Electric radiators
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: In the circuit
Posts: 177
Electric radiators
We're having an extension built at the moment, which involves opening up quite a large space, part of which is heated by the existing gas central heating system. In the new part the builder has proposed an electric radiator as a better solution than extending the gas ch to accommodate it. Unfortunately all the existing heating is on microbore pipe which means any new stuff would also have to be microbore, and I wonder if this is the driver behind the recommendation. The installation of an electric solution would be cheaper and he tells me they are really efficient these days. I'm sceptical,although I I'm not convinced that the existing boiler is good enough to support a bigger system (the adidtional space is about 4m square).
The spec proposed is this:
7 elements
Nominal power 770W
Effective power 293W
680x550x95 dimensions
Any views?
Thanks GB.
The spec proposed is this:
7 elements
Nominal power 770W
Effective power 293W
680x550x95 dimensions
Any views?
Thanks GB.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 77
Posts: 16,742
I needed to install heating in our conservatory. Extending the house system was impossible and adding a small wet system expensive. I fitted two 600 w all mounted convection heaters. They were about £15 each. They had two output levels, 24 hr time switches and variable thermostats.
Obviously the running costs were more than a wet gas system but overall the costs were minimal.
I would have liked a power neon to show they were On and a graduated temperature control but at the price well no contest.
Obviously the running costs were more than a wet gas system but overall the costs were minimal.
I would have liked a power neon to show they were On and a graduated temperature control but at the price well no contest.
Resident insomniac
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: N54 58 34 W02 01 21
Age: 76
Posts: 1,863
The electric radiators that were fitted in the house that I bought in 1976 were silica radiant tubes in a sheet-metal housing, rather than fluid filled.
In addition to simple controls on the units, there were time switches that controlled 'zones' - such that upstairs and downstairs operated independently, so the control was 'fine'.
The weakness was that the building was hopelessly insulated (with draughts that circulated between the drywall and the structural wall) so the efficiency was compromised, but it did allow rooms to be supplied with heat as required.
Another problem was that the surface of the metal housings got extremely hot and would singe anything that came into contact - including skin, so they weren't child-friendly.
In addition to simple controls on the units, there were time switches that controlled 'zones' - such that upstairs and downstairs operated independently, so the control was 'fine'.
The weakness was that the building was hopelessly insulated (with draughts that circulated between the drywall and the structural wall) so the efficiency was compromised, but it did allow rooms to be supplied with heat as required.
Another problem was that the surface of the metal housings got extremely hot and would singe anything that came into contact - including skin, so they weren't child-friendly.
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Carlisle
Posts: 10
There is something to be said for a mixture of heat sources, in a former home I had a log burner, gas central heating and also a couple of wall mounted electric heaters, I could be pretty sure that I could still have reduced heating in power cuts or gas supply problems.
I have just had my oil central heating off line for a couple of weeks, u/s motor and fuel pump, I managed to keep the house quite warm with an open coal fire and a couple of oil filled mobile electric heaters, also good sense to have an electric immersion heater fitted for emergencies.
I have just had my oil central heating off line for a couple of weeks, u/s motor and fuel pump, I managed to keep the house quite warm with an open coal fire and a couple of oil filled mobile electric heaters, also good sense to have an electric immersion heater fitted for emergencies.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 77
Posts: 16,742
AB, for true redundancy with gas or oil central heating you need a generator to power the system as well. Agree about a log burner though.
Nigerian In Law
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Haven't been there, never done that.
Age: 62
Posts: 1,014
Groundbased,
My entire house is heated electrically (not connected to gas), it's very cheap, efficient and clean. I use Eko Rad heaters and bathroom shower rail. They come up on an internet search. All sorts of optional bells and whistles too. They plug into normal 13A domestic sockets and look very sleek.
Hope this helps.
NEO
My entire house is heated electrically (not connected to gas), it's very cheap, efficient and clean. I use Eko Rad heaters and bathroom shower rail. They come up on an internet search. All sorts of optional bells and whistles too. They plug into normal 13A domestic sockets and look very sleek.
Hope this helps.
NEO
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,431
Originally Posted by Groundbased
he tells me they are really efficient these days
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: mids
Age: 55
Posts: 0
HAve you had any thoughts about getting a heat pump and blower?
Quite a bit more initially but you can have aircon in the summer then as well.
In the region of 4.5 kw of heat output for every 1kw of electricity sued. Nothing stopping you having a second blower in another room as well.
Quite a bit more initially but you can have aircon in the summer then as well.
In the region of 4.5 kw of heat output for every 1kw of electricity sued. Nothing stopping you having a second blower in another room as well.
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kelowna Wine Country
Posts: 445
On this continent we use baseboard electric heaters (among others.)
I have installed and lived with water based radiators and both back boilers and "on demand" combis in the UK and wen we got over here we had hot air with gas furnace. In our last house we did not have mains gas so had the option of a huge propane tank and gas or staying with the electric baseboards that were already installed. AS electricity in BC is relatively cheap (compared to other provinces) we stayed with the baseboards.
They are basically a simple element in a horizontal strip and work by convection. They can come with included or remote thermostats and are extremely cheap to buy and install and take up little room. The only caveat is not to push your soft furniture against them or let blankets etc fall on them.
Our bills were less than with our previous gas hot air even though it was an older house with worse insulation because we did not have to heat rooms we were not using. (Put the thermostat on 5 deg. so nothing froze.)
Personally I really liked the baseboards. Our living room had huge picture windows that went down to 12in. from the floor and the baseboards below. The room was always comfortable and the heat gradient and circulation worked perfectly. I would prefer baseboards over radiators any day.
Being a cheapskate I would want to calculate the cost of running the electric against the gas and the installation costs. Also, as mentioned above electric is always 100% efficient (don't be fooled by adverts for "Ceramic' or other things. No improvement over 100%) Also include the cost of running the pump of water based. (not much, but it adds up when it runs 20 hrs a day.)
I have installed and lived with water based radiators and both back boilers and "on demand" combis in the UK and wen we got over here we had hot air with gas furnace. In our last house we did not have mains gas so had the option of a huge propane tank and gas or staying with the electric baseboards that were already installed. AS electricity in BC is relatively cheap (compared to other provinces) we stayed with the baseboards.
They are basically a simple element in a horizontal strip and work by convection. They can come with included or remote thermostats and are extremely cheap to buy and install and take up little room. The only caveat is not to push your soft furniture against them or let blankets etc fall on them.
Our bills were less than with our previous gas hot air even though it was an older house with worse insulation because we did not have to heat rooms we were not using. (Put the thermostat on 5 deg. so nothing froze.)
Personally I really liked the baseboards. Our living room had huge picture windows that went down to 12in. from the floor and the baseboards below. The room was always comfortable and the heat gradient and circulation worked perfectly. I would prefer baseboards over radiators any day.
Being a cheapskate I would want to calculate the cost of running the electric against the gas and the installation costs. Also, as mentioned above electric is always 100% efficient (don't be fooled by adverts for "Ceramic' or other things. No improvement over 100%) Also include the cost of running the pump of water based. (not much, but it adds up when it runs 20 hrs a day.)
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: SAM. u.k.
Age: 77
Posts: 271
Go for programmable underfloor electric heating, I went this way about 10 years ago in a new conservatory.
It is brilliant, I set it to come on at about 4am at 20C and when we get up it's up to temp, this is ambient not floor temp.
Wouldn't be without it.
It is brilliant, I set it to come on at about 4am at 20C and when we get up it's up to temp, this is ambient not floor temp.
Wouldn't be without it.
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: spacetime
Posts: 263
Originally Posted by denachtenmai
Go for programmable underfloor electric heating, I went this way about 10 years ago in a new conservatory.
It is brilliant, I set it to come on at about 4am at 20C and when we get up it's up to temp, this is ambient not floor temp.
Wouldn't be without it.
It is brilliant, I set it to come on at about 4am at 20C and when we get up it's up to temp, this is ambient not floor temp.
Wouldn't be without it.
I leave my central heating on permanently and adjust the thermostat accordingly. Not saying that`s right or wrong, but it must take underfloor heating an awful long time from cold to reap the effect.
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Everett, WA
Age: 65
Posts: 3,126
First place I owned had electric baseboard heating - the separate thermostats for each major room was nice compared to the single central thermostat I have in my current house, but the forced air gas heat does cost less (makes more noise though).
However the baseboard heater did scorch the back of my sofa when it was inadvertently pushed up against it - scared me a bit. Maybe the new ones are safer (this was almost 40 years ago).
However the baseboard heater did scorch the back of my sofa when it was inadvertently pushed up against it - scared me a bit. Maybe the new ones are safer (this was almost 40 years ago).
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: River Thames & Surrey
Age: 72
Posts: 8,901
Originally Posted by gemma10
I leave my central heating on permanently and adjust the thermostat accordingly. Not saying that`s right or wrong, but it must take underfloor heating an awful long time from cold to reap the effect.
I know some houses have warm air systems with floor vents, but it seems to me the Romans had it right with their hypocaust system which heated the walls as well as the floor.
Last edited by chevvron; 10th Nov 2018 at 12:24.
Thought police antagonist
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Where I always have been...firmly in the real world
Posts: 64
Originally Posted by denachtenmai
Go for programmable underfloor electric heating, I went this way about 10 years ago in a new conservatory.
It is brilliant, I set it to come on at about 4am at 20C and when we get up it's up to temp, this is ambient not floor temp.
Wouldn't be without it.
It is brilliant, I set it to come on at about 4am at 20C and when we get up it's up to temp, this is ambient not floor temp.
Wouldn't be without it.
Obviously, whilst personal heating and temps preferences are entirely individual choices, and I fully understand, , that, for some with medical and age related requirements ambient temps are essential, unless people live in the more remote areas of the UK then 20degs is quite high really.
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 77
Posts: 16,742
Remember the OP wanted an opinion on heating an enlarged space that was previously heated with a wet microbore system.
There are two factors to consider, operation and cost. The first is the ability of the boiler to hear more radiators. Best advice here would be to ask a plumber not a builder. The other is economic - the expense of increasing the wet or operation of the electric.
If the boiler is old and might need changing in a year or so then it might be sensible to upgrade now and adopt a wet solution.
There are two factors to consider, operation and cost. The first is the ability of the boiler to hear more radiators. Best advice here would be to ask a plumber not a builder. The other is economic - the expense of increasing the wet or operation of the electric.
If the boiler is old and might need changing in a year or so then it might be sensible to upgrade now and adopt a wet solution.
Last edited by Pontius Navigator; 10th Nov 2018 at 09:06.
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 406
Originally Posted by oldpax
Tone,sit down and think about what you just said.
Clearly Tone's irony went straight over your head. The point Tone was making was picking up from the heating 'engineer' nonsense about how electric heaters "are really efficient these days". So if electric heaters have always been 100% efficient, as GtW correctly says, how the hell can they have miraculously become really efficient these days without becoming over 100% efficient, ie, perpetual motion has now been invented, which was exactly Tone's point. But their humour is rather wasted once it has to be spelled out in such microscopic detail to you.
As for Groundbased's original debate about costs, aside from the installation costs, the running costs are very simple to compare:
The electric option being 100% efficient will cost the actual electricity unit cost per kWH to heat, ie aprox 15p per unit, assuming the heat is on a day rate tariff (no mention of storage heating was made). The radiator on the gas system can be assumed to be around 75% overall efficiency, hence the equivalent cost will be around 1.33x the gas unit price, ie aprox 3p x 1.33, therefore close to 4p per unit of heat. Therefore the actual cost of the electric heat will be (as it generally has always been) aprox. 4x the cos of the gas fired via radiator option. Assuming say 1,000 units use per year for heating this space, the cost difference is likely to be around £150 for electric radiator against £40 for radiator. Scale according to actual usage.
It is sad that heating 'engineers' continue to bu11$hlt customers with all this high efficiency nonsense to sell whatever they want to sell.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: mids
Age: 55
Posts: 0
100% efficiency is pretty rubbish these days to be honest with heat pumps. Try 450% efficiency.
It all depends how long they intend to keep the place. If its over 5 years then the Heat pump beats other forms of heating. Which gets us into gas heating realms of cost. Plus you can have cooling as well.
It all depends how long they intend to keep the place. If its over 5 years then the Heat pump beats other forms of heating. Which gets us into gas heating realms of cost. Plus you can have cooling as well.
