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Anti Vaxxers

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Anti Vaxxers

Old 23rd Feb 2019, 17:57
  #41 (permalink)  
 
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That was a rare success story indeed. but smallpox has not been eradicated, it is still held in some labs around the world and if it escapes we have no immunity any longer nor are there enough stocks of the vaccine to protect more than a few million of us. We might have created a time bomb. There are still people with polio, and many diseases cannot be stopped even with vaccinations. Do we quit? Of course not.

Sure herd immunity is not perfect but mostly people got sick and then got better, with life time immunity form the childhood diseases. Some died. I wonder if we are really doing much better, if we consider those damaged by the side effects of the vaccines and the chemicals in them. Can we be sure that this can be properly studied or do we get told that we are anti vaxxers if we ask?
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 18:14
  #42 (permalink)  
 
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A couple of mates who did quite a bit of grave yard archaeology have been vaccinated against small pox in case they get exposed to it during a dig.
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 18:18
  #43 (permalink)  
 
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I don't usually get involved in forum arguments, but boofhead, who told you this utter nonsense?
​​​​​Most got better? No, categorically untrue.
'Some' died? Millions, and with some diseases, most.

Smallpox - the lethal disease - HAS been eradicated worldwide. The virus which causes it is kept, for some bizarre reason, in some labs.

You say there won't be sufficient vaccine if it is released? Eh? Previously you stated that our immune systems would sort that scenario out. You can't have it both ways - either vaccines work or they don't.

They do.

Incidentally, herd immunity to a disease only works for vulnerable people if the majority of the population around them is immune already. The immune population will not contract the disease in the first place, so the vulnerable individuals are not exposed to it. Hence 'herd immunity' with the herd protecting the vulnerable. These days herd immunity is conferred by vaccination. If it were not for vaccination programs, for the most part there would be no herd immunity for the non-vaccinated to rely upon.

Last edited by Blues&twos; 23rd Feb 2019 at 18:39.
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 18:30
  #44 (permalink)  
 
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Funny enough I was reading an article a few weeks ago that the melting of the perma frost in Siberia may release it again.

A kid had died of Anthrax in 2016 due to graves melting. And they thought that smallpox could be released as well.
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 19:12
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
Natural immunity protected us before vaccines.
On No It Didn't - people died in vast numbers from infectious diseases.
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 19:21
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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To understand the impact of disease on an unprotected population you could do worse than read about the 'great dying' in the Americas.

As a starting point, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nati..._and_epidemics

Estimates vary, but the 'average' is that about 90% of the pre-European population in north, central & south-America, died- about 55 million people.
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 20:55
  #47 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by layman View Post
To understand the impact of disease on an unprotected population you could do worse than read about the 'great dying' in the Americas.

As a starting point, https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nati..._and_epidemics

Estimates vary, but the 'average' is that about 90% of the pre-European population in north, central & south-America, died- about 55 million people.
Same thing happened in Hawaii after Capt. Cook showed up - again estimates of 80-90% of the pre-contact natives died.
I used to work with a guy that had polio - he was lucky, he still had enough movement that he could function and walk short distances (with the help of a cane), but it was tough I suspect he'd have something to say regarding vaccines, like wishing the polio vaccine had been available 20 years earlier...
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 21:08
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
....but smallpox has not been eradicated, it is still held in some labs around the world and if it escapes we have no immunity any longer .........
Yes I do. And so do a lot of westerners of my vintage.

Vaccination for small pox was still being carried out, in Indonesia for instance, well into the 70's.
I suspect that to be the case for lots of 3rd world countries.

Last edited by WingNut60; 23rd Feb 2019 at 21:22.
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Old 23rd Feb 2019, 21:21
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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If you can filter out the journalese, this link is about the effectiveness of the HPV elimination program in Oz.

HPV program in Oz

In what way could you construe this program as being a bad idea despite any side effects, few if any?
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 02:02
  #50 (permalink)  
 
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"I am angry with myself for forcing my daughters to have the Gardisil shots. Now I learn that there might be serious problems for them later in life, and that the shots, contrary to what I was told, need to be repeated frequently to be effective against the type of cancer they were promoted to prevent."

Boofhead, what serious problems? What are your sources for these statements?
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 02:07
  #51 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by WingNut60 View Post
If you can filter out the journalese, this link is about the effectiveness of the HPV elimination program in Oz.

HPV program in Oz

In what way could you construe this program as being a bad idea despite any side effects, few if any?

​​​​​​​I understand the Hon ex-PM Toby Abbott was opposed to the HPV vaccine on the grounds that it would promote promiscuity among women.

Perhaps if one shares his conservative views on the matter, you would consider this a negative side-effect? Sexually-active women no longer punished with cervical cancer.
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 04:51
  #52 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by chuboy View Post
​​​​​​​I understand the Hon ex-PM Toby Abbott was opposed to the HPV vaccine on the grounds that it would promote promiscuity among women.

Perhaps if one shares his conservative views on the matter, you would consider this a negative side-effect? Sexually-active women no longer punished with cervical cancer.
Who knows what goes on within the mind of Tony and his mates.
If an African polly came out with that sort of nonsense the west would ridicule his views as charlatanism.
White Anglo politician and it's just treated as a minor character trait.

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Old 24th Feb 2019, 08:56
  #53 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by boofhead View Post
That was a rare success story indeed. but smallpox has not been eradicated, it is still held in some labs around the world and if it escapes we have no immunity any longer nor are there enough stocks of the vaccine to protect more than a few million of us. We might have created a time bomb. There are still people with polio, and many diseases cannot be stopped even with vaccinations. Do we quit? Of course not.

Can we be sure that this can be properly studied or do we get told that we are anti vaxxers if we ask?


Its 2019 and I suspect the respective answers to these questions are ĎNoí and ĎDefinitelyí.
Wikipedia appears to be the place a lot of people turn to for factual information regarding Vaccinations. Personally I would doubt anything written on Wikipedia where any controversial topic is concerned. And for emotional responses, the vaccination topic is near the very top! People state with certainty all sorts of historical Ďfactsí which appear to support their view of things. I started out a sceptic, now, unfortunately, Iím more cynical than that.

In a a world where I know from personal experience how messed up things can be, (just look around) itís getting more difficult to be sure of anything at all. Even real Ďexpertsí get things wrong all the time, truth is difficult to pin down. I would suggest that anyone who says anything with certainty about complex topics should be doubted. Iím beginning to see that being called a conspiracy theorist, an anti-vaxxer, a RussianBot or an anti-Semite is something that comes with the territory if you happen to think asking questions is important. The irony is that you are likely to be called such names by those that have reached a certainty about most things in life.

Anyway, I think this is an interesting video about Science and Scientists. I donít think Iím anti-science btw.




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Old 24th Feb 2019, 09:30
  #54 (permalink)  
 
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I thought Gardisil had been banned in a few countries. japan for one i believe
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 09:40
  #55 (permalink)  
 
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The other battle I had with vaccinations and zero clue coming from my partner.

Herbal crap...… most have zero clue what they are taking. Its deemed natural and therefore good for the kid.

Herbal crap is a mixture of drugs which you have zero clue what's in it and pretty much zero Qa on or testing.

So you load your kid up with this herbal crap on the recommendation of the fanny waxer. You then take your kid for its jabs and something weird happens...…..

No its not the herbal crap its obviously the jab..... which has never been tested with a fanny waxers ultimate brew in a kids system.
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 09:47
  #56 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Stan Woolley View Post
Anyway, I think this is an interesting video about Science and Scientists. I donít think Iím anti-science btw.
I half-expected to see Michael Gove's name among the YouTube comments.

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Old 24th Feb 2019, 09:58
  #57 (permalink)  
 
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And another thing I have seen.

The kids temperature goes a ball hair over 37. Siren goes off all hands to stations, get the herbal crap out.

They then want to dose the hell of it with all manner of crap. Gone are the days of getting a spoon full of cod liver oil as punishment for getting ill.

If nothing changed in 24 hours its off to the doctor to demand antibiotics.

In my youth the GP used to have a huge bottle of cod liver oil in his office and if your mum took you in sick then the first thing was a huge spoon of that. After which he then poked and prodded you.
Only twice going into his office I didn't kick up a stink about said spoon of Cod liver oil. Both times I was in hospital pretty sharpish. The times I did kick off we were sent home with instructions for plenty of fluids and soup and yet more cod liver oil.

Years later in the pub I challenged the auld bugger about cod liver oil in his office and this fighting having it. I said I reckoned that if you didn't fight it you were obviously ill and if you did that there was nothing wrong with you that wouldn't fix itself.

"oh hell, after 35 years of medicine I have been found out!!!!"

Only problem I have with my kid is the little sod likes cod liver oil. Hasn't had any antibiotics yet, just the jabs and no herbal crap.
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 10:09
  #58 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by DaveReidUK View Post
I half-expected to see Michael Gove's name among the YouTube comments.
Sorry Dave, I don’t get this?

Did you watch the video?
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 10:23
  #59 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
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Well I didn't

Corbett report is listed as

CONSPIRACY-PSEUDOSCIENCE

Sources in the Conspiracy-Pseudoscience category may publish unverifiable information that is not always supported by evidence. These sources may be untrustworthy for credible/verifiable information, therefore fact checking and further investigation is recommended on a per article basis when obtaining information from these sources. See all Conspiracy-Pseudoscience sources.

Factual Reporting: LOW

Notes: The Corbett Reports is a right wing biased conspiracy site. Some featured topics are the New World Order, 9-11 conspiracies and of course false flag operations. There are many more. (D. Van Zandt 2/4/2017)


Just because some idiot puts something on youtube doesn't make it fact. I don't need to watch a youtube video to know a flat earth or chemtrail video is utter bollocks. and I won't click on the links and give the advertising revenue.
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Old 24th Feb 2019, 10:27
  #60 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
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An aquaintance who is an anti-vaxxer bought a puppy, I asked her if she was going to get it vaccinated, she said of course not.

Poor little pup got parvo. It survived, but suffered terribly and it cost her a fortune in vet bills and was all unnecessary if she had just got its jabs done, as all responsible owners should. It took that for her to change her mind and realise that vets aren't trying to turn all our dogs autistic.

Anti-vaxxers should be banned from keeping animals.
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