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US Politics Hamsterwheel V3.0

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US Politics Hamsterwheel V3.0

Old 29th May 2020, 12:42
  #101 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: RH11 UK
Posts: 105
Seems Trump doesnt know who coined the phrase "when the looting starts, the shooting starts" and under what era and circumstance. Otherwise he wouldn't have posted it on the official White House twitter page. Stupid moron!!
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Old 29th May 2020, 12:52
  #102 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
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Originally Posted by Uncle Fred View Post
Could someone please clarify: Does the President have direct control over the National Guard? I thought that purview fell to the state governors.

Eventually though, they are part of the U.S. military are they not and thus under the CINC?
It is a bit complicated. Simplifying:

The Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, which ended Reconstruction and the occupation of the former Confederacy by Federal troops following our Civil War, generally puts restrictions on using the Army (and later, Air Force), and the National Guard units of both, to act as Federal law enforcement within the US. But there are exceptions, both in law and in practice.

For example, the use of the 101st Airborne Division (Army), and federalizing the Arkansas National Guard, removing it from the control of the segregationist Arkansas Governor, in enforcing desegregation of the Little Rock (AR) High School in 1957 by Pres. Eisenhower. Which was done at the request of the Little Rock Mayor. And in a handful of other situations over the years, usually at the request of local/State government, including 1992 race riots.

And of course, Federal troops can back up local governments in terms of manpower in natural disasters such as hurricanes and floods, providing logistics, housing, transport, traffic control, etc. And since a 2006 revision of the Act, in cases of terror attacks.

It may be moot, and just Trump bluster, at this point, since the Minnesota Gov. has already deployed the state's National Guard to Minneapolis. Although DJT is known for jumping in and taking credit for what others do.
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Old 29th May 2020, 13:27
  #103 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Middle America
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
These episodes, both the original offensive act and the offensive reactive behavior have become far too repetitive.
What to do?
How about stop repeating the same action in the hopes of a different outcome. Stop electing urban Democrat mayors, who bend to the will of the public employee unions, and appoint leaders (police commissioners, for example) of the basis of their identity, rather than their willingness to change the culture.
Clearly the values and ethics of Democrat mayors are not working. They have run these cities for years, full of promises but short on results. As a result, police departments, as in MSP and Chicago are more corrupt than ever.
So Democratic mayors are all bad? Just eliminate the opposing Party at the local level to gain complete control. I can name at least four of five instances where this ploy was successful. The successful four or five were all Fascists and followed the Fascist playbook as you are suggesting... Still hating the word or using it?

TD
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Old 29th May 2020, 13:35
  #104 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Thank you Pattern.

On another note. I admit that I do not have experience in constabulary duties and I fully appreciate how difficult it must be to handle rioting and violent protest. Yet if one is to going to give the constabulary the authority to implement what is a de facto death sentence for property damage and theft, then one would think that this would be a serious decision worthy of consultation with the governor, police force, etc. and not just a tweet...

It is for the citizenry of the U.S. to decide if it is in accord with Mr. Trump's apparent policy of a death penalty for these crimes. The next hours should prove interesting.
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Old 29th May 2020, 14:33
  #105 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
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Originally Posted by WhatsaLizad? View Post
Where is your data Dea? Last time I heard, we were over-reporting. There would have to be a massive coordinated cover up to statistically affect those numbers. Doctors, Coroners, Nurses, Hospital and Nursing Home staff would have to be lying, so where is your proof? Mine is the data posted regarding the US compared to the UK. The same numbers are true if you compare the US population Covid stats to the combined population stats of the largest European countries.

If you live in L.A. , ask the following question to your fellow Angelinos. Which population has the higher Covid-19 death rate, the USA under Trump's leadership, or the combined populations of the UK, France, Italy, Germany, Spain which closely equals the US?

I doubt a single person in L.A. will name the USA as performing better. Probably not many here either.

A few days ago those countries mentioned above have 40,000+ more deaths than the US with the same population, and only Germany had a lower death rate. The German rate is admirable and a standard to be modeled after, but it also compares closely to that of Florida's run by Governor DeSantis.
Our local community paper cites 1493 known cases of COVID19 with 238 known deaths. Our doctors and hospitals learned proning and better disease management early on, may account. for our relatively low death rates. We are a small city in LA County. My fellow citizens have been compliant with Stay at Home and social distancing,/ masks and gloves. I haven’t been out much since I got home from Europe March 19th. Streets are quiet, air quality very good, seems most non essential businesses are closed. Many restaurants are doing free delivery or contactless pick up. Grocery store will delivery free of charge. Most folks I know are proud of our Gov Newsom’s handling of the situation. We are beginning a slow opening of services. I’m proud of my fellow citizens. Mayor Garcetti is fine. We have good relations with Oregon and Washington State. We’ve shared resources. I can’t think of any way my State and hometown could have done better.

Trump told the Governors to take care of their own States Ny and CA didn’t break stride. We are “ donor States” so rather than argue with an ignorant idiot, we saw to our own.

Last edited by Dea Certe; 29th May 2020 at 14:46. Reason: Added last sentence
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Old 29th May 2020, 15:17
  #106 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: FL, USA
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Dea,
Not sure how your reply answers my questions, I asked you what evidence you offer of underreporting CV19 deaths. I also asked about the perception of your fellow LA citizens about Trump's handling of CV19 vs Europe. I don't subscribe to the overreporting story just as I don't to your claim of underreporting deaths.

I am on the other side of the country. It sounds like Newsome has mitigated deaths and you have a high opinion of Him. Some actions appeared to be muffed up, just as in my state of Florida. I think considering the results, Florida Governor DeSantis is performing equally well as Governor Newsome.
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Old 29th May 2020, 15:19
  #107 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
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Originally Posted by Dea Certe View Post
Our local community paper cites 1493 known cases of COVID19 with 238 known deaths. Our doctors and hospitals learned proning and better disease management early on, may account. for our relatively low death rates. We are a small city in LA County. My fellow citizens have been compliant with Stay at Home and social distancing,/ masks and gloves. I havenít been out much since I got home from Europe March 19th. Streets are quiet, air quality very good, seems most non essential businesses are closed. Many restaurants are doing free delivery or contactless pick up. Grocery store will delivery free of charge. Most folks I know are proud of our Gov Newsomís handling of the situation. We are beginning a slow opening of services. Iím proud of my fellow citizens. Mayor Garcetti is fine. We have good relations with Oregon and Washington State. Weíve shared resources. I canít think of any way my State and hometown could have done better.

Trump told the Governors to take care of their own States Ny and CA didnít break stride. We are ď donor StatesĒ so rather than argue with an ignorant idiot, we saw to our own.
Wait until the property taxes go through the roof to meet the loss of tax revenue.

Already hearing the faint chorus of ďIts for the childrenĒ.

Newsom et al really showed their colors, including a Veterans Home (One with a 5 star rating) to be closed in the current budget proposal to save money, two days later he proudly announces $75 million of our taxpayers money to be given to illegal aliens!

Ain't that a kick in the teeth.

Lots of folks not happy with his latest budget proposal.

Yes, I do live in SoCal.
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Old 29th May 2020, 15:39
  #108 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: FL, USA
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Originally Posted by Revnetwork View Post
WhatsaLizad, Your news about over-reporting is most certainly wrong. Think about it. Dont just swallow Fox News without thinking. Almost every country in the world is under-reporting. Some more than others.
I see you trying to use data from UK, Italy, France and Spain to justify your arguments. Kindly compare similar data from other parts of Europe including Germany, Denmark, Norway and others, or Australia and New Zealand. Maybe it will be clear to you that Trump's inaction for an entire month in February has cost more lives than should have been. Same as Boris Johnson and his clueless band over here. Why is Trump shouting about China's cover-up when ALL countries had the same information at the same time. Some decided to take action and prepare while Trump after having initially praised Chairman Xi and China's handling of the pandemic said "it's just a little flu that will magically go away". DUMB.
I mentioned the overreporting issue sarcastically. I'm sure it happens sometimes, just like underreporting. When this dies down, the real numbers won't lie, just as the excess fatalities from the European heat wave years ago were proven.

Spare me the condescending comment about Fox News. If you read my post, I included numbers for Germany. Just as in the USA, there are low infection areas like Germany for whatever reasons. As for the rest, read my post again. I used large adjoined countries in Europe with similar demographics with a total combined population of the USA. I didn't include Denmark, Norway or even more ridiculously as you suggest, New Zealand in my numbers due to their differences in demographics and social behavior from the USA. I also don't know the politics or skill of Europe leaders of the countries I used. I do know their combined results suck and are much worse than the USA and many people including those here are hell bent at focusing on Trump. He surely hasn't been right in all his blustering, yes, I wish he would shut up, but he has also been right about some things with China.
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Old 29th May 2020, 15:50
  #109 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: California
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Originally Posted by fltlt View Post
Wait until the property taxes go through the roof to meet the loss of tax revenue.
...
Yes, I do live in SoCal.
Do you? Then you must be aware of Prop 13, which caps property taxes.
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Old 29th May 2020, 16:26
  #110 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: surfing, watching for sharks
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Originally Posted by MarcK View Post
Do you? Then you must be aware of Prop 13, which caps property taxes.
No, it doesnít cap property taxes, it caps the % rate of increase of property taxes, something completely different to what you wrote.

As FltLt is a resident of SoCal, itís quite possible heís referring to the split roll ballot initiative backed by democrats and unions that would generate significantly higher revenues, at least in part through higher property taxes, essentially rolling back prop 13.

Howard would be rolling in his grave.


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Old 29th May 2020, 16:42
  #111 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Los Angeles, CA USA
Posts: 27
Originally Posted by fltlt View Post
Wait until the property taxes go through the roof to meet the loss of tax revenue.

Already hearing the faint chorus of ďIts for the childrenĒ.

Newsom et al really showed their colors, including a Veterans Home (One with a 5 star rating) to be closed in the current budget proposal to save money, two days later he proudly announces $75 million of our taxpayers money to be given to illegal aliens!

Ain't that a kick in the teeth.

Lots of folks not happy with his latest budget proposal.

Yes, I do live in SoCal.
are you talking about the Veterans home is Barstow? Thereís lots of unhappiness about that as well as the lack of care for our homeless vets. What money given to ďillegal aliensĒ? Iím waiting to see how the recovery goes if our country can manage meaningful recovery from the COVID19 crisis. Weíre still working on the NoCal fire recovery. (My cousins got burned out. Lucky they had excellent insurance. Sad my cousin was in the middle of cancer treatment on top of all this)

Iím happy living in California, thatĎs why Iím still here.
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Old 29th May 2020, 17:00
  #112 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
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Originally Posted by WhatsaLizad? View Post
Dea,
Not sure how your reply answers my questions, I asked you what evidence you offer of underreporting CV19 deaths. I also asked about the perception of your fellow LA citizens about Trump's handling of CV19 vs Europe. I don't subscribe to the overreporting story just as I don't to your claim of underreporting deaths.

I am on the other side of the country. It sounds like Newsome has mitigated deaths and you have a high opinion of Him. Some actions appeared to be muffed up, just as in my state of Florida. I think considering the results, Florida Governor DeSantis is performing equally well as Governor Newsome.
what evidence do I have about under-reporting COVID19 deaths? I have in-laws in NYC and MA. News reports at the beginning of the crisis was covering the lack of morgue and funeral home space for incoming bodies. Bodies were being stored in refrigerated trucks. Mass graves being dug. Too many bodies, not enough coroner staff to manage. This isnít an opinion, itís fact. Gov Cuomo has done a very good job helping his citizens and doing his best to keep the public informed. What evidence do you have the deaths are over reported in FLA?

in any case, the future looks to be bleak for all of us. It may take a 10-20 years to make a financial recovery. Some businesses will never come back. Unemployment going to be high as we donít have much wealth producing industry in our shores. I see China rising. Grateful Iím in my final years.
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Old 29th May 2020, 17:59
  #113 (permalink)  
 
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Gov Cuomo has done a very good job helping his citizens and doing his best to keep the public informed

What information have you sourced to develop your opinion of his overall performance?
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Old 29th May 2020, 18:38
  #114 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Hanging off the end of a thread
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That American Ex policeman has been charged with murder and manslaughter.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52854025
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Old 29th May 2020, 18:49
  #115 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
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Originally Posted by Dea Certe View Post
what evidence do I have about under-reporting COVID19 deaths? I have in-laws in NYC and MA. News reports at the beginning of the crisis was covering the lack of morgue and funeral home space for incoming bodies. Bodies were being stored in refrigerated trucks. Mass graves being dug. Too many bodies, not enough coroner staff to manage. This isnít an opinion, itís fact. Gov Cuomo has done a very good job helping his citizens and doing his best to keep the public informed. What evidence do you have the deaths are over reported in FLA?

in any case, the future looks to be bleak for all of us. It may take a 10-20 years to make a financial recovery. Some businesses will never come back. Unemployment going to be high as we donít have much wealth producing industry in our shores. I see China rising. Grateful Iím in my final years.
Dea, first of all, my thoughts are with the victims and their families during this terrible Pandemic.

Continuing on with your "evidence":
My guess is your in-laws aren't health statisticians. If they are, my apologies.
The news reports of morgue and funeral space, refrigerated trucks are directly related to the 30,000 excess deaths during this tragedy. That is no basis for an undercount claim.
Mass graves being dug? Extra graves have been dug on Hart Island for unclaimed bodies. They typically bury 1200 bodies a year, as of yesterday, they have buried 6 times the usual rate. That might be 2000 extra deaths. Terrible, but the only mass grave I am aware of in NY.

What evidence do I have of over reporting deaths in FL? Try reading my post again. I said I don't subscribe to that theory.

There might be an uncounted number of Covid deaths at home, my guess that is some amount. The numbers will show excess deaths at some point if they exist.

You apparently have no information to back up your claim.
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Old 29th May 2020, 19:22
  #116 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by West Coast View Post
No, it doesnít cap property taxes, it caps the % rate of increase of property taxes, something completely different to what you wrote.
Yeah. 2% per year.

Originally Posted by West Coast View Post
As FltLt is a resident of SoCal, itís quite possible heís referring to the split roll ballot initiative backed by democrats and unions that would generate significantly higher revenues, at least in part through higher property taxes, essentially rolling back prop 13.

Howard would be rolling in his grave.
I wasn't aware that FltLt had commercial property. Yes, that rate may go up. Private property rates can only increase 2% per year.
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Old 29th May 2020, 20:28
  #117 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: US
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Originally Posted by West Coast View Post
No, it doesnít cap property taxes, it caps the % rate of increase of property taxes, something completely different to what you wrote.

As FltLt is a resident of SoCal, itís quite possible heís referring to the split roll ballot initiative backed by democrats and unions that would generate significantly higher revenues, at least in part through higher property taxes, essentially rolling back prop 13.

Howard would be rolling in his grave.
Spot on!

One thing that a lot of folks here in lala land donít realize is that it caps not only the residential tax rates but also commercial.

Why does that matter, because an awful lot of land is zoned CR xxxxx.
Prior to Prop 13 a lot of folks lost their propertyís due to being taxed at the Commercial rate even when the land they occupied wasnít suitable/adaptable for commercial use.
Prop 13 will fall if folks donít push back, hard.

On a side note, I happen to own some CR property, you donít want to hear the 18 month saga it took to finish building a house on it, the County Planning folks where I live have a totally distorted view of city/suburb/County land use.

Suffice it to say I actually bought a backhoe, installed autonomous operation on it, then informed the County Supervisor that he and his staff were invited, along with the news crew to attend the demolition of a half finished house, built by their book and regulations.
That forced them, along with literally A-Z of local politicians visiting the site, then asking them WTF Over, to reasses their position in order to actually complete the construction.

I will NEVER, EVER build anything in San Bernardino County again.

And if you are curious, before I even had an Architect draw up plans, I took the local County Building Inspector up to the proposed site and asked him if there was any reason why I couldnít build there.
No was his answer.
If he had said Yes, then I have a couple of other places I would have built on instead.
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Old 29th May 2020, 20:35
  #118 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Originally Posted by MarcK View Post
Yeah. 2% per year.


I wasn't aware that FltLt had commercial property. Yes, that rate may go up. Private property rates can only increase 2% per year.

Many, many folks run their small businesses out of their houses. The question that's been asked and avoided by the architects of the initiative (at least in writing) is will that allow under a split roll system for those residences to be taxed at a rate greater than prop 13 allowances.
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Old 29th May 2020, 20:39
  #119 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: US
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Originally Posted by Dea Certe View Post
are you talking about the Veterans home is Barstow? Thereís lots of unhappiness about that as well as the lack of care for our homeless vets. What money given to ďillegal aliensĒ? Iím waiting to see how the recovery goes if our country can manage meaningful recovery from the COVID19 crisis. Weíre still working on the NoCal fire recovery. (My cousins got burned out. Lucky they had excellent insurance. Sad my cousin was in the middle of cancer treatment on top of all this)

Iím happy living in California, thatĎs why Iím still here.
CalVets did a report on every Vets home in CA, at the request of, wait for it, drum roll please, the state of CA Late last year. The Barstow facility received 5 stars rating across the board. that was late last/early this year. CalVets recommendation was to keep it open.

Yes, in the past they have had problems, all of which have been corrected.

I would suggest you look online for video of Newsom proudly announcing the money for illegals.

The fires up North, bad times for all those that lost lives and property, however when the State Govt acts as insurer of last resort of that particular utility and PG&E donít perform equipment/maintenance Inspections and their equipment fails, causing the fire, that should raise alarm bells.
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Old 29th May 2020, 22:15
  #120 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
That American Ex policeman has been charged with murder and manslaughter.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-52854025
Thank goodness there is somebody obvious to punish for systemic racism. Hopefully we can all get back to normal soon.
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