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Who said it?

Old 3rd Jul 2020, 08:56
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Who said it?

I'm scrambling for the source of a quote which goes along the lines of "a true military leader eats after his men have eaten and sleeps after his men have slept" or some such similar sentiment.
For some reason I think it may have been a WW2 American General but I'm really not sure.
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 09:36
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Maybe someone who likes leftovers and hot beds?
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 09:43
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"a true military leader eats his men, and sleeps"
This is what I thought it said on first reading, after a few reds...
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 10:43
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I would have put it down to either Napoleon or Wellington. My money on the latter but i don't know.

Aaron.
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:07
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Two classical gardens in Japan use this motto "先憂後楽" which comes originally from the *Chinese classics and was quoted endlessly by military and political leaders. See Korakuen in Okayama, named by the Lord Ikeda in 1700 to mean 'pleasure only after the people'.
Literally "Hard work before all, relax after everyone else."

https://www.okayama-japan.jp/en/spot/91

*Literature. Like the other two great towers of Jiangnan, Yueyang Tower is famous partly due to its literary associations. These include the piece Yueyang Lou Ji (《岳阳楼记》; 《岳陽樓記》, loosely translated as "Memorial to Yueyang Tower"), which was written by the renowned Song Dynasty Chancellor and poet Fan Zhongyan (范仲淹) at the invitation of his friend Teng Zijing (滕子京, who in 1044 became local governor and rebuilt the tower) as well as the Yuan Dynasty era play Yueyang Tower by Ma Zhiyuan, one of China's most eminent dramatists.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yueyang_Tower

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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:09
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PS I have always wondered how you reduce font size around here.
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:24
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Click the "source" button to reveal the code and remove [ h2 ] without the the spaces...

Or when you paste text from elsewhere, right click into the reply box and choose "paste as plain text". (Ctrl+shift+V)

Or select the pasted text and click the italicised Tx button to the left of "source" to remove formatting
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:24
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In the army I always understood it was horses first, then the men, then finally the officers (if there was any hay left).
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:28
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Captain goes down with his ship?
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:36
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"Eat with the men, sleep with the men." The Grand old Duke of York.

He should know, he had ten thousand men.
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:43
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I’m under the impression that it is based on a Calvary Officer’s code being the order of responsibility with regards to welfare and support.

‘First your horse, then your men, then yourself’.

OK a bit pre mechanisation/modern army and sounding quaint language wise, but never the less relevant today as a guide to life.

May also be expressed by:-

‘Serve to Lead’

Now where have I seen that before, somewhat lost on elements of the me now generation.

In which I include certain high profile political leaders! (no names no pack drill!)
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 11:58
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Originally Posted by treadigraph View Post
Click the "source" button to reveal the code and remove [ h2 ] without the the spaces...

Or when you paste text from elsewhere, right click into the reply box and choose "paste as plain text". (Ctrl+shift+V)

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TG, many thanks! This has only taken me nine years...
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 12:10
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Originally Posted by hiflymk3 View Post
"Eat with the men, sleep with the men." The Grand old Duke of York.

He should know, he had ten thousand men.
Many under 17. Allegedly.

CG
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 12:18
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Originally Posted by hiflymk3 View Post
"Eat with the men, sleep with the men." The Grand old Duke of York.
Is this when he was at Pizza Express, Woking? I thought it was a children’s party?
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 12:28
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Originally Posted by BehindBlueEyes View Post
Is this when he was at Pizza Express, Woking? I thought it was a children’s party?
I have a feeling he didn't sleep with men either!
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Old 3rd Jul 2020, 12:36
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It's standard for the US Marine Corp
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 13:36
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Sounds like US Marine Corps Lt. General Lewis "Chesty" Puller. He is often cited as the reason why US Marine Corps officers in the field eat after the enlisted men.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 15:44
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I think this concept has been around for centuries or even millienia among good leaders, expressed in many different ways. So it may be hard to nail down exactly who thought of it first, as well as who expressed it first in any particular form.

The U.S. Marine version is the pithiest: "Officers eat last." And it certainly fits with Chesty Puller's approach to command - the fact that he lost his commission a few times in his early career (for bureaucratic, not performance, reasons) no doubt kept him very sympathetic to the needs of the "men."

It has been adopted for a book-title on business management, rephrased (yet again) as Leaders Eat Last.

A Chesty-Pullerism, perhaps apocryphal: Came across a young looey disciplining a private for failing to salute. The discipline was to salute 100 times. "Very good," said Puller, "but remember that an officer must return every salute he receives. So now I'll stand here and count while you return all 100 salutes!"

Oorah!
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 16:21
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I always see to my dog before breakfast or tea. I dry the dog first etc.

My son in law, ex Army SNCO makes his dog wait 12 years in the RAF didn't get the Army out of the man.
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Old 5th Jul 2020, 17:51
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A. P. Ocryphal, I think.
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