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Scottish Politics

Old 28th Mar 2021, 17:56
  #221 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Captivep View Post

There is much more that binds us than separates us. Beware the personal ambitions of politicians...
Wise words Captivep, I know Remoaners like to believe Brexit was all about thick Northerners being conned into leaving by a slogan on a red bus but it really wasn't, not for the majority anyway.

Scotland I fear is different though, you've a bunch of crazed Nationalists that have spent their whole careers trying to figure out which buttons to press to get the "Yes" vote they crave and they'll literally say or do ANYTHING to get their way, including cannibalise each other as is playing out now.

Be careful what you wish for would be my advice.
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Old 28th Mar 2021, 18:40
  #222 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
It seems that the anti Scots just ignore the lessons of Brexit. It is openly admitted now that large tranches of Project Fear were in fact spot on. Scotland could become the new Saudi Arabia,
Nobody is being Anti -Scots - some of us are anti SNP - but that is not being Anti - Scots.
The lesson of Brexit and the Brexit Referendum is that it is not worth the divisive politics.
You are just trying to do a proxy re-run of the whole Brexit mess because of your hatred of Boris et al.

To compare the North Sea oil production with Saudi is probably one of the most ludicrous things you have ever posted on here (and that takes some doing LOL)
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Old 28th Mar 2021, 18:48
  #223 (permalink)  
 
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Sallyann

I did not say the EU would want a new border along the line of the existing one.

If the Irish solution is anything to go by the EU will want the new one to be somewhere south of Birmingham..... Sounds good to me!
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Old 28th Mar 2021, 18:54
  #224 (permalink)  
 
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It is openly admitted now that large tranches of Project Fear were in fact spot on.
Openly admitted by whom, remain voters I would hazard a guess, so which ones of these were spot on then, as I must be reading the wrong media outlets and don't try to be clever by using the pandemic to prove any point as it won't wash:

All aircraft travel to stop into, out of and over the EU countries,

London to close as a financial centre,

All trade to and from the EU to stop,

The south of England and around the ports of mainland Europe to become one vast lorry park,

Car manufacturers to leave in droves,

Businesses will move out of UK to EU countries, lock, stock and barrel,

Large percentages of UK companies to go out of business due to Brexit, not to be confused with those few that have closed for non-Brexit reasons,

All EU people working in the UK will leave as they will no longer be able to stay,

The NHS will be in chaos as EU personnel will all leave,

Manufacturing industries will grind to a halt as supply chains disappear,

Farmers produce will rot in fields as there is no-one to harvest the goods,

No-one will holiday in the UK as it becomes isolated from the rest of the world,

It will be difficult for UK residents to holiday in EU countries

The economy will sink to the level of the poorest nations in the world

The pound will sink to an all-time low after we leave the EU.

The UK will not be able to gain trade deals with other countries.

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Old 28th Mar 2021, 19:17
  #225 (permalink)  
 
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The Judean National Front versus The People’s Front of Judea.

The Judean National Front versus The People’s Front of Judea.

The Judean National Front versus The People’s Front of Judea.
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Old 28th Mar 2021, 21:24
  #226 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by rogerg View Post
Sallyann the difference is that when we left the EU we had the UK, but the Scots if they leave the UK have what?
Would you settle for a long list, a short list or perhaps no list at all?

....from an earlier statement you made;

but I just would like the EU out of my life and GB in. What's wrong with that?
.....maybe they just want England out of their lives and Scotland in. Whats wrong with that?
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Old 28th Mar 2021, 21:34
  #227 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by OilCan View Post
.....maybe they just want England out of their lives and Scotland in. Whats wrong with that?
'They' being the SNP !!
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Old 28th Mar 2021, 22:05
  #228 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by keith williams View Post
Do not speak too soon Exrigger, all of those things may yet come about......If David Camerons stetement about Brexit causing World War 3 comes true.
If WW3 did happen, I doubt if too many of the things on that list would be much of a worry to a great many people.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 00:36
  #229 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by longer ron View Post
'They' being the SNP !!
Of course, but also the Independence for Scotland Party (ISP), the Action for Independence (AFI) and now the Alba Party (AP) who are all now vying for only the 'list' seats in addition to the Greens.

The AFI has already been subsumed into Salmonds AP and I would be surprised if some sort of mutual agreement doesn't appear between the ISP & Salmond lest they dilute each others votes for the 'list seats'. Either way, it does not bode well for the unionist parties.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 00:45
  #230 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by andrewn View Post
Wise words Captivep, I know Remoaners like to believe Brexit was all about thick Northerners being conned into leaving by a slogan on a red bus but it really wasn't, not for the majority anyway.

Scotland I fear is different though, you've a bunch of crazed Nationalists that have spent their whole careers trying to figure out which buttons to press to get the "Yes" vote they crave and they'll literally say or do ANYTHING to get their way, including cannibalise each other as is playing out now.

Be careful what you wish for would be my advice.
They never did find the right buttons, Boris did.

Some of us saw this UK constitutional issue coming which undoubtedly influenced how we voted (either way!) but it’s clear others either didn’t see it or simply don’t care. That’s depressing.

I don’t suppose you’ve got many crazed Nationalist English Remoaners?
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 05:19
  #231 (permalink)  
 
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Since the referendum nationalism and xenophobia were terms that were thrown at ‘Little Englanders’ by remain as reasons for the leave vote and although these were not acceptable reasons for most people on both sides of the divide, those same remain people now seem quite happy to see the ‘Little Scotlander’ using those as an excuse to break up a union that has been together a lot longer than what the EEC has morphed into.

I also note that the SNP and their independence supporters do not want to be managed via Westminster and want to become self-governing, and yet are quite happy to be controlled and micromanaged from Brussels, therefore does the Scottish independence side not warrant the same disdain/insults that the remain side heaped on the referendum leave voters for the same reasons.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 07:36
  #232 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by OilCan View Post

Some of us saw this UK constitutional issue coming which undoubtedly influenced how we voted (either way!) but it’s clear others either didn’t see it or simply don’t care. That’s depressing.
It would not have made any difference to the SNP - even if the UK had remained in the EU - we would still be having the next 'Indyref' rammed down our throats ad nauseum.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 08:26
  #233 (permalink)  
 
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People like me wouldn't be supporting them for sure. AFAIAC Brexit has legitimised both the demand for Indyref2 and at the same time provided a very good reason to vote Leave.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 08:56
  #234 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by longer ron View Post
It would not have made any difference to the SNP - even if the UK had remained in the EU - we would still be having the next 'Indyref' rammed down our throats ad nauseum.
You're quite right, but now they're more likely to succeed.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 09:36
  #235 (permalink)  
 
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So what we have come down to is that the UK had a democratic right to leave the EU - and we certainly did - but Scotland must be denied the right to make a similar choice to leave the UK.

I hope Scotland does stay with us. But they are never going to be happy to be denied the choice. I don't blame them for that.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 09:47
  #236 (permalink)  
 
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I don't think that anyone is denying them the democratic right to leave the UK, it is merely the point that to leave the EU was bad, but Scotland leaving the UK is OK, even though it is apparently for the same reasons that remain castigated the EU leave voter for, the irony is not wasted.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 10:15
  #237 (permalink)  
 
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The reason why Leave won was that a significant section of the electorate actually thought that leaving the EU would reduce the number of Islamic terrorists rather than the number of Polish plumbers. I'm not sure that the Scots think that at all.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 10:39
  #238 (permalink)  
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https://www.theguardian.com/politics...ond-alba-party

Second SNP MP defects to Alex Salmond's Alba party

....Neale Hanvey follows the East Lothian MP, Kenny MacAskill, in joining the newly formed party, having previously been suspended by the SNP for using antisemitic language on social media. He apologised for any offence caused in the days following his suspension.

As the SNP set out eye-catching campaign pledges for young people – that every schoolchild will receive a new computer device and no-one under the age of 21 will have to pay council tax if the party is re-elected – the polling expert John Curtice said Alba could deprive Nicola Sturgeon of the Holyrood majority she was seeking as a mandate for a second independence referendum.....

Curtice, a professor of politics at Strathclyde University, told BBC Radio Scotland’s Sunday Show that polling evidence suggested Salmond “is not a very popular politician any more”, but added the new party could “make all the difference” to whether the SNP won an overall majority.

Under the Holyrood electoral system, 73 MSPs are elected to represent constituencies under a first-past-the-post ballot, with the SNP expected to win most of those seats in May. The remaining 56 MSPs are elected by a regional list system, designed to make the seat distribution more representative of the overall vote. In 2016, the SNP did so well in constituency voting that it won list seats in only two of the eight regions, south of Scotland and Highlands. Alba candidates will run only on the regional lists, which Salmond has argued would scoop up previously “wasted” list votes for the SNP.

Curtice said: “The risk to the SNP is that if Salmond gets 4% or 5% of the vote, particularly in those two crucial regions, and those come from the SNP, he may put them down a peg, lose them one or two seats and as a result make all the difference between an overall majority or not.”....
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 11:22
  #239 (permalink)  
 
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I know it is far too late now, but for major changes such as Brexit and Indy then a significant majority (66%, 75% or ...) is much wiser.
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Old 29th Mar 2021, 11:45
  #240 (permalink)  
 
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That was done for a previous referendum in Scotland, pre devolution. It was loaded so that the 66% needed was from the total of registered voters, and not those who bothered to actually turn up and vote on the day.
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