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Notre-Dame ablaze

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Notre-Dame ablaze

Old 16th Apr 2019, 19:59
  #61 (permalink)  
 
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Why rebuild it? Why not build something new, something that reflects the belief of the people of the present days. Like a disco, a soccer stadium, a casino, a brothel, a EU Headquarters?
Oh come on now. You are entitled to your opinion but it seems very inappropriate. Whether you have a religious faith or not, the Cathedral has left its mark in the memories of many millions of visitors over the centuries.

May this catastrophic fire become a catalyst for the renewal of a building which has many purposes - a place of worship and prayer, a place of peace, a refuge from personal torment and a place where people can meet, receive support and comfort, gain courage and motivation and above all, prove that life, love, humanity and faith can continue regardless of the adversities the world may throw at them.
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Old 16th Apr 2019, 20:44
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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Cheap solution(sort of)- just nick the Notre Dame from Ho Chi Minh city. Few would probably notice the difference.
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Old 16th Apr 2019, 20:59
  #63 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by clark y View Post
Cheap solution(sort of)- just nick the Notre Dame from Ho Chi Minh city. Few would probably notice the difference.
Bit glib but know what you mean having been there.

I suppose it's like Britain losing St Paul's but that happened already a few/ many years ago.

But this will unite France. Perhaps it is serendipitous? There was a recent trend of church burning by radical secularists. An Almost bizarre notion. But Notre Dame transends that.

Is there something that could re-unite Britain?

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Old 16th Apr 2019, 21:05
  #64 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
French officials today are saying what I did -- that they no longer have trees of the size cut in the 13th century, and that "new technology" will be required in the reconstruction.
It will be, but it'll still be a wood roof...

Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
it appears that the Paris fire brigades did their job in exemplary manner, prioritizing what they needed to. I'll cut them slack on this, as it had to be an incredibly difficult task.
I'm sure they'll be pleased...

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Old 16th Apr 2019, 21:27
  #65 (permalink)  
 
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Smile

I'm so pleased about the pipe organ(s) survival. I imagine it may be a bit out of tune. Those pipes made of tin and lead and wood do not like temperature extremes.

Five years to rebuild is an aggressive schedule. I hope it works.
.
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Old 16th Apr 2019, 21:28
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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Is there something that could re-unite Britain?
Burn down a pub or fish'n'chip shop?
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Old 16th Apr 2019, 21:39
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As long as it isn't 'The Old Keswickian', 'Squires Gate Chippy' or 'The Wetherby Whaler'.

Seriously though, as jack says, I hope the organ still sounds O.K., and that they can do the restoration in 5 years.
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Old 16th Apr 2019, 21:43
  #68 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by clark y View Post
Cheap solution(sort of)- just nick the Notre Dame from Ho Chi Minh city. Few would probably notice the difference.
Apart from it being brick built, plus a different colour and size. Other than the basic shape, only two other things in common; French influence and that it too, is in mid-renovation.

Last edited by TLDNMCL; 16th Apr 2019 at 23:35.
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Old 16th Apr 2019, 22:11
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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Thumbs up

Originally Posted by jack11111 View Post
I'm so pleased about the pipe organ(s) survival. I imagine it may be a bit out of tune. Those pipes made of tin and lead and wood do not like temperature extremes.

.
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The Cavaille Coll is a hardy beast, it`s been added to over the years and there`s no reason to believe it won`t perform again. Truly amazing collosus. Listen to the one in St Sulpice just down the road from Notre Dame.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 00:09
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The Cavaille Coll is a hardy beast, it`s been added to over the years and there`s no reason to believe it won`t perform again. Truly amazing collosus. Listen to the one in St Sulpice just down the road from Notre Dame.
I was fully expecting this amazing instrument to be a charred / molten mess. It's wonderful that it has apparently survived; indeed it's a miracle. Sadly the instruments in Notre Dame and St Sulpice were both silent when we visited, but I have lots of amazing music on Cds to enjoy - especially from St Sulpice. It's worth recalling that some of the classic organ works probably had their origins within Notre Dame's walls (Louis Vierne) - even more famous from St Sulpice (but that is a digression).
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 01:45
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Pictures I've seen today show far less damage than I'd expected based on the videos and reports from yesterday - that's darned good news. Based on some of what I saw yesterday I feared that the basic structural integrity could be compromised, in which case it would have been near impossible to save short of a brick-by-brick tear down and rebuilt.

BTW, for all the glib comments regarding using aircraft to fight the fire, there are other firefighting aircraft besides big airplanes. Helicopters are often used and can do quite precise water drops that would do minimal damage to the structure.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 02:00
  #72 (permalink)  
 
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Helicopter largest water bucket. 10,000 litres.

Delivery loss from the fire hoses of 400 firemen who have to cease operations on chopper approaches - dunno.
Lots.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 02:47
  #73 (permalink)  
 
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Meadow
Have you ever watched people fighting a wildfire while there was a helicopter water drop? The only firefighters that even pay close attention are those within maybe 30 meters of the drop. When the Notre Dame fire was ragging, the videos I saw there weren't many fire fighters within 30 meters of the building...
Airplane drops are a different story since the aiming is far less precise...
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 07:12
  #74 (permalink)  

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Having been tasked to fire-bucket a burning building (using a 6,000 lb water bucket under an S-70) I can say from experience that if the roof is intact it doesn’t work. The roof just does what a roof is designed to do.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 07:28
  #75 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by tdracer View Post
Meadow
Have you ever watched people fighting a wildfire while there was a helicopter water drop? The only firefighters that even pay close attention are those within maybe 30 meters of the drop. When the Notre Dame fire was ragging, the videos I saw there weren't many fire fighters within 30 meters of the building...
Airplane drops are a different story since the aiming is far less precise...
watched some helo water bomb practise when on holiday. This chap appeared out of the long grass to see what was going on. Good marker, they bombed him.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 14:08
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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Notre-Dame fire: International call for architects to design new spire

Interesting to see they are considering putting their mark on the building to show a history of on going development, i do wonder however if they will get a suggestion to add a minaret

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-47959313
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 14:24
  #77 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Hydromet View Post
I would not be surprised to see the heavy oak structure survive relatively unscathed. I'm not familiar with the fire resistance of oak, but it isn't uncommon for jarrah and other Australian hardwood members to survive building fires that would leave steel members looking like licorice. I know of at least one building that was rebuilt using the original timbers. One can only hope that this is the case here.
You can get fire retardent products that are absorbed into the timber substrate, I am surprised building like this have never been treated.

as an example

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Old 17th Apr 2019, 14:26
  #78 (permalink)  
 
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As an atheist who finds many church buildings extremely beautiful, I can see the sadness of losing a glorious building, but am somewhat perplexed that two billionaires came forward immediately and pledged 200 million euros to fund the renovation; could they not think of anything more useful to humanity to do with the money?

Anyway, assuming they do rebuild it, my suggestion would be not to attempt a pastiche of the original - why not build an ultra-modern glass roof instead?
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 14:29
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It's pre-paying the ferryman.

Glass would not really work would it? as there is stone structure underneath and one assumes that will need to be repaired where breached to restore the internal strength.
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Old 17th Apr 2019, 14:35
  #80 (permalink)  
 
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Captivep,
A worthy sentiment, but Modern goes out of date vary fast.
Remember Coventry?
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