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Black lives donít really matter London March.

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Black lives donít really matter London March.

Old 12th Jun 2020, 10:52
  #301 (permalink)  
 
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It would appear Black lives Matter only when its not a black person doing the crime, when it is a black on black death you do not hear anything about it from them..

Re the link posted by ORAC

This is likely to be a mindless attack by racists in response…
So a white person [allegedly] damaging or destroying a statue of a black person is racist, a black person destroying a statue or a white person isn't? curious.


One wonders when the US are going to burn the Declaration of Independence or snowpak out the signatures of the slave owners that signed it?
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 10:55
  #302 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by The Nip View Post
This is a Tweet copied from the Mayor of London.

To anyone planning to join #BlackLivesMatter protests over the coming days: for you and your families safety, please stay at home and find a safe way to make your voice heard.
To the extreme far-right groups hijacking this crucial cause: Londoners have no time for your hatred
.

So the injury to the dozens of Police last weekend were the actions of the far right!
The videos, reports, media at the time, clearly showed it was not only white people rioting. They clearly had signs with BLM on.
One particular picture shows a young black man picking up a bike and throwing it at a mounted police officer.

But Mr Khan fails to acknowledge this, or the disgusting attack on two police officers in Hackney on Wednesday. One of those police officers is a young black female that was treated as a football.
People intent on criminal damage and attacking statues - we'd love to have you but just not this weekend - we love you!
People trying to defend statues from criminal damage - stay away fascist hate mongers

Khan is an absolute disgrace
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 10:59
  #303 (permalink)  
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From the Daily Express

A British black person is twice as likely to die in police custody than any other ethnicity.

in the past 10 years 163 people in England and Wales according to the IOPC.

If these 140 were white and 13 were b​​​​​lack.
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 11:03
  #304 (permalink)  
 
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PN I just don't get that. Is it what you meant to write ?
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 11:05
  #305 (permalink)  
 
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This person deserves to lose her job

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...mpression=true
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 11:27
  #306 (permalink)  
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PN, rifruffian. An American report on those figures drilling down. presumable thy are neutral on UK affairs. Worth reading in full as the two cases they cite are where the police were called out to deal with black males suffering psychotic episodes (apologises if that's the wrong term).

As an analogy, its the same problem you get when you put the army on the street to deal with crime, they react as they're trained and the result is always bad. But equally I can't see a normal ambulance crew dealing with such incidents.

https://abcnews.go.com/International...ry?id=71054650

....Are black deaths in police custody in the U.K. comparable with the U.S.?

Figures from 1990 listing the number of deaths in England in police custody show that the proportion of black and minority deaths is roughly equal to the demographic breakdown.

Looking within the minority breakdown -- the figures show that black deaths (excluding other minorities) on their own were overrepresented in the number of deaths in police custody compared to the national demographic. Furthermore, independent analysis of the figures found that where use of force or restraint was applied, black and minority individuals were twice as likely to die in police custody than white individuals.

What story does the data tell us about black deaths in custody?

Methods of data collection and classification are important factors to consider. Different watchdogs and agencies compile numbers differently.

The national police watchdog counts deaths in custody only where arrests were made, and excluding deaths while in prison - other agencies or campaign groups cast a wider net.

As a report by another police watchdog group found, figures included people who had died after being reported missing to the police: "The police generally did not have direct contact with the deceased in these circumstances."

The watchdog also found a large prevalence of mental health disorders among the number of people who had died while in, or following, police custody or contact. Figures from 2018-2019 show that over two-thirds of the people who died were found to have mental health disorders.

In many cases, emergency calls motivated by a concern of welfare were directed to police, who arrived first on the scene -- and not social care or medical workers specifically trained to deal with mental health emergencies.......

Last edited by ORAC; 12th Jun 2020 at 11:42.
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 11:37
  #307 (permalink)  
 
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Some good news

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-53020887
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 11:54
  #308 (permalink)  
 
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There's a mention on the BBC news of a young black man who's received a lot of Facebook hate for setting fire to the Cenotaph's Union Jack when in fact it was it was a woman dressed in a similar jacket to blame. That's the power of instant trial and verdict by 'social media'.
The thing that struck me about the article was a photograph of him holding a placard stating 'The UK Invented Racism'. Now he's clearly intelligent as he's a graduate and a tutor and he says at the end of the article that [misidentification] 'shows the importance of fact-checking'. Of course, it's vital.
Well, surely he should have been aware of the facts that inter-tribal hatred, wars and massacres have been going on in Africa, Asia and the Middle East for centuries and even recently, for example, we've had Tutsis v Hutus, Ndebele v Shona, Dogon v Fulani, Congolese slaughters, the discriminatory Indian caste system, Sunni v Shia and straying a little, Bosnia. Racism isn't solely a white hatred of non-white and was in existence long before Britain became the UK.
It seems a lot of entertainment figures are queuing up to support the BLM movement, which is commendable as they obviously have a large influence on younger people but I think it's ridiculous when I read of some tenuous link between musicians Lady Antebellum and slavery has caused them to change the band name to Lady A. Quote: '...we are regretful and embarrassed to say that we did not take into account the associations that weigh down this word referring to the period of history before the civil war, which includes slavery.' I'll bet that the great majority of listeners had no problem with the word before and probably didn't even know what it broadly meant: Occurring or existing before a particular war, especially the US Civil War. I certainly didn't.
As for the calls to remove historical artefacts that don't align with the BLM viewpoint, they'll never stop once they get their own way a couple of times. It's going to be a valid cause hijacked by zealots. Look at Palmyra if you want to see evidence of eliminating cultural architecture.

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Old 12th Jun 2020, 12:18
  #309 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by stevef View Post
There's a mention on the BBC news of a young black man who's received a lot of Facebook hate for setting fire to the Cenotaph's Union Jack when in fact it was it was a woman dressed in a similar jacket to blame. That's the power of instant trial and verdict by 'social media'.
The thing that struck me about the article was a photograph of him holding a placard stating 'The UK Invented Racism'. Now he's clearly intelligent as he's a graduate and a tutor and he says at the end of the article that [misidentification] 'shows the importance of fact-checking'. Of course, it's vital.
Well, surely he should have been aware of the facts that inter-tribal hatred, wars and massacres have been going on in Africa, Asia and the Middle East for centuries and even recently, for example, we've had Tutsis v Hutus, Ndebele v Shona, Dogon v Fulani, Congolese slaughters, the discriminatory Indian caste system, Sunni v Shia and straying a little, Bosnia. Racism isn't solely a white hatred of non-white and was in existence long before Britain became the UK.
It seems a lot of entertainment figures are queuing up to support the BLM movement, which is commendable as they obviously have a large influence on younger people but I think it's ridiculous when I read of some tenuous link between musicians Lady Antebellum and slavery has caused them to change the band name to Lady A. Quote: '...we are regretful and embarrassed to say that we did not take into account the associations that weigh down this word referring to the period of history before the civil war, which includes slavery.' I'll bet that the great majority of listeners had no problem with the word before and probably didn't even know what it broadly meant: Occurring or existing before a particular war, especially the US Civil War. I certainly didn't.
As for the calls to remove historical artefacts that don't align with the BLM viewpoint, they'll never stop once they get their own way a couple of times. It's going to be a valid cause hijacked by zealots. Look at Palmyra if you want to see evidence of eliminating cultural architecture.
The Palmyra comparison seems to have been what did for Farage at LBC
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 12:34
  #310 (permalink)  
 
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Interesting that Mayor Khan wants to remove statues of racists, but hasn't listed the statue of slave owning George Washington in Trafalgar Square....Presumably he isn't very good at history
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 12:35
  #311 (permalink)  
 
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Ironically, the more people - of every colour - that join the demonstrations and start appropriating the BLM gestures; the kneeling, the fist salute etc, the more diluted the actual message becomes. It ceases to become a ‘black’ message, merely a general protest and therefore, loses its impact and becomes viewed as merely disruptive.
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 12:44
  #312 (permalink)  
 
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Mayor Khan wants the statue of Nelson Mandela protected from vandalism. Was not Nelson M considered a terrorist in South Africa?

in association with the SACP he co-founded the militant Umkhonto we Sizwe in 1961 and led a sabotage campaign against the government.
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 13:41
  #313 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Georg1na View Post
Mayor Khan wants the statue of Nelson Mandela protected from vandalism. Was not Nelson M considered a terrorist in South Africa?
He was a racist and a convicted terrorist who remained on US terror watch lists until 2008! His crimes were far more recent than the supposed indiscretions of the figures Khan wants to scrub from history.
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 14:06
  #314 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Georg1na View Post
Mayor Khan wants the statue of Nelson Mandela protected from vandalism. Was not Nelson M considered a terrorist in South Africa?

in association with the SACP he co-founded the militant Umkhonto we Sizwe in 1961 and led a sabotage campaign against the government.
Some of the comments here are deplorable. Are you really going to defend the Apartheid government? Resistance to that was fully justified and branding Mandela as a terrorist is a far right trope.
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 14:21
  #315 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ORAC View Post
PN, rifruffian. An American report on those figures drilling down. presumable thy are neutral on UK affairs. Worth reading in full as the two cases they cite are where the police were called out to deal with black males suffering psychotic episodes (apologises if that's the wrong term).

As an analogy, its the same problem you get when you put the army on the street to deal with crime, they react as they're trained and the result is always bad. But equally I can't see a normal ambulance crew dealing with such incidents.

https://abcnews.go.com/International...ry?id=71054650

....Are black deaths in police custody in the U.K. comparable with the U.S.?

Figures from 1990 listing the number of deaths in England in police custody show that the proportion of black and minority deaths is roughly equal to the demographic breakdown.

Looking within the minority breakdown -- the figures show that black deaths (excluding other minorities) on their own were overrepresented in the number of deaths in police custody compared to the national demographic. Furthermore, independent analysis of the figures found that where use of force or restraint was applied, black and minority individuals were twice as likely to die in police custody than white individuals.

What story does the data tell us about black deaths in custody?

Methods of data collection and classification are important factors to consider. Different watchdogs and agencies compile numbers differently.

The national police watchdog counts deaths in custody only where arrests were made, and excluding deaths while in prison - other agencies or campaign groups cast a wider net.

As a report by another police watchdog group found, figures included people who had died after being reported missing to the police: "The police generally did not have direct contact with the deceased in these circumstances."

The watchdog also found a large prevalence of mental health disorders among the number of people who had died while in, or following, police custody or contact. Figures from 2018-2019 show that over two-thirds of the people who died were found to have mental health disorders.

In many cases, emergency calls motivated by a concern of welfare were directed to police, who arrived first on the scene -- and not social care or medical workers specifically trained to deal with mental health emergencies.......

Figures from 1990?
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 14:30
  #316 (permalink)  
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Vlieger. Mandela was convicted of conspiracy to cause an explosion, not to kill the white folk but to kill other members of his organisation who were not militant enough. Mandela escaped the rope by the skin of his teeth, it could not be proven that he actually handled the explosive, hence the conspiracy charges. Mandela was sentenced to life and towards the end of his sentence, about the fourteen year point, he was now president of the ANC and was asked to renounce violence as a means to the ANCs end, he refused to do so and under the terms of the state of emergency in SA at the time he remained in prison for another thirteen years. All this information was once available to the public in Pretoria, it may have been removed by now.

Mandela was a convicted terrorist regardless of the state of SA at the time, he was involved in the blowing up of people.
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 14:46
  #317 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by teeteringhead View Post
There is much talk in Liverpool - another City closely associated with the historic slave trade - of renaming the many streets named after slave traders. A fair enough (ish) idea.

But some thing tells cynical moi that they will not rename the Lane named after James Penny. Musn't affect the tourist trade eh!
Seems that Penny Lane has had it's sign defaced: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...yside-52992669
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 14:49
  #318 (permalink)  
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Golfbananajam,

If you follow the link in the story the statistics are since 1990 with the first table showing the figures for 2010-2019.

Nobidy seems to employ subeditors anymore......
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 14:50
  #319 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by VP959 View Post
Seems that Penny Lane has had it's sign defaced: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan...yside-52992669
More criminal damage - well done you just turned even more people against your 'cause'
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Old 12th Jun 2020, 14:51
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Originally Posted by double_barrel View Post
That vacuous phrase really infuriates me.

Of course all lives matter. No-one dispute that. But the issue here and now is that black lives are clearly valued less than white lives and that is the thing that needs to change. It's unbelievably arrogant for a white person living a relatively privileged life to object to people fighting for their basic human rights by saying 'oo, what about me, I matter too'.
The fact that you see people as black and white shows you discriminate and, to the progressives, are well worthy of the title of Racist. Congratulations.

These same morally superior, opinion pushing, social justice defining progressive crusaders see oppressor and victim wherever they look and for convenience today couple it directly with white and black. People like you facilitate them, demanding everyone else accede to your point of view. You want everyone else to change their morals to conform to what you would foist upon the world and you win because liberalism is about accepting other points of view, at the cost of social stability; everyone jumps in to define their boundaries and their demands of society in the Me Now sense of anything goes and whatever works for me. How fortunate for them a pandemic provides the excuse to hide behind masks as they raze the cities.

Enjoy your toppling. I expect you'll be there to clean up the mess after you're finished destroying the system.
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