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-   -   War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original (https://www.pprune.org/jet-blast/477678-war-australia-any-oz-politics-original.html)

Captain Sand Dune 22nd Sep 2012 05:20

Although:


SRI LANKAN male asylum seekers have been sent home after refusing to be transferred to the offshore processing centre on Nauru, Immigration Minister Chris Bowen said today.
Mr Bowen says the 18 Sri Lankans left Christmas Island for Colombo today after asking to be sent home instead of being sent to the Pacific island for the processing of their claims as asylum seekers.
The first group to be sent for offshore processing since new asylum seeker laws were enacted were transferred from Christmas Island to Nauru on September 14.
Australia has reopened the processing centre at Nauru and is soon to reopen Papua New Guinea's Manus Island as part of the federal government's policy to stem the number of boat arrivals.
Mr Bowen also said the government would introduce a recommendation from the Houston independent panel to bar people arriving by boat from sponsoring family under the Special Humanitarian Program.
The Houston report on asylum seeker policy, handed to the government on August 13, recommended 22 key measures to stem the boat arrivals to Australia.
Mr Bowen said the plane carrying the 18 men left Christmas Island at 0815 (11.15am AEST) today bound for the Sri Lankan capital.
He said 16 of the 18 men arrived in Australia after August 13, when the government announced its new border protection policies.
"They have asked not be transferred to Nauru, but instead to be returned to their homeland of Sri Lanka,'' Mr Bowen told reporters in Sydney on Saturday.
"That has been arranged and facilitated."
The minister said the changes to the concessions under the special humanitarian program would ensure family reunions occurred only through the normal channels.
"There will be no special concessions," Mr Bowen said.
"Up until now it had been possible for people who arrive in Australia by boat to sponsor family members and not to show that the other requirements under the special humanitarian program were met."
Mr Bowen said the government had also accepted the recommendation to increase the numbers of people accepted under the family reunion program by 4000.
Earlier today, Opposition Leader Tony Abbott said the latest boat arrival shows the federal government cannot manage the nation's borders.
Mr Abbott's comments come after Australian authorities intercepted an asylum seeker boat carrying 17 people heading for Christmas Island.
It was the 144th boat intercepted in Australian waters this year.
I note it males only, but maybe they'll tell their mates.:ok:
Gee, maybe the Libs were on to something with their policy after all! Whoda thunk it.:hmm:

allan907 22nd Sep 2012 05:56

What's the betting that the offer was Nauru, or "If you don't want to go we"ll fly you home and give you this big suitcase full of cash on condition that you go quietly; you spread the word back home that it's a shit place to go to; and you keep your gob shut on pain of death".

Then, they can make their TV ad aimed at the Sri Lankans.

Solid Rust Twotter 22nd Sep 2012 06:36

Reckon you're right. Why on earth would anyone go back to a place from which they've fled, apparently in fear for their lives, to seek asylum?

It's all a huge con IMO. If the Oz govt haven't seen that yet, they're either blind or stupid, and I don't see a lot of labradors and white canes about. I reckon the next election should be a telling indication of the sanity of the Oz population.

Of course, using that yardstick, we're probably all a bunch of wibbling moonbats in this neck of the woods.

Captain Sand Dune 22nd Sep 2012 07:48


What's the betting that the offer was Nauru, or "If you don't want to go we"ll fly you home and give you this big suitcase full of cash on condition that you go quietly; you spread the word back home that it's a shit place to go to; and you keep your gob shut on pain of death".
Nah, I reckon quite simply the ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS realized the Nauru option not to be the soft option they were betting on. Wouldn't put it past them to try another avenue though.

How many lives have been lost and how many billions have been spent proving the Howard government correct on this one?

Andu 22nd Sep 2012 13:41


I reckon the next election should be a telling indication of the sanity of the Oz population.
I'm in despair when I think that there's a likelihood that there are enough out there in voterville who will fall for all the freebies and the "Abbottabbottabbott'sanawfulwomanhater" big lie to vote this sad shower back in again.

I've said it before, but the Libs have a past history of snatching defeat from the jaws of "certain" victory. This next one wouldn't be the first "unlosable" election they've lost - and Malcolm Turnbull seems set on playing the Kevin Rudd role to Tony Abbott, if a bit more subtly than the Krudd himself is playing that role to Joolia(r).

As for the 18 Tamils taking the free flight home: I wouldn't be a all surprised to find that they're treating this trip as a scouting run, and now that they know the ropes (and have confirmed for themselves first hand what a soft touch the current Australian system is), they'll each fill a boat with fifty mates and be back within a week or two with far more healthy bank balances than they have now.

Andu 22nd Sep 2012 13:48

From the Andrew Bolt site tonight:

Cookies must be enabled. | The Australian


AUSTRALIA has asked for clearance to send aircraft into Indonesian airspace to join the search for survivors of an asylum-seeker boat believed to have capsized off Java’s south-west coast.

By 1pm Jakarta time two merchant vessels in the area had rescued 189 people from the wooden fishing vessel.

The boat, believed to be carrying about 200 passengers, was previously notified about 40 nautical miles south of Panaitan Island early today.

It had been headed for Christmas Island.

The Nauru fix isn’t working so well.

UPDATE

Why to Australia, when they are rescued in Indonesian waters?

About 180 asylum seekers found on a boat about 100 kilometres off the Indonesian coast are being transferred to an Australian Navy ship and a number of merchant vessels, the Australian Maritime Safety Authority (AMSA) has confirmed.,,

“The asylum seekers who boarded the Australian Navy vessel will most likely be transported to Christmas Island, while the destination of those who boarded commercial vessels is currently unknown.

500N 22nd Sep 2012 19:55

Andu

Re "Abbottabbottabbott'sanawfulwomanhater" big lie to vote this sad shower back in again.

I read in some paper Sat that the Labor party had worked out how to win
- make Abbot look Scary and bad !!!

I will agree with their tactics but Jesus, talk about the low ebb of Aust politics
if the only way they can win is make Abbott look worse than Labor !!!

It just shows that Labor have nothing to live offer.

Captain Sand Dune 22nd Sep 2012 23:49

Well I’ll be b*ggered.................


A GROUP of 16 Sri Lankan asylum seekers on Christmas Island have chosen to fly home rather than go to Nauru for indefinite detention.
Immigration Minister Chris Bowen seized on the decision as a sign the government's tough stance is working and sought to press his advantage, declaring he will offer free flights and 'go home grants' of cash and equipment to others who choose to leave.
Mr Bowen also announced new measures yesterday to stop asylum seekers who arrive by boat from bringing out multiple family members without having to prove they are also genuine refugees.
The Sri Lankan asylum seekers flew home from Christmas Island in a taxpayer-funded chartered jet yesterday despite originally claiming to be fleeing persecution in their homeland.
Under tough new laws they faced being sent to Nauru and held indefinitely because they arrived by boat after August 13.
Mr Bowen, who also announced new measures to stop asylum seekers who arrive by boat from bringing out multiple family members on reunion visas without having to prove they are refugees, said the message to people smugglers was clear.
In an exclusive interview with The Sunday Telegraph he predicted more failed asylum seekers would vote with their feet to go home in the future.
"Life's all about choices. We've spoken to people about their options," Mr Bowen said.
"These individuals chose not to pursue asylum claims and faced transfer to a regional processing centre in Nauru or Papua New Guinea, and instead they chose to return home voluntarily."
While the previous Howard government offered cash grants to asylum seekers to go home voluntarily, Mr Bowen said Australia was now paying the International Organization for Migration to organise tailored packages which included goods, training and cash grants up to $2500.
"If they are farmers we say, 'how about we give you farming equipment'. We've bought people motorbikes so they can start a courier business," he said.
By comparison, leaving failed asylum seekers in detention can cost thousands of dollars a month.
The family reunion changes followed the recommendation of the Expert Panel on Asylum Seekers, which suggested barring people arriving by boat after August 13, 2012, from proposing family members under the humanitarian program.
"Until now, the offshore spouse, dependent children and, in some cases, parents of refugees in Australia could be granted an SHP visa solely on the basis of that relationship," Mr Bowen said in a statement.
"This created a situation where the head of a family would arrive here alone, apply for asylum and then seek to bring out members of his family as humanitarian migrants."
However, children and teenagers who arrived in Australia by boat as unaccompanied minor refugees before August 13, 2012, will still be eligible for SHP visas on the strength of their family relationship alone.
Opposition immigration spokesman Scott Morrison gazumped the government by flagging the interest of some asylum seekers to go home earlier in the week. But Mr Morrison warned the family reunion changes were a sham.
"Labor's announcement on family reunion is a con. All they're doing is asking them to fill out a different form, line up in a different queue and pay an application fee," he said.
"At the end of the day, as permanent visa holders, they'll still have access to family reunion. It's another half-hearted response by Labor, rather than restore TPVs that deny completely any access to family reunion."
Yep, a pretty “tough stance” there. Let’s reward the very behavior we want to stop. Great management of our borders, Juliar. The fact that some of the ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS have chosen to return home just proves the veracity of their original claims, i.e. they are economic immigrants.
I see the Howard government was doing something similar too. Nevertheless, there were far less ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS trying to get in when the Libs were in power.


AUTHORITIES say an asylum boat feared capsized off Indonesia with 180 people on board has been found still afloat after sending a distress signal.
The Australian Maritime Safety Authority believes the vessel encountered trouble about 60km south of Java.
Several merchant ships responded to a distress call from the boat before an Australian Navy vessel arrived at about 5pm.
It is believed the Navy was granted permission by authorities in Indonesia to enter Indonesian waters and assist with the rescue.
Indonesian rescue boats were sent to assist those on board the stricken vessel.
The boat was found afloat and Australian authorities expect to transfer those on board.
It is unknown where the suspected asylum seekers have sailed from.
60KM South of Java!!:eek: FFS!!:mad: The Indons must be wetting themselves laughing!! Great way to make Australia look like a nation of fools, Juliar.:ugh:

prospector 23rd Sep 2012 03:54

Perhaps she thinks she needs UN support to secure your borders???


Prime Minister Julia Gillard has departed for New York, where she will lobby world leaders in a bid to win Australia a seat on the United Nations Security Council.
Australian bid for UN Security Council seat | Stuff.co.nz

gupta 23rd Sep 2012 04:00


bid to win Australia a seat on the United Nations Security Council.
This has been a Labor fixation since the days of Gareth Gareth Evans

500N 23rd Sep 2012 04:03

Re UN, I would prefer they stay away from Australia
(or actually get disbanded). A PITA organisation.
.

Andu 23rd Sep 2012 04:40

A second boat, this one not reported to be sinking, and with 66 New Australians on board, reported to be approaching Christmas Island today.

So over a 24 hour period, we have 30 departees heading for Nauru plus 18 willingly returning to to Columbo and the horrors they were escaping now that their their pockets are stuffed with cash supplied by the Australian taxpayer, versus almost 250 incoming.

Not good math, Mr Bowen.

SOPS 23rd Sep 2012 06:36

There is certainly no sign of the "tide turning" is there? And with the detention centres now full, what is next Mr Bowen?

500N 23rd Sep 2012 07:04

Old cruise ships registered in a foreign country and moored somewhere.

To be honest, why they don't do this and then when full sail back
to the various countries, dropping off those at each port then start
all over again.

It's not like we have to supply 5 star accomodation, warm and dry,
a place to sleep and some food - plus a free trip home !!!

.

Captain Sand Dune 23rd Sep 2012 09:30

...........or we could stop making it so attractive for them in the first place.:hmm:

SOPS 23rd Sep 2012 09:41

Why cant we just announce "We are full..no more can come in...you will be sent back"?

allan907 23rd Sep 2012 10:15

PPRuNe - ahead of the pack!


What's the betting that the offer was Nauru, or "If you don't want to go we"ll fly you home and give you this big suitcase full of cash on condition that you go quietly; you spread the word back home that it's a shit place to go to; and you keep your gob shut on pain of death".

and 'go home grants' of cash
Cynic? Moi??

It will now be the new business plan for Sri Lankans. Quick boat trip and then back home - on a chartered aircraft no less, none of this cramped cattle class - with your business starter pack courtesy of Jooliar and her loons.

Takan Inchovit 23rd Sep 2012 10:55


It will now be the new business plan for Sri Lankans. Quick boat trip and then back home - on a chartered aircraft no less, none of this cramped cattle class - with your business starter pack courtesy of Jooliar and her loons.
Of course this can only be offered as long as the Asylum Seekers are able to swim at least 100 metres off the coast of Indonesia where the Australian Navy will be waiting to pick them up for the necessary 'processing'.

Worrals in the wilds 23rd Sep 2012 11:41


Perhaps she thinks she needs UN support to secure your borders???
IMO the UN is the whole problem, namely Australia becoming a signatory to the 1951 Refugee Convention. The US isn't a signatory and nor is India. Both countries continue to accept large numbers of refugees and new migrants, so it's not like the convention is the be all and end all with regards to immigraton policy.

Everyone bags the Indians (it's fashionable :ugh:), but people who've travelled in northern India realise just how many immigrants they have accepted from Tibet, China and Nepal; people who are now free from persecution and violence. Of course they now have to deal with the Indian bureauocracy but that's benign when compared to being shot at. :cool: More or less, anyway...:}

All the Convention does is mire Australia in a swamp of boggy law devised by Europeans to solve 1950s European problems. We end up with all sorts of fuzzy definitions about what actually constitutes a refugee wedged into the Immigration Act, because we're a signatory. The government has to fit everything around the terms of that convention because we're a signatory. Howard's government were a little more audacious than the current mob, but the same restrictions applied and he/they didn't have the balls to back out of it either.

I firmly believe Australia should take on refugees, aka people who want to come here and have something to offer (even if it's just enthusiasm and a work ethic). That's what Australia and the states before it have done since 1788 (without asking the existing occupants BTW:E); people who wanted a better life, a fairer go, people who sought an escape from mindless sectarian violence. Most of us here would be descended from people who came to Australia to get away from that sort of shit and most of us have done okay.

However; this is a sovereign country and I believe the country (via its government, which governs by the agreement of the voters) should be able to decide who gets a place on the team without having to wade through ten tonnnes of fuzzy, lefty international 'law' created by professional pollies in Geneva back in the early 1950s, and since propogated by corrupt dodgy pollies from all over the world who have snivelled their way to a UN appointment. :ugh:

Let's just think about the Aussie pollies who've sought their way to the UN (remembering that Australia ranks fairly low on world corruption scales) :hmm:. Let's then imagine their equivalents from all over the world gathering together to make 'laws' for the rest of us humans :eek:. Scary, huh? Kev 0 Sev anyone? :\

This is where all this UN stuff eminates from. These are the people who drafted the Convention Relating To The Status of Refugees and the people who ensure its continuence. This is why successive federal governments tie themselves in knots trying to work out what to do with people who flew on commercial airlines to Indonesia (not a signatory) complete with passports and then hired a tinnie to take them the rest of the way, having mysteriously mislaid their passports en route :oh:.

This is the racket and our government is still buying it :ugh:. So are the Euros and the Brits, so at least we're not exclusive :}. The Howard government also bought it (they weren't ballsy enough to back out of the Convention, so let's not paint them as the great Saviours here) but they figured out a counter-racket that worked. The current government have tried to emulate that but it's a bit like flares or stonewash jeans; what worked 15 years ago doesn't always work today, no matter how big your marketing budget or how ernest your conviction to make the problem go way until next week's polls.

Imagine if there were no boats of Sri Lankans and Pakistani economic migrants to worry about and no hateful Sydney Lebs with violent signs to deal with. The government could concentrate on Burmese or Sudanse people (to name two of many groups) who have spent their lives in refugee camps and want to come somewhere else, but don't have the means to pay for a token boat ride from Indonesia after spending thousands in cash that they don't have to secure the airfares to the starting point. It's like Monopoly for many true refugees; do not spend $200, do not pass go.

They could join the Irish, the Italians, the Greeks, the Vietnamese, the Cambodians, the Islanders and the many other groups of people who have come to Australia seeking a better life and not only found it, but contributed to it; both for themselves and the people who came after them.

Maybe then we'd start having a proper refugee policy.

CoodaShooda 23rd Sep 2012 12:40

Nicely put Worrals.

Except, you missed the bit about the feds being keen to sign up to any international convention they can find; because they convert state responsibilities to international responsibilities and thus shift power from the states to the feds under the Constitution.

Which in turn requires the establishment of further bureacratic empires to deal with the politically correct inanities that emenate from the UN Councils.

It's public service nirvana with plenty of overseas travel thrown in.

Changing tack a bit, I choked on my weeties yesterday when reading that Gillards chief of staff had described the pubic service as being out of touch with no real world experience. This in response to a call to wind back the number of minders and beef up public service influence.

The words "pot", "kettle" and "black" immediately sprang to mind. But it perhaps explains a lot when we realise that Australia is governed federally by two warring groups, neither of which have any 'real world' experience.


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