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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 19th Dec 2018, 14:55
  #1681 (permalink)  
 
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Amazing hubris. For 41 in a 30mph, that woman would have received a speed awareness course if she'd just owned up. Now it looks like jail time & a career in tatters.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 15:04
  #1682 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fitter2 View Post
Many of the 'truths' of the remain faction are forecasts of disaster by the same forecasters who have proved wildly wrong in the past.

As far as EU trying to block our dapature, I call the negotiating tactic of refusing point blank to discuss future trading arrangements before the 9 month process of haggling down a €100 billion ransom to a mere €39 billion was completed. The later tactic of creating a hard border between NI and ROI (a soluble problem unless you are Barnier) unless you break up the UK - an unacceptable demand - and then repeatedly saying 'you can always cancel BREXIT' - not a 100% lie, merely a point of view.
The remain 'faction' is half the country mate. Or more likely two thirds of it by now, given the absolute shambles this right wing disaster project has been revealed to be. Another thing about being a full member of a rules based organisation is adhering to those rules whilst a member & the rules say no trade side deals, so one more example where your rhetoric is flat out nonsense.

On the border though, I'm on the phone to No.10 to tell them there's some bloke on an internet forum has totally solved that thing the entire UK government hasn't been able to sort for two years. Absolute fantasy.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 15:04
  #1683 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by PDR1 View Post
you might want to consider the amount of time you spend [on here] trying to incite Islamophobic hatred and reflect on where your remarks sit on the pot/kettle chromaticity index.
I am unaware of ever being under threat from an Jews, Rosicrucians etc. but when I am out and about at stations, airports, shopping centres, Christmas markets and any other places where a large number of people congregate, I can't fail to notice Gendarmes, CRS and Army personnel, armed to the teeth. Giant concrete barriers and checkpoints are now the norm, where before there was little impediment to daily life.

Maybe you have different ideas of who they are trying to protect the populace from, but I am under no illusion who is most likely to cause carnage. A violent cult is hiding behind a façade of religion and even the Prime Minister, Theresa May, is afraid to say it as it is. Referring to the Manchester Arena bombing, she said that the victims had been "lost", not murdered, slaughtered or blown to bits...simply lost, as if they would suddenly reappear.

You spout about Islamophobia, but the vast majority see exactly where the hatred is coming from and are right to highlight it. Only deluded fools and apologists see otherwise.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 15:17
  #1684 (permalink)  
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A long day at the lending library and there is no apostrophe so the word should he written thus:
hers
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 15:23
  #1685 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
As someone who agrees with you more often than not, I am disappointed to read that.
The one thing that she has done wrong is to become Prime Minister on a ticket of leaving the EU, after she had sensibly voted against Brexi​​​t. Since then she has worked long and hard to get the best possible exit deal from the EU. It is of course nothing like the deal that the Brexit liars promised their dupes, but still the best that the EU were ever going to allow.
She is also greatly restricted in her movements by the Loony Tunes ERG party members.
For what she has managed to achieve she deserves some credit, and you are unreasonable to call her stupid.
I would justify the epithet "stupid" insofar as she has failed to reach out to the sensible wing of the Labour party, and continues to pander to the ERG rather than the more pragmatic centrist rump of her party. Also continuing to dogmatically trot out the mantra "the will of the people" which was just that on one day in June 2016, and with a wafer thin majority. The strong action to have taken with her party was surely to have told them in no uncertain terms that if they didn't accept her deal, then the result would be allowing a free vote an a new referendum. That would have put some cabinet members noses out of joint, but cabinet ministers are replaceable, but at the same time made all of the leave leaning MPs painfully aware that there would be a high risk of losing their Brexit prize if they didn't support her.

She does deserve more than a little credit for negotiating a deal that does allow the UK to have it's cake and eat it, to a far greater extent than I ever thought would be possible - she should have been much firmer in pushing to get t it through parliament.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 15:25
  #1686 (permalink)  
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Have they nothing left to argue about other than to debate who among them is stupid?
It really is enough to make the stars throw down their spears and water heaven with their tears.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 15:51
  #1687 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cavortingcheetah View Post
Have they nothing left to argue about other than to debate who among them is stupid?
It really is enough to make the stars throw down their spears and water heaven with their tears.
yep, agreed.100+- days to go to the big day, nevertheless they are taking Christmas off...and now they are wasting what parliamentary time is left in part arguing over... “he said” “she said”....

If they were toddlers you’d send them off to bed ....

The whole system at Westminster (physical structure, debating protocol, voting system) is simply no longer fit for purpose in this day and age.

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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:08
  #1688 (permalink)  
 
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I spent a life sentence married to a woman who was profoundly deaf and I became fairly adept at lip reading. Having watched Corbyn, I am of the pinion that he actually said "Stupid people". I could be wrong and certainly wouldn't come on here to bat for him he had indeed said that.
As for the MP involved with the speeding related offences; now there is a stupid woman if ever there was one. I notice the Labour Party are calling for her to resign her membership. They should be calling for her to pack her bags before the van arrives!
Sprogget: Not for the first time have you credited me with ideas/quotes which came not from me. At no point did I advocate the government should throw open the borders, relax all border controls etc. I did say, it is within the government's powers to manage import controls with at least a modicum of common sense.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:11
  #1689 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sprogget View Post
The remain 'faction' is half the country mate. Or more likely two thirds of it by now, given the absolute shambles this right wing disaster project has been revealed to be. Another thing about being a full member of a rules based organisation is adhering to those rules whilst a member & the rules say no trade side deals, so one more example where your rhetoric is flat out nonsense.

On the border though, I'm on the phone to No.10 to tell them there's some bloke on an internet forum has totally solved that thing the entire UK government hasn't been able to sort for two years. Absolute fantasy.

My bold.

Exhibit B.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8198271.html
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:16
  #1690 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sprogget View Post
What you call obstruction, others view as responsible intervention as a result of truths being revealed over the passage of time. That you say in the next breath the EU has consistently tried to block the UK's departure is flat out wrong. Not slightly, not a little but 100% an untruth.

The prime minister made her choices and those were to leave the single market, the customs union & end freedom of movement. Those choices and those choices alone created the irreconcilable issue that is the Northern Ireland border. it has nothing to do with the EU taking a pound of flesh but it's entirely in keeping with the worst Brextremist m.o. of always blaming someone else for their actions.

My bold. I see what you are saying, but how do you square that with Macron's specific threat, and it is a threat, that he will not allow the UK to leave the customs backstop unless and until we agree, in layman's terms, access to UK waters for French fisherman. If we cannot leave the CU then we have not really left the EU surely? Not the EU per se I would agree, but its not exactly the EU using 'best endeavours' to ensure the backstop is not implemented is it.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:23
  #1691 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post
The EU is having a problem with some of members breaking the EU's rules. That's nothing new.

But since the UK has decided to no longer be a member of the EU, it's no longer any of our business what goes inside the EU. If we wanted to change how individual countries behave, we'd have to stay within it and elect MEPs who would work to improve it instead of standing up to insult other members before collecting their generous benefit payments.

We are now only involved with the rules that govern a departing member, and it seems they are being applied properly.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:32
  #1692 (permalink)  
 
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It’s hard to see how she can fairly be called stupid when she’s trying her best to resolve a situation that she actively campaigned not to be in, attempting the near-impossible job of reconciling die-hards from both poles of the argument. Meanwhile the “leader” of the opposition has only insults and catcalls, blocking the only compromise deal there is while offering nothing in its place.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:38
  #1693 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
The EU is having a problem with some of members breaking the EU's rules. That's nothing new.

But since the UK has decided to no longer be a member of the EU, it's no longer any of our business what goes inside the EU. If we wanted to change how individual countries behave, we'd have to stay within it and elect MEPs who would work to improve it instead of standing up to insult other members before collecting their generous benefit payments.

We are now only involved with the rules that govern a departing member, and it seems they are being applied properly.
Deflection I'm afraid SA1234. The posting Sprogget made referenced that in a rules based organisation you have to follow the rules. Clearly Germany does not agree. The same article says that the UK is relatively good at implementing EU rules - not perfect I would agree. That is the point though.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:39
  #1694 (permalink)  
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Of course what goes on inside Europe is the business of the UK!
Any abuse of human rights, for example, is of concern to any country on a global basis.
Ryanair, having fired all its flight and cabin crew in Eindhoven because the crews wouldn't relocate to dangerous countries in North Africa and Eastern Europe, is being taken to court by the crews for breaches of their human rights. British airspace should be closed to all Ryanair traffic until the extent of this alleged breach has been determined by a Dutch court. In this way Britain will be able to demonstrate to the EU that it will not be subjugated in matters of human rights and international transport simply because it is leaving the empire based at Berlaymont. It will also enable the UK to underline the fact that, while the unelected, biased and perhaps rather bigoted ECJ will have no jurisdiction in the UK, the decisions of national courts at senior levels will be respected. The Dutch government will respond in kind and while Britain and the Dutch have had their odd disagreement in the past, one must not forget that William III of England was a Dutchman, albeit an Orange too.

(Edited to reflect amazement of author at extent of aviation content).
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:51
  #1695 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post
My bold. I see what you are saying, but how do you square that with Macron's specific threat, and it is a threat, that he will not allow the UK to leave the customs backstop unless and until we agree, in layman's terms, access to UK waters for French fisherman. If we cannot leave the CU then we have not really left the EU surely? Not the EU per se I would agree, but its not exactly the EU using 'best endeavours' to ensure the backstop is not implemented is it.
I don't. Politicians gonna politic, especially when they realise they've got us over a barrel. Certainly discussions are going on in respect of trade deals but the contention Fitter made was we were being actively punished by the EU forbidding us from doing deals at all. A favourite leaver trope. On the specific point about the CU, I reiterate there is no blue print for Brexit, it is perfectly possible to leave the EU & remain in the customs union. The choices made were made by the government. It's their mess to sort out
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 16:57
  #1696 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by sfm818 View Post
Just a quick reminder. There are now 100 stockpiling days to Brexmas.
I haven't yet found the "'#brexit cupboard" I'm told we now have. The only unusual items I've seen on the supermarket bills have been greater than usual quantities of champagne (yes I know we boycott France because of the Rainbow Warrior, but champagne has to be an exception as you can't get it anywhere else).

I can only assume that she is stocking up for the street parties when #brexit is cancelled.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 17:11
  #1697 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by yellowtriumph View Post
Deflection I'm afraid SA1234. The posting Sprogget made referenced that in a rules based organisation you have to follow the rules. Clearly Germany does not agree. The same article says that the UK is relatively good at implementing EU rules - not perfect I would agree. That is the point though.
Yes, your link was indeed a deflection. Nothing whatever to do with Brexit.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 17:18
  #1698 (permalink)  
 
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I'm not sure where that gets you anyway. Pointing at Germany is whataboutery, nothing to do with us & of no relevance to anything under discussion. If the thought process is the Germans are doing it so we should too, then get hold of your MP & point it out.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 17:40
  #1699 (permalink)  
 
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I dislike Corbyn and all of his policies. But looking at his video close-up, I'm certain that he said 'stupid people'. Whatever, what a load of unnecessary feminist-fuss being created by the childlike - they have far more important things to resolve.
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Old 19th Dec 2018, 17:50
  #1700 (permalink)  
 
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Liar,liar pants on fire! I watched it live and I saw him say “stupid woman”. Another example of his ‘honesty politics’ This man is a serial liar. Virgin trains, IRA connections, laying wreath to terrorists, voted remain when a life long anti EU campaigner. Need I go on?

There are a hell,of a lot of mugs out there who think he is honest.
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