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LH942. FRA-MAN. 18/08/2019

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LH942. FRA-MAN. 18/08/2019

Old 18th Aug 2019, 23:53
  #81 (permalink)  
 
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Do you think this is the right place and the right way to complain about an issue that could have consequences of a professional nature? Put it this way, how would you feel if a complaint of a professional nature appeared on a website without your knowledge and with allowing you to answer to your employers.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 01:32
  #82 (permalink)  
 
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Folks can be allergic to a wide range of products, my take is that the individual is the one that has to take the necessary precautions rather than expecting an entire community to change habits. Lady I met at a dinner has a severe reaction to Kiwi fruit, it's just not nuts in the frame, also milk, eggs, wheat, fruit, beef, vegetables, spices, and even rice. How in the world is an airline supposed to cater for pax who has an allergy to any one of those products.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 04:51
  #83 (permalink)  
 
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As a school trustee I was shocked when our Superintendent told us that one of our schools would be nut free as we had a student who was severely allergic to peanuts. It seemed so unreasonable that four hundred other students should be deprived for the sake of one. However we had a duty to educate the student and a primary duty to keep him/her safe.

Once set up it didn't seem to hurt any one and, think about it, how would I feel if my carelessness (as a parent of a student at the school) caused the death of someone's child.

We speculated on the reasons for the growing number of people who are allergic to such things. 1) Ease of travel means that people are exposed to things that they may not culturally have been exposed to in earlier times.. 2) As the genes are passed down they appear to be spreading so the numbers are going to increase. 3) Easy transport and availability means that things that were not common to the average person are now available to everyone and, just for instance, cooking shows are increasing the general interest in what were, before, exotic foods. (Yes, I know peanut butter has been around almost forever!)
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 05:52
  #84 (permalink)  
 
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With only a skimpy allegation as the opening post, this appears to be an appalling attempt at 'trial by internet'.

However, a thought:

If I am on a flight where peanuts have been banned, does this mean that I am not permitted to read my Charles M Schulz cartoon book on that flight?

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Old 19th Aug 2019, 06:52
  #85 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bobdh478 View Post
Do you think this is the right place and the right way to complain about an issue that could have consequences of a professional nature? Put it this way, how would you feel if a complaint of a professional nature appeared on a website without your knowledge and with allowing you to answer to your employers.
I don't see what difference it makes whether a complaint like this is aired here, or on one of the many Internet sites where customers can complain about poor service from an organisation that they have purchased goods or services from (which is essentially what we're talking about here, albeit with a life-threatening dimension).

The Captain made a decision, as was his right. But with power comes responsibility and the expectation of being held to account for one's actions. If my travel plans had been disrupted because an airline said it would do one thing, but then did the opposite, I'd have been equally p*ssed off.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 07:00
  #86 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ChrisVJ View Post
As a school trustee I was shocked when our Superintendent told us that one of our schools would be nut free as we had a student who was severely allergic to peanuts. It seemed so unreasonable that four hundred other students should be deprived for the sake of one. However we had a duty to educate the student and a primary duty to keep him/her safe.)
There's a child at my kids' school who has a severe dairy allergy. All dairy products are banned except for at lunchtimes when the sufferer eats separately in a supervised environment. I guess the school arrived at this compromise, but I still find it incredible that an entire school of hundreds of pupils cannot, for instance, drink a glass of milk at break time due to the medical condition of a single child.

I wonder if the OP has looked at chartering private flights for his family? Might not be entirely out of reach on an anaesthetist's salary?
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 07:45
  #87 (permalink)  
 
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I am a regular LH user on Munich Manchester route, and on short haul I have never had peanuts offered, though it is a different story on long haul. As for Peanut issue I came out of Havana with BA late 90,s and had this issue with a young lad down the back, and the hole plane had to forgo their peanuts. I am not sure how some of these people so afflicted are going to survive especially as they travel in areas of the world where the use of nut oils are so common, and I speak as someone with a friend who is allergic to Sesame seeds / oil who carries pen as a result. As for the pilots comments I have to say that I tend to agree, as the plane will have done numerous rotations and will have been cleaned but not deep cleaned how can he be responsible for possible earlier contamination of the cabin.

Kind regards
Mr Mac
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 08:26
  #88 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Mr Mac View Post
As for the pilots comments I have to say that I tend to agree, as the plane will have done numerous rotations and will have been cleaned but not deep cleaned how can he be responsible for possible earlier contamination of the cabin.
The pilot wasn't being asked to take responsibility for that.

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Old 19th Aug 2019, 09:02
  #89 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
I don't see what difference it makes whether a complaint like this is aired here, or on one of the many Internet sites where customers can complain about poor service from an organisation that they have purchased goods or services from (which is essentially what we're talking about here, albeit with a life-threatening dimension).
Dave, It's the manner in which the complaint has been aired here that I personally take great great exception to.

It's OK IMHO to have a whinge on a public forum and maybe ask how to progress a complaint, but naming exact dates and flight numbers for all to see is a step too far - save that for the e-mail to customer service.

I wonder how the OP would feel if the boot was on the other foot and I had a bad experience in his hospital, as a result of which I went on PMedical.

There I complain that whilst being prepped for a specific procedure in a specified hospital, in a specified theatre, at a specified time and specific date the anaesthetist had been rude and inconsiderate to me..and furthermore I have deliberately provided as much detail as possible and pretty much expect that said individual should present himself on the forum and explain all his actions?

I have to add for once and at last Noel and I are in agreement on something, this has turned into "trial by internet".

Last edited by wiggy; 19th Aug 2019 at 09:41.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 09:14
  #90 (permalink)  
 
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Post #82 says it all for me.
Almost 90 posts about a complaint which should be directed to Lufthansa by OP, not aired here for support - which seems in short supply.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 10:27
  #91 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
The pilot wasn't being asked to take responsibility for that.
I still agree that if the person is so concerned due to possible contamination, then perhaps they review there method of travel. One has to ask how they get on in daily life if so susceptible, as even getting through the terminal could potentially be an issue. Also I do think it wrong, as other have said, to all but name the Captain, as I am sure (having dealt with BMA on one occasion) the original poster would have issues if it was his name on a public forum.
Kind regards
Mr Mac
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 10:38
  #92 (permalink)  
 
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My father is allergic to nuts and peanuts. He has never requested that a plane become nut-free. He has managed 84 years (and going well) so the OP protests too much.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 10:40
  #93 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Council Van View Post
The last airline I flew for would make the cabin Crew aware, they would then not serve any nut products and make an announcement to the customers informing them of the situation and requesting them to not eat any nuts either.

The flight deck crewe would be made aware of the passengers allergy as part of good CRM.

I would ask them if they wanted to go direct to their destination or if they would be happy for the aircraft to divert en route resulting in a substantial delay.
Quick question, how do the CC check every passenger to see if they haven't brought a Snickers bar or some other sort of confectionary bar containing nuts on board the a.c.?
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 11:19
  #94 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
I don't see what difference it makes whether a complaint like this is aired here, or on one of the many Internet sites where customers can complain about poor service from an organisation that they have purchased goods or services from (which is essentially what we're talking about here, albeit with a life-threatening dimension).

The Captain made a decision, as was his right. But with power comes responsibility and the expectation of being held to account for one's actions. If my travel plans had been disrupted because an airline said it would do one thing, but then did the opposite, I'd have been equally p*ssed off.
Well Dave, what I would suggest is you read the whole thread from start to finish. Then, if you still feel that trial by internet and "Daily Mail" is the way to go..... then I feel very sorry for you.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 12:03
  #95 (permalink)  
 
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Isn't this just a question that is strongly connected with what might become a legal responsibility?

If the Captain chose to make an announcement, then perhaps he would have taken responsibility, on behalf of Lufthansa, for guaranteeing that there would be no chance of nuts or any nut residue, coming into contact with a susceptible passenger. That's unrealistic, as there is no way that making an announcement is going to change the real risk at all. As others have mentioned, there could be nut residue pretty much anywhere in the cabin.

My sister has a severe nut allergy, and having once seen her go into anaphylactic shock at home I can fully understand the seriousness of the condition. However, she doesn't expect everyone to remove all traces of nuts from their environment, as she knows this is just an unrealistic expectation. She accepts that she has to manage her allergy, makes sure whoever she's with knows she has a severe nut allergy, tells them where her EpiPen is, and how to use it, and that's about it.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 12:11
  #96 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by bobdh478 View Post
Well Dave, what I would suggest is you read the whole thread from start to finish.
I never post in any PPRuNe thread unless I've read it from the beginning.

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Old 19th Aug 2019, 12:45
  #97 (permalink)  
 
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There are two types of people in this world...

Those who understand what an allergic reaction looks like (usually because they are related to a sufferer or have witnessed it firsthand) and those that donít.

I used to belong to the latter type until we discovered the hard way that our eldest son has an allergy to tree nuts (specifically and only cashews and pistachios). He only reacts if he ingests them so it is not as serious as some. It would require the use of his epipen though if he were to eat anything containing them.

What I see when I read things like this is an acute lack of understanding from some people when it comes to allergies.

We accommodate disabled people. We accommodate religious sensitivities. In fact we accommodate an awful lot of things in this world.

So why do some people react as if someone is trying to steal the deeds to their house when someone suggests they should have to survive a few hours without consuming any nut products? You manage to sleep every night for eight hours without eating any nuts. So why should a flight cause you any such grief?

As I mentioned, my son does not suffer as badly as some but I empathise with those that do. I feel sure I could cope without nuts if it meant someone could travel without fear of death.

You see, thatís what normal people do. They donít spend their lives ignoring the needs of others and getting all bent out of shape because someone has asked them to make a minuscule adjustment to their daily lives.

I realise it is unrealistic to expect an airline to guarantee a nut free cabin but asking people to minimise the risk shouldn't be too much to ask.

BV
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 13:44
  #98 (permalink)  
 
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Unfortunately, the whole allergy thing had been muddied and devalued by a bunch of the, “It’s all about me, I’m special special “ brigade.

There’s the genuinely, and thankfully very rare, sufferers of severe reactions to specific foods, insect bites, certain chemicals etc. To be in that category must be truly horrific and would no doubt, curtail one’s life considerably by trying to avoid exposure to their particular triggers.

Then there’s a small section of (Western) society that uses a mild reaction as an excuse to get certain preferential treatment. My ex sister in law used to get a rash if she ate strawberries. She used to this to great advantage making sure that everyone knew about her “allergy” and that anything strawberry related was removed from her presence. A real joke as there’s not a lot of potential cross contamination from these things and so what if she gets a rash - she’ll live! Her daughter inherited this food paranoia and insisted that she was also allergic to a great list of foodstuffs. Never prevented her from going on holidays to exotic places where there was highly unlikely to be any control over food preparation and if she had a reaction - she never did - and she was often some distance from medical care.

I've dealt with parents who listed allergens that were more to do with fussy eating, “Broccoli always makes Johnny throw up.” “Chardonnay’s bad behaviour is because of all the E numbers and additives in food.” Nothing to do with the fact that you’ve never said no to her or perhaps tried feeding her fresh food where you know there won’t be any additives?
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 15:02
  #99 (permalink)  
 
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And here we are right back on the issue - it's either that bad that residues in all that gaps, seat crases, carpets would bother you and you would't want to be on that plane at all or it's more a feel issue. I have yet to see a cabin I would consider 'clean'.
Anyway you read a lot of moaning here that discretion merly exists on paper. Here we have an airmen who is better informend on food allegies than a father and anesthetist who exercises his discretion and it's no good either. Only failure I can see is that he did not offload the party for the girls own safety, because you have to take the opinion of a father and doc seriously.
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Old 19th Aug 2019, 15:51
  #100 (permalink)  
 
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It seems to me we have a lot of thickos on here. All this frothing about whether or not a plane should carry peanuts or whether or not there is peanut dust in the seat pockets (really?) is totally irrelevant.
The OP posted a comment about how Lufthansa promised him something and the Captain took it upon himself to say, in effect, "bugger Lufthansa. I am in charge of all I survey and any of the people contributing to my decent salary can sod off".
That is what this discussion is about. Peanuts in the seat pockets indeed! I have never seen anyone scooping their peanuts from a seat pocket in order to trough them.
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