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Terrorists kill dozens in mosques in Christchurch NZ today

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Terrorists kill dozens in mosques in Christchurch NZ today

Old 15th Mar 2019, 23:04
  #61 (permalink)  
 
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Here's a personal insight into what happened yesterday.
My sister and her husband arrived home from a trip out to their house 60m away from the main mosque, just 9 minutes after the shooting.
They realised something was wrong and went to a laneway right next to the mosque.
There they found a dead young Somali man who'd been shot in the back.
With him was an Indian couple in a car - every single window had been shot out and it was literally riddled with bullet holes.
They'd reversed their car into the laneway after the shooter emptied a clip at them.
The Indian woman was hysterical - she'd been driving and grazed on the arm by one of the rounds.
Another had ricochetted off the A pillar right next to her head.
My sister ran back to her house to grab some frozen peas from the freezer to stem the bleeding.
As they were trying to calm the couple down - the AOS came running through - fully tooled up and told them all to get inside - they weren't sure if the shooter was still in the area.
Another resident took the Indian couple into his house where they spent the night.
The dead young Somali guy lay there all night - in his socks - he'd been trying to run away.
This morning he was gone, but the shot out car remained.
Some more insights into the other mosque.
It appears - and this is still unconfirmed, that one of those arrested may in fact have been a local resident who had a shottie, and took a few shots at the shooters car.
There are a lot of gang pads in that part of Linwood - so it may have been a gang member - unsure.
As I say, that's unconfirmed and may be wrong, but that may account for reports of a weapon been used to defend against the shooter.

https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12213236
Well - Peter Dutton - this is the chance you get to have one of your own back - cos I don't think even D-block at Parry Max will be fit for this guy.
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Old 15th Mar 2019, 23:05
  #62 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fliegenmong View Post
Yep, that's the problem with education...it tends to open peoples minds and leads to enlightenment.

So I should go to Melbourne this weekend and learn how to tie a Hijab? The Police force think I should...should the Police force be telling me what to think? Maybe while I'm being taught to tie a Hijab, I could benefit from a side lecture on Female Genital Mutilation?

It is terrorism by the way....where those in the congregation, going about a peaceful Friday prayer deserving of being murdered?...NO! Of course not! Most of them likely contributed to the Christchurch Community in a positive way. BUT 18+ years of relentless attacks against innocent 'Non Believers' will drive some to extreme lengths....clearly...and now it's happened in a spectacular (? is that the right word? probably not) I DO get the idea that Terrorism is about changing regime....but I bet all those in the Mosque were terrified.....I bet

The real shame is these people have lowered themselves to the same dreadful murderous levels as the very people thay rail against......I guess they knew no other way to get their voices heard, their point across...they were simply sick of watching 'their own' be slaughtered by proponents of the 'religion of peace'...and when having the audacity to speak out be labelled as racists....here is a wikipedia list...no idea how accurate

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...rorist_attacks

And NO ONE speaks out about these atrocities! ..... No, thank you Victorian Police I will not be attending a lecture about Female oppresion tommorow

Another very interesting point to make is this.....not a Single person I know....and I associate with a broad section of the community....not a SINGLE one has mentioned Christchurch.....Tacit support?...Don't care?.... Don't know...suspect it is rather more a case of Ha ha ...how do you like it now the shoe is on the other foot, but political correctness prevents them ,,,so they say nothing,,,interesting response really 'cos it is very much like the silence of the Muslim community when the all too frequent attacks against the West occur!
Most likely it's not been mentioned because you either don't associate with quite as broad a community as you think, or your views are well known enough among them that people know better than to provoke you into expressing your own "tacit approval" for this heinous act.

It's most disappointing and uncomfortable to find out that somebody you didn't really mind before is actually quite sympathetic to the idea of brutally murdering dozens of innocent people who happen to belong to a particular religious group.
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Old 15th Mar 2019, 23:10
  #63 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by chuboy View Post
Most likely it's not been mentioned because you either don't associate with quite as broad a community as you think, or your views are well known enough among them that people know better than to provoke you into expressing your own "tacit approval" for this heinous act.

It's most disappointing and uncomfortable to find out that somebody you didn't really mind before is actually quite sympathetic to the idea of brutally murdering dozens of innocent people who happen to belong to a particular religious group.
Yes.
I could not agree more.
Pretty nauseating to read those comments.
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Old 15th Mar 2019, 23:24
  #64 (permalink)  
 
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It's interesting to see the amount of forelock tugging going on in the media about the Chrustchurch masacre, yet there is no coverage of the 40 Christians massacred overnight in Nigeria. Absolutely NIL coverage. Or that EVERY Christmas for the last 7 years, Islamists murder people by the dozen at Christmas markets in Europe. Have we already forgotten September 11, London, Paris, Brussels, Nice, Barcelona, Lindt Cafe, Curtis Cheng nurder in Sydneyetc etc etc. Since September 11, there has been an Islamist terrorist attack EVERY month for the last 20 years. That is the reality. We are descending into a world wide war between Islamist nutcases and Far Right (religious) nutcases.
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Old 15th Mar 2019, 23:37
  #65 (permalink)  
 
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Any time an attack of this nature happens in the Western world, it occupies the forefronts of our minds and news for a few days and even is then forgotten about. Christchurch will be no different "just because" the attacker was white. Nobody is still talking about Las Vegas or San Bernadino or Anders Brevik.

What happens in other parts of the world, where peace and stability are not taken for granted, is considered irrelevant to the demographics that our media caters for.

I do agree that extremism has become a real scourge in this century. I do wonder the extent to which the Internet has empowered extremism. 40 years ago it would have been quite hard to find a community of people with such abhorrent worldviews, but today those communities practically find you.
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 00:30
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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One wonders why he committed this atrocity in New Zealand rather than in Australia.
One possible reason is (if my understanding is correct) it's possible -- even relatively easy perhaps to buy weapons of the type used in EnZed. I was astonished by the 'openness' of firearm display and sales on one of my trips over there. In Australia we learned the hard way to change our gun laws to make a repeat of our particularly hard and tragic lesson in these things virtually impossible up to a point. So far it seems to have worked (fingers crossed).
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 01:17
  #67 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by FullOppositeRudder View Post
One possible reason is (if my understanding is correct) it's possible -- even relatively easy perhaps to buy weapons of the type used in EnZed. I was astonished by the 'openness' of firearm display and sales on one of my trips over there. In Australia we learned the hard way to change our gun laws to make a repeat of our particularly hard and tragic lesson in these things virtually impossible up to a point. So far it seems to have worked (fingers crossed).
That is correct.
A young member of my family there has an AR-15 (legally purchased, fully licenced etc).
My understanding is that it is illegal for him to have a mag of more than 5-6 rounds in the weapon.
But he can go to Gun City (ChCh gun retailer of choice) and buy a 30 round mag over the counter for $149
Absolutely crazy.
I wouldn't be surprised if a ban on large capacity mags is enacted - possibly even a buyback ban on semi autos.
AR-15s and Bushmasters freely available... why?
For hunting?
I think they're great guns - but come on...!
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 01:35
  #68 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Training Risky View Post
This was not Terrorism!

All those on here calling this criminal incident a Terrorist attack are being deliberately disingenuous.
Terrorists seek to replace/destroy the established civil power in order to gain political power: as evidenced by all the Islamic Terrorist attacks we have suffered in the West.
Some lunatic murdering Muslims in NZ is NOT striking at the general population and government of NZ.

I fought terrorists and insurgents throughout the 'War on Terror' and I know the difference.

(Also - just because morally bankrupt and media-savvy politicians want to jump on the victimhood bandwagon and call it terrorism...doesn't make it so.)
So by that definition 9/11 was a ‘criminal incident’ as well, since I didn’t notice Al Queda replacing or destroying any civil power, nor did I see them gaining political power. All that despite the fact that their ‘criminal’ activities resulted in exponentially more damage than they had planned. I guess the ‘War on Criminal Incidents’ didn’t pack the same emotional punch
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 02:33
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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NZ has just announced a ban on semi-autos:
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/a...ectid=12213269
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 02:46
  #70 (permalink)  
 
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Flash 8,what are your reasons for "sorry about that"?Or,why are you finding it hard to feel any sympathy?
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 05:25
  #71 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tartare View Post
https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/a...ectid=12213236
Well - Peter Dutton - this is the chance you get to have one of your own back - cos I don't think even D-block at Parry Max will be fit for this guy.

I think most people both sides of the ditch would be happy if he went missing halfway between...
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 05:47
  #72 (permalink)  
 
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Most likely it's not been mentioned because you either don't associate with quite as broad a community as you think, or your views are well known enough among them that people know better than to provoke you into expressing your own "tacit approval" for this heinous act.

It's most disappointing and uncomfortable to find out that somebody you didn't really mind before is actually quite sympathetic to the idea of brutally murdering dozens of innocent people who happen to belong to a particular religious group.


Nup! ....NOT my 'tacit aproval' at all go back and read over what I said.

Yes.
I could not agree more.
Pretty nauseating to read those comment
s.

Again, not what I said....BUT that I noticed not many seemed too overly perturbed by it.....I work with one Kiwi woman whose only remark about it was "How pi$$ed off would the parents be having to wait until almost 6 pm to pick their kids from school"
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 05:49
  #73 (permalink)  
 
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It's interesting to see the amount of forelock tugging going on in the media about the Chrustchurch masacre, yet there is no coverage of the 40 Christians massacred overnight in Nigeria. Absolutely NIL coverage. Or that EVERY Christmas for the last 7 years, Islamists murder people by the dozen at Christmas markets in Europe. Have we already forgotten September 11, London, Paris, Brussels, Nice, Barcelona, Lindt Cafe, Curtis Cheng nurder in Sydneyetc etc etc. Since September 11, there has been an Islamist terrorist attack EVERY month for the last 20 years. That is the reality. We are descending into a world wide war between Islamist nutcases and Far Right (religious) nutcases.

Yup....
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 06:12
  #74 (permalink)  
 
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EnZes PM:

“I can tell you one thing right now, our gun laws will change,” Ardern promised the nation.

We did exactly that back in '95 - '96 or something like that, haven't had a mass shooting since. Still, my friends in the US insist that Australia's rampant gun crime & violence is because of our laws.
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 06:38
  #75 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fliegenmong View Post
Most likely it's not been mentioned because you either don't associate with quite as broad a community as you think, or your views are well known enough among them that people know better than to provoke you into expressing your own "tacit approval" for this heinous act.

It's most disappointing and uncomfortable to find out that somebody you didn't really mind before is actually quite sympathetic to the idea of brutally murdering dozens of innocent people who happen to belong to a particular religious group.


Nup! ....NOT my 'tacit aproval' at all go back and read over what I said.

Yes.
I could not agree more.
Pretty nauseating to read those comment
s.

Again, not what I said....BUT that I noticed not many seemed too overly perturbed by it.....I work with one Kiwi woman whose only remark about it was "How pi$$ed off would the parents be having to wait until almost 6 pm to pick their kids from school"
When you claim that the "real shame" is that a white man has lowered themselves to the same dreadful murderous level of a Muslim terrorist - and not that 40+ innocent people were brutally murdered by said man, it's pretty hard to make the case that you don't approve of the violence itself.

You disapprove of the hypocrisy and nothing more, even going as far as to claim it can be explained or even justified by "18 years of relentless attacks" and the threat of being accused of racism!
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 08:22
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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When you claim that the "real shame"

Yes apologies for that when you specify it like that...you don't agree though, that what this far right terrorist is replicating the kinds of indiscriminate hate crime and mass murder perpetrated ordinarily only reserved for the proponents of
the religion of peace'?
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 08:59
  #77 (permalink)  
 
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The real shame is that people are trying to deny that this action is reactive, and in doing so missing the real reasons why these incidents continue to occur. There is mo doubt in my mind that 9/11 was the watershed in all this. It us true that before that there were isolated incidents but 9/11 was the game changer. The incidents such as Bataclan, Nice etc served to radicalise right wing fruit loops. In many ways all the combatants are lunatics, but it doesn't take a lot to get lunatics going and in countries where they have access to serious weaponry bad things are always going to happen.

I don't see anything in Fligenmong's posts that should encourage censure, the critics don't like the message so they are shooting the messenger. His points are entirely valid and in no way about hating brown people.
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 09:26
  #78 (permalink)  
 
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I applaud the restraint of the moderators. Unlike most stinking politicians, who jump on the P.C band wagon, with their knee jerk reactions.

'Re post #77. It would be easier just to name almost every country on earth, regarding Islamic atrocities.
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 09:56
  #79 (permalink)  
 
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I do take your point. However in view of the horrific events that has seen the slaughter of so many people who had no part to play in this wider scrap of Islam v The Rest I do consider it unwise to wind up the different factions. My guess is that if you took a survey condemnation would reach well into the 90's % and the small minority remaining would most likely comprise the unhinged. How gunning did women and children advances any cause is tricky to work out.
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Old 16th Mar 2019, 09:57
  #80 (permalink)  
 
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Quite rightly there is serious concern being expressed about this atrocity both being live streamed on social media by the perpetrator, and about the way that the appalling footage is being allowed to spread around the web, seemingly uncontrolled. However, it seems that when it comes to "protecting the identity" of the perpetrator, then the media organisations are required to pixelate his face, like this:




Why is it OK to allow video of the mass murders this guy has committed to be broadcast around the web, but it's not OK for the BBC to show his face?
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