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US Politics Hamsterwheel V3.0

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US Politics Hamsterwheel V3.0

Old 21st Jun 2020, 20:56
  #801 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: E.Wash State
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Well, Oicur, what exactly do you propose as a mechanism for "change"? We have only the ballot box, and here in the US you vote for one or the other party, unless you choose, as is your right, to throw out your vote by choosing one of the lesser candidates.
What would you prefer? Should "protesters" determine American policy and dictate American culture? That's simply Mob rule, and we all know from history what eventually comes out of that. Totalitarian rule. Or perhaps we need a "ruling class" to tell us what to do and how to think. That's not a new idea either.

Which is why, just as you say, Trump was elected as an antidote to the two party control -- to drain the swamp, as we say. He has made some progress, but it is a difficult and long term process, as the swamp is very well entrenched -- many snouts, large trough.

So if you really belief what you are writing, whether you like the man or not, you should be a Trump voter. I welcome you to our club.

If on the other hand you prefer to simply natter on with no opinion as to the way forward -- well don't expect me to take you seriously.
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Old 21st Jun 2020, 21:27
  #802 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
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Oicur

Good posts. A concise description of how many people understand the current state of affairs. Unfortunately the person responding to your posts has got themselves so brainwashed that they are simply not reading what you have written and, as usual, are arguing against a position that they attribute to you. Frustrating. Best ignored.
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Old 21st Jun 2020, 22:46
  #803 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
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Apparently only Trump could fire Berman. After Barr tried to unlawfully fire him he said the President agreed to the firing. Trump then said "I'm not involved". We know, of course, he lied and we also know why Berman was to be fired. However, if the President says he wasn't involved and Barr cannot by law fire him: is Berman now dfired or not?
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 00:36
  #804 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
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Originally Posted by lomapaseo View Post
Covid worries won out over cheering for Trump
Would his supporters be worried about Covid?

Those that had tickets were probably promised season tickets to all his rallys
Sounds like "cruel and unusual punishment" to me.
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 01:43
  #805 (permalink)  
 
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Earth to Wtsmg: Russia Russia Russia has fallen by the wayside. Quite a while back.

We're on Racist Racist Racist now. And He's Killing Grandma and Refuses To Do What We Tell Him To.

But he's still in office. And Berman is not.
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 03:33
  #806 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
Earth to Wtsmg: Russia Russia Russia has fallen by the wayside. Quite a while back.

We're on Racist Racist Racist now. And He's Killing Grandma and Refuses To Do What We Tell Him To.

But he's still in office. And Berman is not.
No, Russia, Russia, Russia is still very much alive and well, with some posters here on PPRuNe. Interesting that Berman was a Trump appointee; do you really like the purging of non-ass kissers? An independent judicial system (imagine the scales of justice if you can, blindfolded and all) is basic to American democracy. It's curious to imagine what Republicans would be saying if it were Obama doing all the shit Trump is.... Are you capable of self examination?
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 03:54
  #807 (permalink)  
 
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An independent judicial system (imagine the scales of justice if you can, blindfolded and all
I guess, Winemaker, you missed the part where the United States Attorneys (i.e. "Federal prosecutors") job is to represent the government. As such, they are appointed by, and are subject to, the President. Always have been. Clinton fired them all at once. So did Obama. These subtleties of the way things work only seem to arouse your outrage when done by Republicans.

The Assistant US Attorney is the career DOJ employee. The US Attorney is political.

Shooting off your mouth at your boss is a sure way to get canned, and has nothing at all to do with "the scales of justice".

So yes, I suggest you go back to Russia Russia Russia -- that's worked out real well for you.

But as you say:
Are you capable of self examination?
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 04:38
  #808 (permalink)  
 
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Ain't just talkin' about firing attorneys general... and you know what I mean.
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 06:25
  #809 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: RH11 UK
Posts: 106
Winemaker,

You're wasting your time with these guys. The brain washing is so much worse than I saw in my time in the Soviet Union. At least over there, when no one was watching or listening the guys would agree that their system was s**t.
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 12:49
  #810 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Germany
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Breaking news:
The Leader of the free world demonstrates to the world and his 6,200 followers that he can drink water from a glass with one hand, albeit assisted by his pinky.
He also demonstrated that he lives in an alternate world through saying he ran down 10 feet of a ramp. 10 feet that only he could see.
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 18:38
  #811 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Revnetwork View Post
Winemaker,

You're wasting your time with these guys. The brain washing is so much worse than I saw in my time in the Soviet Union. At least over there, when no one was watching or listening the guys would agree that their system was s**t.

No way

The majority of us over here feel that Trump is s**t
But rational voters realize that the competition is a bigger nothing, even though they are nice guys and gals

So it's understandable that outsidere just see the s**t and not the solution. of guys like me
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 19:20
  #812 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
I guess, Winemaker, you missed the part where the United States Attorneys (i.e. "Federal prosecutors") job is to represent the government. As such, they are appointed by, and are subject to, the President. Always have been. Clinton fired them all at once. So did Obama. These subtleties of the way things work only seem to arouse your outrage when done by Republicans.

The Assistant US Attorney is the career DOJ employee. The US Attorney is political.

Shooting off your mouth at your boss is a sure way to get canned, and has nothing at all to do with "the scales of justice".
obgraham, Sorry to warn you, but you are putting out false information. Perhaps I am not understanding your lingo regarding titles, but Assistant US AGs or Federal Prosecutors are nominated by the POTUS and are examined and confirmed or rejected by the US Senate. In certain cases they can represent a plaintiff or defendant against the Government. The term is for 4 years. GW Bush changed it to a life time appointment as part of the Patriot Act, but Congress changed it back. The President nominates the Assistant Solicitor General who's role it is to argue Government cases before the US Supreme Court. and is examined and confirmed or rejected by the US Senate. Indeed, the US Attorney General is nominated by the POTUS and is examined and confirmed or rejected by the US Senate. The issue today for the US Attorney General, as it was in the Nixon Watergate era, is politicizing the Department of Justice he is in charge of.

The Attorney General has a complicated role in terms of who he serves. He serves the President, he serves the Government and he serves the people of the United States in providing equal justice under the law. As in the Nixon era, the current balance of service, on appearance, has been tilted to only serving the President who is trying to operate as a king, only being prevented by the US Constitution.

The issue with Barr is his disagreement with the top Federal Prosecutor of the Southern District of New York, Geoffrey Berman. Barr wanted Berman to issue a letter to Mayor of NYC criticizing his enforcing of social-distancing rules for church assemblies but not protests, claiming it was a double standard. Berman disagreed and refused to write the letter on the basis of it being a double standard as Barr claimed. In fact, church assemblies are not mentioned or covered in the Constitution, but protests are covered in the Constitution's First Amendment, legally Berman did the correct thing IMO. So the upset Barr decided to remove Berman of his duties, and then subsequently found out he didn't have the power to do that. So then Barr went to Trump and Trump fired Berman which he has the power to do.

Clearly you should be able to see the tilting of the roles of President and Attorney General as becoming more and more political and less serving of the Government and the people. Unquestionably, Barr is only doing Trump's bidding...

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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 20:55
  #813 (permalink)  
 
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Sorry, Turbine, you don't have the correct terminology and line of authority here.

There are 93 "United States Attorneys". They serve at the will of the president and are indeed confirmed by the Senate. They serve under the supervision of tbe Attorney General, and are responsible to him, and carry out his directives (and by implication, the President's.) If they disagree, they are subject to dismissal.

An "assistant US attorney" is an employee of the DOJ, and as such is not a political appointee, but rather subject to civil service procedures regarding hiring and firing..

I confess I am not sure how far down the tree of Deputy, Assistant, or Deputy Assistant you go at the US Attorney General office before you are not a presidential appointee.

Feel free to correct me, but show your work, don't just spout talking points.

Last edited by obgraham; 22nd Jun 2020 at 23:13. Reason: Damn fingers don't work right any more
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 20:59
  #814 (permalink)  
 
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Black Sun, there is nothing to stop the Dems from choosing someone else, as there is not yet a nominee. In reality it would require Biden to toss the towel. That could still happen.
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 21:04
  #815 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
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Originally Posted by Black Sun View Post
Would it be possible for an alternative candidate representing the Democrats to step forward at this late date?
If not, would it be due to the Rules or a matter of not being able to do enough deals with the various powerfull lobbies in the little time left so that they stood a chance of getting somewhere? (I'm sure money comes into also of course)
Otherwise It seems that just as in 2016 Americans are going to have to choose between two awfull candidates
I can't honestly pretend to feel sorry for you guys, it seems we in the UK have entered the same downward spiral of increasing corruption and ineptness in our government and can only blame ourselves for putting these clowns in power.

What a depressing state of affairs
at the National Convention, the delegates will be polled for just who they are voting for, Many of the delegates are bound by what their state primary rules actually say. So I'm guessing that it's possible that the front runner may not get the nomination on the first poll. If that happens all kinds of deals will happen behind the scene and some competitors may emerge ( I still have a chance to open up the voting again and again until the new pope is nominated.
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 21:29
  #816 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by lomapaseo View Post
No way

The majority of us over here feel that Trump is s**t
But rational voters realize that the competition is a bigger nothing, even though they are nice guys and gals

So it's understandable that outsidere just see the s**t and not the solution. of guys like me
That can’t be true. No “rational” voter would vote for a child in a mans body. Even the status quo is better than him.

The man does have some serious mental deficiencies, and you want him holding the nuclear trigger?

I do agree there needs to be change. A complete 180 from the usual politician but not someone that can’t be taken seriously. The fact that he is a laughing stock to over half his country and pretty much everyone else in the world is diminishing the US’s role in world politics. Which is doing the opposite to
his slogan of “make America great again”!
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Old 22nd Jun 2020, 21:34
  #817 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
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"protesters" determine American policy and dictate American culture? That's simply Mob rule, and we all know from history what eventually comes out of that. Totalitarian rule.
You already have mob rule, it’s just that the mob wear suits and ties and work for Goldman Sachs and Lockheed Martin and Chevron and McKinsey. At least the protestors more closely represent the mood of the majority.

it is a difficult and long term process, as the swamp is very well entrenched -- many snouts, large trough.
Indeed, many snouts. Devos, Mnuchin, Ross, Perdue, Lighthizer. Tell me again when the draining of the swamp actually commences?

you should be a Trump voter
Perhaps, on some issues I would be.
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Old 23rd Jun 2020, 00:02
  #818 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
Sorry, Turbine, you don't have the correct terminology and line of authority here.

There are 93 "United States Attorneys". They serve at the will of the president and are indeed confirmed by the Senate. They serve under the supervision of tbe Attorney General, and are responsible to him, and carry out his directives (and by implication, the President's.) If they disagree, they are subject to dismissal.

An "assistant US attorney" is an employee of the DOJ, and as such is not a political appointee, but rather subject to civil service procedures regarding hiring and firing..

I confess I am not sure how far down the tree of Deputy, Assistant, or Deputy Assistant you go at the US Attorney General office before you are not a presidential appointee.

Feel free to correct me, but show your work, don't just spout talking points.
Sorry Obgraham, But you are totally out of your realm of understanding. Best you go back and learn the roles and responsibilities of those you don't even report correctly in your original posting... Is this your weak confession of making a mistake? It is the same illness Trump suffers from, "i'm never wrong." Ego at it's best...

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Old 23rd Jun 2020, 00:07
  #819 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
Black Sun, there is nothing to stop the Dems from choosing someone else, as there is not yet a nominee. In reality it would require Biden to toss the towel. That could still happen.
Obgraham, Why not send a tweet to Trump and suggest he throw in the towel. Would make the majority of American voters happy.. 6000 instead of 19000 and many more in OK, give everyone a break...
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Old 23rd Jun 2020, 00:51
  #820 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Location: Waterfall
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Originally Posted by Dark Knight View Post
I won’t kneel with the masses,
I won’t be told my fate,
By people who hijack tragedy,
To perpetuate their...
Doggerel snipped.

Hallmark called to offer you a job.
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