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Electric scooters.

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Electric scooters.

Old 20th May 2020, 11:20
  #81 (permalink)  
 
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Which all goes to illustrate the nonsense of arbitrary limits on power, however measured or applied.
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Old 20th May 2020, 11:44
  #82 (permalink)  
 
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There should be zero tolerance of unapproved/uncertified e-crap being used on our roads and footpaths with instant loss of possesion and scrapping of them for breaching the rules. We seemed to have curtailed the plague of cheap high powered LED [email protected] that flooded the community a few years back with a lot of success, the same strict approach could be used to deal with this too.

In terms of policing this kind of thing I've found the usual social media outlets on community matters are quick to raise issues like this already, and if there was a buck in it for local councils then they would be onto it in no time with raising revenues.

I would advise to stay away from e-scooters, the experience of ownership often turns out to be not what you think which is something I see regularly working in town.
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Old 20th May 2020, 12:13
  #83 (permalink)  
 
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As menioned electric bikes are capable of speeds up to about 30MPH, so was the Fizzy of old, and that required a provisional, registering and testing, so why the difference simply because it is electric.. and after 77 they were limited to 35MPH

https://nationalmotormuseum.org.uk/v...ha-fs1e-fizzy/
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Old 20th May 2020, 12:36
  #84 (permalink)  
 
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The FS1E is an interesting example of getting around bureaucratic rules. I owned one back in the seventies when mopeds were derestricted speed wise, but had to be capable of being pedal powered. Accordingly, it had footrests that were pedals, and one would be rotated through 180į and then you could actually pedal it. However, anyone who has ever tried one in that mode soon realised that the gearing was so low it could never be used in practice. As for going up a hill that way, forget it. On the plus side, it was good for about 45mph. Maybe even 50 down a long hill.

When they changed the rules to restrict mopeds to 30mph, they did away with the pedal requirement, and many mopeds - I think the FS1E was one - derated the power by adding a longer throttle slide restricting the throttle opening. It was a 10 minute job with a hacksaw to derestrict it.

A lot of e bikes and e scooters won't even need that. A simple software change can modify them.

The rules will always be somewhat arbitrary, and enforcement won't be easy. As for the wisdom of riding an e scooter with tiny wheels and no suspension on your average British road, good luck with that. I still recall some of the humorous stories of people that owned petrol powered versions that they carried in their microlights and light aircraft. Darwin was sitting on their shoulders, and some of the accident reports were pretty amusing.
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Old 20th May 2020, 19:02
  #85 (permalink)  
 
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FS1E's......memories of some oik in the 70's and 80's making the exhaust and other parts more power friendly and tearing around the neighbourhood or town making a horrendous din that frightened babies and shocked the blue-rinse set.

I see people cycling on a seemingly normal bike that goes up hills in an unnaturally fast way for the effort used, it always catches me out for a few seconds before it twigs what's going on. The use of electric scooters has gone up massively since the lockdown and it catches people used to streets with little or no traffic unawares. I've witnessed a few near misses where the 'rider' is plugged into their smartphone's music app by way of over-ear earphone and in a transcendental state wizzing along silently at 25mph only to come into a dangerous situation with pedestrians crossing a silent and empty road....Yesterday some chap went past me riding on one of those wheel Segways, the kind where you stand on a 'pedal' either side of the wheel. He was doing 20mph through a park with kids and dogs and adults everywhere. He was wearing what looked like a gimp-mask and an all in one suit, but with headphones. Flash Gordon, one of Ming's soldiers is missing!

There was a well-known blogger killed on a scooter not so far from me some months back, on the road, earphones on and sadly didn't hear or see the large truck turning left. Unless we have proper cycle lanes everywhere, scooters and the like won't have a place in society. They don't belong on the pavement, the road is too dangerous and parks are just too busy with potential dangers around every corner.
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Old 20th May 2020, 21:13
  #86 (permalink)  
 
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I've seen these scooters for some time in Paris and I thought they would be a great thing for popping into town for some shopping here in the UK (if/when they are legalised). The only thing that bothers me is what you do with them when you get to the shops? They seem eminently knickable. How do you secure them?
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Old 20th May 2020, 21:26
  #87 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by SpringHeeledJack View Post
I see people cycling on a seemingly normal bike that goes up hills in an unnaturally fast way for the effort used, it always catches me out for a few seconds before it twigs what's going on.
I switched to an electric folding bike a few years ago. Hill climbing is probably the only time I use the electric assist, and living in a village with lots of steep hills the assistance is most welcome! My neighbour , who's at least a decade older than me, has a similar electric bike and it has enabled her to continue to ride around the village, deliver the parish magazine, etc, without having to resort to using her car. It might not be as good for exercise as a normal bike, but my view is that anything that keeps people riding, when they would otherwise have had to stop through old age, has to be a good thing.
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Old 21st May 2020, 08:25
  #88 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by VP959 View Post
my view is that anything that keeps people riding, when they would otherwise have had to stop through old age, has to be a good thing.
I'm a keen cyclist who has never owned an electric bike, but I agree totally. My day for one is coming.

Not just older people, but younger and less fit people looking for an enjoyable way into exercise can, and do, benefit from them. Great machines.
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Old 21st May 2020, 09:02
  #89 (permalink)  
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Just had an electric scooter unexpectedly overtake me at speed on the pavement - with the traffic, only heard it at the last moment. Silly bastard. Bikes and anything powered do not belong on pavements or footpaths.
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Old 21st May 2020, 11:59
  #90 (permalink)  
 
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A few observations.

It is a little unknown fact that old people's buggies and electric wheelchairs are legally required to have a switch setting that limits their speed to 4 point something MPH when used on UK pavements, I think it needs to be a key operated switch and not just a simple toggle or button.

Another little known fact, if you get prosecuted for cycling on the pavement, which is an offence, you will get a fine and points on your driving licence. This applies to non electric bicycles and electric assisted ones equally. A bicycle is seen as a vehicle in the eyes of the law and is thus not allowed on pavements or footpaths. It has been thus since the 1880s but the police don't seem bothered enough to take action unless someone gets hurt and then they throw the book at you.

Turning half the pavements around here into shared paths for cycles and pedestrians has done nothing but spread confusion. It is no longer clear where you should be with your bike. I note that those cyclists who take their hobby seriously don't use the shared paths as the risk/inconvenience to them and pedestrians is a deterant. Pedestrians are not disciplined to walk in straight lines and keep to one side of the path. They stop, turn or step to the side without warning. Once you take to the pavement/path on a bike you lose all right of way at every junction whereas if you ride on the road, with the traffic, you have the same rights of way as all of the other vehicles.

Motorist are just as likely to break the pavement/footpath laws as cyclists are. It is still against the law to drive along or park obstructing the pavement with a car. Near to us there is a small parade of shops. There is always some idiot motorists parked over the double yellow lines with two wheels on the pavement outside them. When they do this they break three laws rather than just the one. Again, the law just doesn't bother enforcing the rules. It is even more bizarre as several of the shops have free parking spaces behind and rear access.

There is not a delivery van driver in the country that can park without running two wheels up on the pavement!

Every time we go into town we see the remains of bikes chained to the railings in the bike park in the town centre. This puts me off using my bike for any visit unless I can keep an eye on it for the whole time I am there.

I can see the day coming when it will be possible to use an electric skateboard to get around. It could be picked up and taken into shops and restaurants and thus kept safe. As a bonus one would fit into the luggage rack on my aircraft unlike any of the folding bikes I have found so far........

When I was young, we were only allowed to use our bikes to get to school if we took the Cycling Proficiency Test first. The local police came to the school and we got trained and tested on our competence at operating our bikes. At the same time, the local bobby on the beat would give you a bollocking for not following the rules when out on our bikes. Now they don't give a toss and they wonder why the don't carry much respect.

Rans6........
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Old 21st May 2020, 12:06
  #91 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Vendee View Post
I've seen these scooters for some time in Paris and I thought they would be a great thing for popping into town for some shopping here in the UK (if/when they are legalised). The only thing that bothers me is what you do with them when you get to the shops? They seem eminently knickable. How do you secure them?
The ones in Paris you just leave it outside the shop and grab a new one when you come out.

they are great and are left all over the place so easy to find one, but unlike what some on here might say they arenít many times left in the way of pedestrians or otherwise a nuisance.

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Old 21st May 2020, 12:24
  #92 (permalink)  
 
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Germany has really gone big with electric bikes, and the choice is dizzying, if pricey. I agree that any mobility/exercise when older has to be a positive thing for those who would be otherwise restricted (especially in hilly areas).

As I went for a walk at 8.30am today, the Flash Gordon one-wheel kamikaze went by at approximately 30mph following a car down the road. Very foolish, ANY disruption and the rider would be flicked off and carry on at said speed either crashing into the ground or a stationary car. I've had a few higher speed crashes bike racing in the distant past and it takes a while for the road rash to heal and makes sleeping a nightmare. Perhaps he's a future organ-donor!
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Old 21st May 2020, 12:45
  #93 (permalink)  
 
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Rans6

Good post. More consistent enforcement of the law in many areas would help set a better standard and improve the living environment.

SHJ

I think coming off a scooter at 30mph is generally going to end badly. It isn’t going to absorb much energy in a collision like a bike. I am thinking collisions with cars, spills and collisions with inanimate objects. 30mph collisions with pedestrians or cyclists will generally be very ugly.



As has been said previously, there is a 15mph legal limit for electric bikes in the UK. Some European countries allow S-Pedelecs (but may restrict where they can be used). These do nearly 30mph and require registration (with identifying plate), insurance and some form of driving licence (and helmet?). They clearly also require a level of skill to ride safely beyond what most folk do on bicycles.

With leaps in battery technology, there is clearly scope for commuting with such vehicles. With the right infrastructure, a good part of a classic conflict could be resolved.

Last edited by Torquetalk; 21st May 2020 at 13:13.
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Old 21st May 2020, 13:01
  #94 (permalink)  
 
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In the advert on this page there is a scooter which has 10" wheels, front suspension and a (miniscule) rear disc break. It also has a seat. An absolute bargain at £1,200 or so...….

In what world should something like this be allowed on a walkway, it's a baby Vespa/Lambretta!!

The ones with small wheels and no suspension are going to have fun flicking their riders off on encountering a pothole or a stick on the road.....
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Old 21st May 2020, 13:11
  #95 (permalink)  
 
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Even the manually propelled ones are horrendous on anything but smooth tarmac. I used mine once to scoot a mile or so down the country lane to the nearest village. The vibrations nearly shook my teeth out and actually made my hands hurt.
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Old 21st May 2020, 13:16
  #96 (permalink)  
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The guy I saw on the scooter this morning was doing around 15-20mph I'd say. There is no frontage to the row of houses I live in, the doors open straight onto the pavement which is about 6-7' wide.

Saw a bloke of about 50 riding along the pavement on Limpsfield Road in Sanderstead last night - pavement is probably less than 5' wide. Not much traffic, no cars parked... totally unnecessary. I had a polite word as he squeezed past, no reply...

On a wide seaside promenade or similar it might be acceptable providing people are riding sensibly; ORAC mentioned the Under Cliff path east of Brighton which I'd think is a reasonable place, but not on narrow paths and pavements.

Anyone who's walked the lovely canal side paths in London will know that they are a favourite cycling route for many people, some of whom are the Clarksons of the cycling world and have no patience for groups of pedestrians getting in their way. Guess what? The tow paths were built for horses travelling at 4mph.



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Old 21st May 2020, 13:54
  #97 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by highflyer40 View Post
The ones in Paris you just leave it outside the shop and grab a new one when you come out.

they are great and are left all over the place so easy to find one, but unlike what some on here might say they arenít many times left in the way of pedestrians or otherwise a nuisance.
Yeah I know the Paris ones are app controlled hire scooters. I just wondered if a privately owned one in the UK would get separated from its owner pretty quickly.

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Old 21st May 2020, 15:12
  #98 (permalink)  
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In the advert on this page there is a scooter which has 10" wheels, front suspension and a (miniscule) rear disc break. It also has a seat. An absolute bargain at £1,200 or so...….
Better ones come at around £500 with 10” wheels with front and rear shock absorbers and disk brakes.

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/i...ruise-in-style
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Old 21st May 2020, 16:10
  #99 (permalink)  
 
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Probably too big to fit into your lift, Orac, but these fat-tyred electric scooters were introduced in Biarritz a couple of years ago.. they look a bit more roadworthy than the other type. The two lads try for Vmax down a hill and they reckon saw 45km/h..
The shop appears to have an electric Vespa-style scooter also.. again, probably not what you need. Here's another manufacturer.

Last edited by sidevalve; 21st May 2020 at 16:24.
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Old 21st May 2020, 19:21
  #100 (permalink)  
 
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ORAC, the 1,000W motor is 4 times the size allowed for an electric bike in the UK/EU!! Neat bit of kit though, much better designed than I expected.
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