement not opposed to immigrant (or offshore) workers and a less attractive welfare system.

Piping water from the Kimberley to the southern states anyone?

CoodaShooda 24th Sep 2012 04:44


it's to do with urban drift
And the reason for urban drift is..............?

With thanks to Redgum

"The rivers are dry across the land and the farmers fields have turned to sand
'Cause the rain hasn't come for two years going on three
The topsoil's gone with the hot north wind, the crops won't grow and rust set in
And the cruel south wind of winter brought no relief

And the old men in the public bar talk of floods and droughts before
And as the night goes on the conversations die
But the battlers don't give up, it's written on their hands
And in their eye-eye-eye-eye-eyes, and the spirit of the land survives

And on Saturday night in the Royal Hotel, Hank the Dutchman plays guitar
He sings country and western favourites and requests
It used to be his second job, a bit of a laugh for a couple of bob
Now it's all he's got 'cause his crops all died from thirst

Then he spent his savings on cattle and sheep, he got some credit, got in too deep
But stock won't graze on pastures turned to salt
And then he tried to get work as a travelling man selling Rawleighs products from the back of his van
But the cockies all shop in town where things are cheap

And the old men in the public bar talk of floods and droughts before
And as the night goes on the conversations die
But the battlers don't give up, it's written on their hands
And in their eye-eye-eye-eye-eyes, and the spirit of the land survives

The school's all rundown, the roofs rusted and the paint's peelin'
The playground's just a dustbowl, not a spot of green
The kids still kick their footballs sending dust clouds to the sun"... etc

Worrals in the wilds 24th Sep 2012 05:26


Clive Palmer said it best, let them in and put them to work.
Do they get any say in where they go or are you suggesting that's forced on them? Immigrants (particularly from Africa, India and the Middle East) have overwhelmingly preferred to settle in major cities. People who live in Australia on visas have almost invariably had the right to live where they like, as do Australians. Are you proposing to change that? :hmm:

Nor is there necessarily a lot of work in many small towns, that's one of the reasons that many of them are small. Does Clive want to train these immigrants to be miners (after they've learned English) or would he rather import skilled tradespeople? The track record of the big miners would suggest skilled tradespeople are their preferred form of employees, whether they are Australian or otherwise.

I don't know how many plumbers, lekkies and gas fitters are claiming refugee status at the moment, but my guess would be that there aren't all that many who are ready to jump straight into Clive's pits and start scooping.


No, those are not the reasons, it's to do with urban drift.
There are hundreds of research papers on this topic by academics all over the country; most of them give a number of reasons for the declining populations of some small towns. However, it's great to see that you've come up with the definitive two word answer on the subject. Guess all those sociologists will have to find new projects now. :}

One of many...
The Regional Institute

Captain Sand Dune 24th Sep 2012 05:46


Does Clive want to train these immigrants to be miners (after they've learned English) or would he rather import skilled tradespeople? The track record of the big miners would suggest skilled tradespeople are their preferred form of employees, whether they are Australian or otherwise.
I reckon industry needs to return to the days of funding aprenticeships, perhaps with a little government coersion. When they run out of Australians to train, then they can import them. That applies to the airlines too!

Probably a little too forward thinking for many of today's businesses though.

Clare Prop 24th Sep 2012 05:52

A familiar style reemerging there from Owen.

I still dont get why unions and Juliar and co can go on about not letting in skilled migrants but be able to justify letting in unskilled ones. imagine the outcry if Gina and Twiggy were bringing them in by the boatload without visas.

have just been away in NZ and had the misfortune of turning on their news today and seeing the red witch off to new York to grovel for a seat on the security council. ugh.

owen meaney 24th Sep 2012 06:06


It worked in the post-war era and we got the Snowy Hydro scheme out of it.
Well said Coodashooda.
It pays to think outside the square and the two party paradigm.
Remember, they want you to watch the left hand flapping, whilst they do sleight of hand with the right hand.

Doesn't matter who is the ruling party, the banks stay the same, the industry leaders stay the same and the rich get richer.

And yet still they come (the immigrants)


Do they get any say in where they go or are you suggesting that's forced on them?
Yes Worrals, they are "forced" to go where they is told - thats the idea. The folks that built the snowy scheme worked and become australians under that paradigm.

500N 24th Sep 2012 07:29

Kimberley is in the wrong place to pump water South.

Aust has a hell of a lot more than 18% uninhabitable by larger populations.

Where are all these empty towns ? I know of one, that's Wittenoom
and for good reason. A fair few other towns are smaller than they were
but a lot of that is to do with no work, no food etc so move to bigger urban populations.

Sticking people in these places does not solve all the problems that
caused them to shrink in the first place. All you end up with is a welfare town.

owen meaney 24th Sep 2012 07:47


Kimberley is in the wrong place to pump water South.
Good pickup 500N.
Where would you bring the water from?
There was a plan in about 1938 to pipe water from the north of Queensland to the south including SA. - called the Bradfield Scheme
Projects like these are needed so our sons and daughters have work, it would also make more land arable and create even more employment.
Goverment cycle of 18 months is useless, maybe a dictator is needed.

SOPS 24th Sep 2012 08:26

And just for a change of pace, a report out today by the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare shows there are more than 18,000 Australians who are homeless and sleeping in crisis centers each night.

Meanwhile the cost of Naru, "resuce services" for the constant stream of country shoppers, welfare for them etc,etc has now blown out to over $4.5 billion over forward estimates.

You could house a hell of a lot of Australians for $4.5 billion.:ugh:

Andu 24th Sep 2012 08:29

Water from the Kimberlys? Why not simply act on the almost century old and visionary Bradfield Scheme, reversing the flow of the massive North Queensland rivers to the west of the Great Dividing Range and then to the south?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bradfield_Scheme

The Bradfield Scheme - Australia's Next Great National Project - A National Water Grid

The large number of refugees who came here after World War 2 were forced to live - and work - where directed by the government for two (or was it three?) years after their arrival in Australia. After that, they were free to move to where they liked.

Buster Hyman 24th Sep 2012 08:29

Water? Who wants water? We've got a new billion dollar Desal plant in the wettest part of Victoria sitting idle at the moment...

:rolleyes:


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