Suez canal blocked
Join Date: Nov 1998
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I’m trained and licensed to operate large aircraft into Airports with 30 metre width runways (instead of the normal 45 metres). What training (if any) or simulation facilities of adverse weather conditions do the Masters of these vessels have in order to navigate the Suez canal safely?
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 9,456
The Master has overall control and the Suez Pilots 'advise' but its the Master that giver the orders to the helmsman etc.
Sure there will be a inquiry but I think the short answer till something better comes along will be Tug Boats fore and aft depending on the ships size.
Sure there will be a inquiry but I think the short answer till something better comes along will be Tug Boats fore and aft depending on the ships size.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: There and here
Posts: 2,537
Originally Posted by Nightstop
I’m trained and licensed to operate large aircraft into Airports with 30 metre width runways (instead of the normal 45 metres). What training (if any) or simulation facilities of adverse weather conditions do the Masters of these vessels have in order to navigate the Suez canal safely?
A ship the size/tonnage of Ever Given would be charged about £180,000 for the Suez transit, which should pay for quite a bit of service. No wonder the Egyptian's were pushing for the unloading of the containers a few days ago, they've lost a lot of revenue.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: 4DME
Posts: 2,450
Mother-in-law has been desperately trying to buy Easter cards, she left it too late so desperately had to try all over, one shop said to her "sorry madam were out of stock as they are stuck in the Suez canal".
See and avoid
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 595
I read that the ships carrying livestock will get highest priority as some of them are running low on food to feed the animals on board.
The maritime shipping insurance industry is in for a tough road ahead.
I read that most don’t bother to insure for delays, but some do.
The maritime shipping insurance industry is in for a tough road ahead.
I read that most don’t bother to insure for delays, but some do.
See and avoid
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 595
If you think the Suez Canal is narrow; look at the Panama Canal locks.
The Bernoulli Principle, or “bank effect” sucks the ship, or in this case its stern, to one side of the canal when it gets close, and the low pressure suction increases the closer the stern gets to the bank, resulting in a runaway event.
The Suez Canal has an active current because it is an open ditch from one sea to another. Yes, ships do build up a high pressure center in front (bow wave) and a low pressure wave behind while transiting each section between locks on the Panama Canal, but it’s nothing like having an active current like what you have in the Suez, with no chance to stop the current, as in the case in the Panama Canal.
I have been told that in addition, prop wash from going into full reverse can swing the stern to starboard, which IF IT HAPPENED would have made the situation worse in this case.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 32°55'22"S 151°46'56"E
Age: 37
Posts: 594
Originally Posted by Nightstop
I’m trained and licensed to operate large aircraft into Airports with 30 metre width runways (instead of the normal 45 metres). What training (if any) or simulation facilities of adverse weather conditions do the Masters of these vessels have in order to navigate the Suez canal safely?
Originally Posted by Kiltrash
The Master has overall control and the Suez Pilots 'advise' but its the Master that giver the orders to the helmsman etc.
Sure there will be a inquiry but I think the short answer till something better comes along will be Tug Boats fore and aft depending on the ships size.
Sure there will be a inquiry but I think the short answer till something better comes along will be Tug Boats fore and aft depending on the ships size.
Originally Posted by Fareastdriver
If you think the Suez Canal is narrow; look at the Panama Canal locks.
Originally Posted by Less Hair
Is it possible that super big ships like this will be banned from using the Suez channel in the future due to their limited maneuverability? Or are any other restrictions coming up for them?
Originally Posted by visibility3miles
Look at post #202 by Low Level Pilot
The Bernoulli Principle, or “bank effect” sucks the ship, or in this case its stern, to one side of the canal when it gets close, and the low pressure suction increases the closer the stern gets to the bank, resulting in a runaway event.
The Suez Canal has an active current because it is an open ditch from one sea to another. Yes, ships do build up a high pressure center in front (bow wave) and a low pressure wave behind while transiting each section between locks on the Panama Canal, but it’s nothing like having an active current like what you have in the Suez, with no chance to stop the current, as in the case in the Panama Canal.
I have been told that in addition, prop wash from going into full reverse can swing the stern to starboard, which IF IT HAPPENED would have made the situation worse in this case.
The Bernoulli Principle, or “bank effect” sucks the ship, or in this case its stern, to one side of the canal when it gets close, and the low pressure suction increases the closer the stern gets to the bank, resulting in a runaway event.
The Suez Canal has an active current because it is an open ditch from one sea to another. Yes, ships do build up a high pressure center in front (bow wave) and a low pressure wave behind while transiting each section between locks on the Panama Canal, but it’s nothing like having an active current like what you have in the Suez, with no chance to stop the current, as in the case in the Panama Canal.
I have been told that in addition, prop wash from going into full reverse can swing the stern to starboard, which IF IT HAPPENED would have made the situation worse in this case.
The 'transverse' thrust issue is unlikely to have been an issue here, I doubt they'd have had time to bring the engine astern. However, when going astern on a right hand direction propeller ship's bow generally goes to starboard and the stern goes to port, when going ahead it isn't an issue as the lines of the hull are asymmetric to offset the effect. I suppose a little similar to the yaw experienced on a single engine propeller aircraft as you apply power.
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2,384
It seems much of the delay was consumed by getting suitable dredges and heavy tugs to the location. Methinks the Suez authorities will be consulting with the salvage operators on what equipment should be kept stationed to free beached whales (Evergreen class) expeditiously.
Dredging is a constant activity on the canal. I'd be looking for high capacity dredges that can be brought quickly to the scene when retasking is called for.
Dredging is a constant activity on the canal. I'd be looking for high capacity dredges that can be brought quickly to the scene when retasking is called for.
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Japan
Posts: 1,073
Just quickly, before anyone changes the threat title to 'Suez Canal Unblocked', one scenario has been running through my mind.
What if there were a temptation to overload such a ship? What if such a ship then snagged a diagonal sand bar and/or furrow while navigating a canal, suddenly wrenching the bulbous nose around and causing the whole ship to spear into the bank? In my mind's eye, I can see the authorities frantically calling for more dredgers.
What if there were a temptation to overload such a ship? What if such a ship then snagged a diagonal sand bar and/or furrow while navigating a canal, suddenly wrenching the bulbous nose around and causing the whole ship to spear into the bank? In my mind's eye, I can see the authorities frantically calling for more dredgers.
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: 5Y
Posts: 578
Originally Posted by Low Level Pilot
At the risk of being accused of drift thread - did somebody mention narrow waterways?
Is that the Manchester Ship Canal?
(and you will be relieved to hear that they have wisely prioritized my beer supply, and it is moving South through the canal https://www.vesselfinder.com/?imo=9863326)
Last edited by double_barrel; 30th Mar 2021 at 07:01.
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 32°55'22"S 151°46'56"E
Age: 37
Posts: 594
Originally Posted by jolihokistix
Just quickly, before anyone changes the threat title to 'Suez Canal Unblocked', one scenario has been running through my mind.
What if there were a temptation to overload such a ship? What if such a ship then snagged a diagonal sand bar and/or furrow while navigating a canal, suddenly wrenching the bulbous nose around and causing the whole ship to spear into the bank? In my mind's eye, I can see the authorities frantically calling for more dredgers.
What if there were a temptation to overload such a ship? What if such a ship then snagged a diagonal sand bar and/or furrow while navigating a canal, suddenly wrenching the bulbous nose around and causing the whole ship to spear into the bank? In my mind's eye, I can see the authorities frantically calling for more dredgers.
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Japan
Posts: 1,073
Thank you, mon aviateur. That somewhat reduces the options as to the causes of this incident, unless the canal has been silting up badly of late.
The wind and sandstorm is still being picked up and quoted by the press, but 30 mph winds do not seem very impressive. Winds over the desert must be a daily feature of life there. Do they have wind speed limits, I wonder, beyond which they stop shipping movements in the canal?(Thinking out loud.)
That all rather brings it back round to the Master and the Pilot again, or a lack of appropriate dredging.
The wind and sandstorm is still being picked up and quoted by the press, but 30 mph winds do not seem very impressive. Winds over the desert must be a daily feature of life there. Do they have wind speed limits, I wonder, beyond which they stop shipping movements in the canal?(Thinking out loud.)
That all rather brings it back round to the Master and the Pilot again, or a lack of appropriate dredging.
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Eastern Cape, South Africa
Posts: 116
I see that the Egyptians dug a 2nd channel for about half the canal a few years back. Maybe they will consider doubling up the entire length..it would increade capacity a lot, and in events like this, would enable canal to stay open..
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: UK
Age: 51
Posts: 0
Originally Posted by SOPS
I wonder why they swing to the right?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: 32°55'22"S 151°46'56"E
Age: 37
Posts: 594
Originally Posted by jolihokistix
Thank you, mon aviateur. That somewhat reduces the options as to the causes of this incident, unless the canal has been silting up badly of late.
The wind and sandstorm is still being picked up and quoted by the press, but 30 mph winds do not seem very impressive. Winds over the desert must be a daily feature of life there. Do they have wind speed limits, I wonder, beyond which they stop shipping movements in the canal?(Thinking out loud.)
That all rather brings it back round to the Master and the Pilot again, or a lack of appropriate dredging.
The wind and sandstorm is still being picked up and quoted by the press, but 30 mph winds do not seem very impressive. Winds over the desert must be a daily feature of life there. Do they have wind speed limits, I wonder, beyond which they stop shipping movements in the canal?(Thinking out loud.)
That all rather brings it back round to the Master and the Pilot again, or a lack of appropriate dredging.
