British 'justice' and wrongful convictions
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: UK
Posts: 1,523
British 'justice' and wrongful convictions
Just scanned through the three pages of 'active' threads, looking for some mention of this topic, particularly in respect of the hundreds of Post Office employees wrongfully convicted. Result ? Zilch. Not even a passing mention ! Have we become so inured to the appalling standards of this area of society that we can just shrug our shoulders and accept it, without comment ? Such an attitude would explain much of what is accepted as 'normal' in social conventions and, particularly, politics. The victims are still waiting for full compensation and some have died before their innocence was confirmed. Disgraceful, doesn't begin to describe the nature of this mass injustice, nor the lazy, uncaring, hidebound, dilatory inaction of both the Post Office and the oversight politicians.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 13,932
Originally Posted by Cornish Jack
nor the lazy, uncaring, hidebound, dilatory inaction of both the Post Office and the oversight politicians.
Cunning Artificer
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: The spiritual home of DeHavilland
Age: 74
Posts: 3,127
There were many more victimss than those who were prosecuted. Virtually every sub-postmaster in the land would have been affected. A family friend retired from Brunei and set up back home with a small shop/sub-post office in Romsey, near Southampton. He kept finding shortfalls in his takings and made up the shortages from the takings of the shop. Within a very short time he was bust and forced to sell - bear in mind his home was the flat over the shop. With what little was left of his life's savings he bought a small terraced house way up in the North East, went on benefits, supplemented by cash from playing the piano in the local British Legion and died an early death in poverty.
If not for the rubbish software, cover up and appalling post office actions in forcing payment under threat of prosecution, he'd quite likely still be alive and still running his little shop. He was only ten years older than me.
If not for the rubbish software, cover up and appalling post office actions in forcing payment under threat of prosecution, he'd quite likely still be alive and still running his little shop. He was only ten years older than me.
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Manchester, England
Age: 56
Posts: 879
Long read on the whole sorry saga put together by Private Eye, who kept reporting it after (I think) Computer Weekly broke the story, and long before the mainstream media took much notice. As Dave says, how no one involved in the cover up has had their day in court is beyond me.
Private Eye - Justice Lost In The Post
There’s other interesting reports linked from that page - ‘Lootin with Putin’ being particularly relevant at the moment.
Private Eye - Justice Lost In The Post
There’s other interesting reports linked from that page - ‘Lootin with Putin’ being particularly relevant at the moment.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Here and there
Age: 59
Posts: 7
At the very least Paula Vennells should have her CBE stripped from her (that's the one she 'earned' for service to the Post Office whilst CEO of the same). She resigned from the Church of England before she was defrocked.
TO
TO
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: by the seaside
Age: 72
Posts: 351
It is naive to believe in British justice.
My father reported what turned out to be a long fraud to the met fraud squad in the early 60s, it had been set up by the Krays. I took the phone call from a detective who asked for a grand to not prosecute my father- then an innocent party - he refused and got a year inside. The fraud squad and vice squads were retired and Southend police force were taken over with the chief constable getting two years as did one of the met units but everyone else got off.
My wife was run of the road by the son of a Newbury police Sargent and we were victims of a detective illegally using his powers to access our bank accounts. Complaints did nothing although another police officer was our witness.
Fast forward 30 years, I’ve been trying to deal with probate which involves fraud on a relatives account, two false declarations on death certificates and abuse of lasting power of attorneys. I’ve made complaints especially after Barçlays stated that there has been fraudulent activity on the deceased accounts but after several weeks of getting an officer appointed her superior is not willing to investigate further.
The whole system especially offshore companies and money laundering needs an overhaul but it won’t happen. Too many people are skimming the cream off the top.
My father reported what turned out to be a long fraud to the met fraud squad in the early 60s, it had been set up by the Krays. I took the phone call from a detective who asked for a grand to not prosecute my father- then an innocent party - he refused and got a year inside. The fraud squad and vice squads were retired and Southend police force were taken over with the chief constable getting two years as did one of the met units but everyone else got off.
My wife was run of the road by the son of a Newbury police Sargent and we were victims of a detective illegally using his powers to access our bank accounts. Complaints did nothing although another police officer was our witness.
Fast forward 30 years, I’ve been trying to deal with probate which involves fraud on a relatives account, two false declarations on death certificates and abuse of lasting power of attorneys. I’ve made complaints especially after Barçlays stated that there has been fraudulent activity on the deceased accounts but after several weeks of getting an officer appointed her superior is not willing to investigate further.
The whole system especially offshore companies and money laundering needs an overhaul but it won’t happen. Too many people are skimming the cream off the top.
Join Date: May 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 201
It is an absolute scandal which will be further compounded if those responsible are not called fully to account. I have been following the 12 BBC podcasts which has shone a light into this sad saga. BBC Sounds - The Great Post Office Trial - Available Episodes
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Lost again...
Posts: 721
Can you have criminal charges after a public enquiry? (Such as the one currently underway).
I thought things like inquests and public enquiries only took place after criminal cases (if there were going to be any) since they are considered to undermine or prejudice criminal trials.
So does this public inquiry effectively mean that criminal prosecutions are now unlikey?
I thought things like inquests and public enquiries only took place after criminal cases (if there were going to be any) since they are considered to undermine or prejudice criminal trials.
So does this public inquiry effectively mean that criminal prosecutions are now unlikey?
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: North West UK
Posts: 535
Originally Posted by OvertHawk
So does this public inquiry effectively mean that criminal prosecutions are now unlikey?
Thought police antagonist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Where I always have been...firmly in the real world
Posts: 1,178
CJ,
There was actually a thread about this travesty some time ago on here, but no matter because as you correctly say, it's now become established as (yet another) miscarriage of justice.
When you read about these miscarriages, it makes you thankful we no longer have the death penalty...well apart from the charmless Ms Patel who came to grief in a spectacular manner in a discussion, loose term, with Ian Hislop when he pointed out it really wasn't ok to execute innocent people...which she seemed to think it was if they'd been "proved" to be guilty.
There was actually a thread about this travesty some time ago on here, but no matter because as you correctly say, it's now become established as (yet another) miscarriage of justice.
When you read about these miscarriages, it makes you thankful we no longer have the death penalty...well apart from the charmless Ms Patel who came to grief in a spectacular manner in a discussion, loose term, with Ian Hislop when he pointed out it really wasn't ok to execute innocent people...which she seemed to think it was if they'd been "proved" to be guilty.
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: N/A
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Join Date: May 2001
Location: south of Cirencester, north of Lyneham
Age: 75
Posts: 1,261
Not only should all the Post Office managers who denied the problems lose their jobs and pensions to compensate the victims, but Fujitsu should be made to pay at least the compensation - as well as being fined and banned from any public contracts in the UK. Plus those at Fujitsu who denied the faults in court should be prosecuted for perjury. And Vennels should be in jail....
Avoid imitations
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
Posts: 13,728
As I wrote before, the whole thing is a national disgrace. It’s incredible that many hundreds of hard working, innocent people can be sent to jail for the same false allegation, which was for stealing money that never actually existed!
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: scotland
Posts: 185
The extraordinary thing is that even after the scandal has been revealed nobody seems to be able to sort things out. To my mind, most of those involved, from the Prime minister downwards, should simply be fired as having demonstrated that they are not up to their jobs in a computerised world.
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: EU
Posts: 493
If you knowingly withhold information which could prevent a grave miscarriage of justice, you are scum. If you participate in a process which ensures a miscarriage of justice, you really ought to be in jail.
What happened was an injustice of catastrophic proportions, facilitated by people who could, individually, collectively and corporately have prevented it.
What happened was an injustice of catastrophic proportions, facilitated by people who could, individually, collectively and corporately have prevented it.
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Brexitland
Posts: 1,139
Why would anyone believe that hundreds of model citizens suddenly turn to crime. How was this allowed to proceed. Post Office and the Government spent well over £1 million of your money on legal fees!
Vennels must give her ridiculous CBE back and see how she likes a few years in prison. "Proceeds of Crime" should bankrupt her and leave her on benefits. Vicious bitch.
Vennels must give her ridiculous CBE back and see how she likes a few years in prison. "Proceeds of Crime" should bankrupt her and leave her on benefits. Vicious bitch.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Reading, UK
Posts: 13,932
Originally Posted by Ancient Observer
I would want to see all of the folk in the chain of command get some time in prison.
I just do not believe that no-one knew about this awful cock-up.
I just do not believe that no-one knew about this awful cock-up.
Post Office staff instructed to shred documents that undermined its claims Horizon was robust
Post Office dishonesty in Horizon scandal is reason enough for statutory public inquiry
Police interview former Fujitsu staff for second time in potential perjury investigation
https://www.computerweekly.com/news/...tories-of-2021
Join Date: Dec 1999
Location: EGNX
Posts: 1,179
The scale of misjustice in this case is breathtaking. Vennells should be stripped of all assets and imprisoned for life. The fact that this evil excuse for a human actually masqueraded as an Anglican priest during this atrocity is beyond comprehension. Under her watch people lost livelihoods, were made bankrupt, went to prison and committed suicide. This "priest" actually ruined peoples' lives. I sincerely hope justice is served here.
