cattletruck

It seems that at the noisy ends of the vaccination spectrum (pro/anti) it's just like them old battles between the communists and fascists, except it's hard to tell which side is which.

Ninthace

We can let Darwin decide who is right though

Ancient Observer

Perhaps a whole new thread?? "Darwin and the anti-vaxxers"

visibility3miles

Misdirected antibodies linked to severe COVID-19

https://www.nih.gov/news-events/nih-research-matters/misdirected-antibodies-linked-severe-covid-19

Alexandros Michailidis / Shutterstock.com

Researchers are learning why some people are barely affected by SARS-CoV-2 while others end up needing intensive care or dying.

The severity of COVID-19 can differ drastically between individuals. Some people never know they’ve been infected, while others may end up needing intensive care or dying from the disease.

Several factors have been associated with severe COVID-19, including preexisting health conditions like obesity, diabetes, and high blood pressure. Men are more likely to die of the disease than women. And the risk of dying from COVID-19 increases with age.

Researchers around the world have been looking for other risk factors for severe or fatal infection with SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes COVID-19. An international project called the COVID Human Genetic Effort has been searching for genetic and molecular differences that may increase the risk of severe COVID-19. The project is co-directed by Dr. Helen Su from NIH’s National Institute of Allergy and Infectious Diseases (NIAID) and Dr. Jean-Laurent Casanova from Rockefeller University.

Two recent studies from the project, led by Casanova, found that some severe cases of COVID-19 could be linked to problems with immune-system proteins called type I interferons (IFNs). These IFNs are needed to fight off viral infections. In rare cases, genetic conditions blocked the production of these proteins. But more commonly, antibodies that mistakenly targeted the IFNs were found in the blood of people with severe or fatal COVID-19.

To better understand how common these autoantibodies are, Casanova and his colleagues screened for them in blood samples taken from more than 3,500 people with severe or fatal COVID-19 and more than 34,000 uninfected volunteers from 38 different countries. The new study was funded in part by several NIH components, primarily NIAID. Results were published on August 19, 2021, in Science Immunology.

The team found that 20% of people hospitalized with severe COVID-19 had high or intermediate levels of autoantibodies to type I IFNs. Autoantibodies were also found in at least 18% of people who died from the disease. In contrast, people with no or mild symptoms had very low levels of these autoantibodies. The researchers estimate that the autoantibodies may account for about 20% of total fatal COVID-19 cases.

The risk of having such autoantibodies increased with age. For example, while fewer than 10% of people under the age of 40 with severe COVID-19 had active levels of these autoantibodies, more than 21% of those over the age of 80 had them.

The researchers also found evidence of autoantibody production in uninfected volunteers. They were found in less than 1% of people between 18 and 69 years; in 2.3% of those between 70 and 79 years; and in 6.3% of those 80 years and older. This suggests that type I IFN autoantibodies existed before infection and become more common past age 70.

In a related paper published in the same issue of Science Immunology, the researchers identified another rare genetic defect that occurs only in men and results in disruption of IFN production. They estimated that this genetic risk factor accounts for at least 1% of cases of life-threatening COVID-19 in men under the age of 60.

“We can neatly explain much of severe COVID-19 as a net defect in type I IFN,” Casanova says. “To an extent never seen for any other acute infectious disease, these… studies collectively provide a molecular and immunological explanation for about 20% of critical cases.”

Autoantibodies against IFNs—at even very low levels—can be screened for in the clinic. Testing for these autoantibodies could help identify uninfected people who need aggressive preventive measures or infected people who need early aggressive treatment.

Richard Dangle

My wife had exactly this problem in Scotland. After loads of phone calls to loads of people, she eventually phoned our local MP, who said he could do little but he would make a call to a biggie in the Scot NHS on her behalf.

Her record was correctly updated with 48 hours.

Maybe a coincidence??? Worth a shot though.

DType

Same problem for FType, certificate explicitly says just one jab received.
Got her put on a critical list 13 days ago for a corrected certificate, and as a result she got:-
A letter from the Chief Medical Officer chiding her for dodging her second jab.
Tried the GP surgery but they cannot access their records " because the only girl (sic) who can access them is on holiday all week"
Since theses certificates will soon be mandatory for many events, it's not looking very hopeful.
But I am not surprised.

Ninthace

My GP surgery came back after 3 working days. All sorted - sorry for the error. Went on line, Covid Pass issued.

cattletruck

Re vaccine passports, my muso friend came up with a classic yesterday - "Ticket to freedom" is an oxymoron.

Unfortunately, the Australian government historically does not have a good track record with these sorts of things and the registry they chose to use for recording vaccine certificates (a digital heath database called MyGov/MyHeath) was setup before Covid-19 and participation was optional (many opted out).

Loose rivets

Jab 3 at noon. Arm ache at tea. Dinner nice apart from punched arm. Get colder and colder. Started to shake. Really shake.*
Measured temperature with a lab thermometer. 30c. Odd. Measured again. Same. Temperature falling off is a symptom of allergic reaction. I have a lot of allergies, so go to bed in the early hours. Cold. Turn electric blanket on despite being under a quilt a foot thick.

Didn't bother with today. Do not press on that bit of arm.

* When I was in Texas c 1990, I was working on my wooden house which was the same age as me. Seriously tough wood on hidden posts and a crawl space underneath. I got a sore spot on one hand. Then I got lumpy glands under that armpit. Saw nice doctor who gave me antibiotics, and laughed at my spider logic. Went to movie with the Rivetess.
Texas can get $%&% cold, and when I came out of the flicks, I froze. I asked the Rivetess to get the car from 100 yards away. She told me to stop being a little girl and we just made it to the car with her supporting this shaking loony.

The thing about food and me is that I'd have to be dead not to want to eat. We got home and I was duly covered with quilts and had three electric fires on since the house heating was a bit basic. I must have been giving a convincing performance as I was served dinner in front of the TV. Trouble was, I was still shaking, so much so that I was finding it hard to get the food laden fork centred on my mouth. A chipped tooth and a couple of facial punctures and I was sated.

I told the nice doctor about my antics, and he said that it was a rush of bacteria to the heart. Clearly these critters know when it's cold outside.

annakm

Just wanted an update on how you are doing LR? That’s a pretty strong reaction to your booster, so were you OK after the two initial vaxes?
Very curious why your doctor mentioned about ‘a rush of bacteria to the heart’ too especially when there have actually been a few recorded cardiac issues post jab - especially in males,

Look after yourself and keep posting - your observations and contributions are always appreciated.

pulse1

I am booked for my third jab early next week. My surgery insist that it isn't a BOOSTER. It is a third PRIMARY vaccination. Got my flu jab tomorrow so hope there are no comlications.

treadigraph

Friend went into her local chemist in South Croydon last week to pick up a prescription; as she is over 50 they offered her the free flu jab there and then - they've got wads of the stuff, are offering appointments and so far few seem to be taking it up. So I popped in yesterday and asked if I could have mine there too - no problem, roll yer sleeve up. Saves me the hassle of going to my surgery and also takes the pressure off them. No side effects 36 hours on. My friend has her booster, er, third primary next week as she got an early jab in January - I have to wait till end November for mine...

Alsacienne

Had my third today. No ill-effects so far (for the rest of the day) and will be having my flu jab when the Government start their campaign for vaccination on 26 October. My vaccination centre was full of youngsters aged 12+ being vaccinated (with parental authorisation) because a 'pass sanitaire' will be required for them to show when going to sports clubs, meetings, cafés etc. They were directed to a different part of the centre (our local exhibition halls) and everyone behaved impeccably ... including us oldies, though this time we weren't offered our 'madeleine' bun and bottle of water!

wowzz

Strange - my surgery has had to cancel two "flu jab days " due to not having a confirmed supply date. Tried Boots - no vaccine either. Rang Asda - no problem, come in on Monday.
It just seems shambolic. In order to get a simple jab I have to drive 12 miles to a supermarket rather than walk 5 minutes to the local surgery.
Still, I can fill the car up while I am there, hopefully !

Loose rivets

It's been a bad week, but it's difficult to tell just what ails me because an immune reaction to something seems to be becoming chronic.

Called Mate yesterday and his wife answered. She said they'd been out to lunch and it was really nice. There was a clatter and I assumed she was handing over to pal. Nothing. Sounds were just not right. I'd asked for him to call me on his phone, so I assumed she'd not hung up the house phone correctly. Instinctively, I hung on, and on. Suddenly mate says his wife's on the floor. She is a recent stroke victim. I dialled 999, but because I wasn't at the address, spent vital three minutes answering questions. What was their number? Is she responsive etc. How T F do I know? I said, I need to be there! but had to make sure she believed it was genuine. I ended with 'I've got to go'.. 5 min drive with hazards on. Bo-lox to the law. Couple of drivers did assist. I pulled up behind an ambulance with two of the crew already in the house. So, a mix of daft and superb.

When I'd had a severe allergic reaction to 'Mr Muscle' some years ago, this friend had said she often felt ill after using that. Yesterday, I found clues that indicated she was having a reaction rather than the feared repeat bleed. Relayed information. She's home today so looks like my layman's notion might have been correct. So similar to mine. We'll see.

When the above thing hit me, Paramedic recorded a BP of 80 over 40 and temperature falling like a stone. That's why I wondered about my late night 30c on Monday. But why so many hours elapsed? Since I've not been so good since the first jabs, one wonders if they could have made a rogue immune system be more of a nuisance in the long term. Now, with the third, I'm mindful that the daemon might be awoken. Maybe I'm muddling immunity with the Kraken.

With no duties, I again went through the day feeling like crap, mostly slumped in recliner ignoring my sensible brain's call for a walk. With the sun casting long shadows on the beach, I made my mile walk for the first time since Monday. With everything aching, I'm off to Quora to argue for a realistic spacetime. I'll be alright while I'm up with the stars.

treadigraph

I use that stuff outside to clean the bottom of pans every now and then. Wouldn't use it inside without full hazmat kit!

DaveReidUK

Bear in mind that "Mr Muscle" is a brand, not a specific product, and comes in several different formulations for different applications.

treadigraph

Forgot that - i've not tried anything other than the oven cleaner! I use Tesco own brand for everything else...

Had an elderly colleague whose wife suffered a severe respiratory reaction when she mixed several different cleaning products trying to eradicate limescale or something from their shower tray. She was in hospital for several days and last I heard (he left) she was still struggling and I suspect the damage was permanent.

Loose rivets

Yes, I don't know what version I was using, but I was cleaning a bath, albeit with a long handled mop. In hindsight, I can't believe they make sprays with stuff like this. Breathing it in is inevitable, even standing away from the concentrated area. Having one's head in a shower well would be pretty concentrated I'd think.

I've been in bed most of the day. Hard to tell what's wrong and getting a bit alarming. Still, daughter said she felt bad for three days after last jab so I suppose being an oldie 6 days is to be expected.

I guess I'll have to cancel dinner with the almost Ex Rivetess and daughter. Shame. Only time I've been anywhere for weeks. I wonder if I'll make it to 82. I'll know in a couple of days.

cattletruck

It's official, the city I live in, Melbourne, Australia, now holds the record for the highest number of days in lockdown (245 days), ahead of second and third places that are not known for their first world order.

This situation manifested itself thanks to one of the most incompetent state public service administrations in our country, who's mishandling of traveller quarantining by employing untrained new immigrants (some of whom were bonking quarantined guests in the hotel) led to the very first lockdowns. The person in charge of these clots now appears to be modelling himself along the lines of Stalin. Coincidently, the 2017 UK film The Death of Stalin was screened on national TV a week ago of which I felt I could relate to considering our protracted lockdown situation. I mentioned the movie to a work colleague who said he'd seen it twice, I expressed my surprise as this was the first time I'd ever heard of it, perhaps its screening had been banned in all communist states. We are now the laughing stock of the world, and with the benefit of hindsight it's beginning to look like such severe lockdown measures aren't really working. But try telling that to Stalin and his muddled headed thinking brigade.

On a positive note, a new drug by Merck has the potential to change the way we fight Covid-19 by turning it into a simple orally administered treatment.
From https://abcnews.go.com/Health/wireSt...id-19-80344616