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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 6th Mar 2019, 13:06
  #5761 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cavortingcheetah View Post
Gamal Abdul,
Abdel. Gamal Abdel. First Oslo, now this.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 13:14
  #5762 (permalink)  
Está servira para distraerle.
 
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Absolutely shocking state of affairs, too much fiddling in the dark, I'll be bound.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 15:52
  #5763 (permalink)  
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Breaking news ! Consumer boom to hit UK ! Starts March 30th ! .....assuming people are still working after various sectors start to encounter financial problems that is.

I like the bit at then end as well, about waiting until the last minute to sign.......bit like bidding on ebay then, or waiting for last minute reductions to sell seats .....or just sheer plain incompetence on his part and understanding of matters.

We await Gove explaining to the farmers as to why his promises may not have been quite as a factual as he claimed....

https://www.theguardian.com/politics...-avoid-no-deal
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 15:55
  #5764 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
It was never on the cards, that would mean we were out of the customs Union which the EU doesn't want and completely screws up all the current EU trade deals. So even if it had been acceptable the EU wouldn't have gone for it. Nothing is going to be discussed sensibly until after we are out the CU completely. Up until that point its more a load of fannying about to show face that both sides want to do a deal but in reality no deal could be done where the UK escapes the CU or the ECJ.

I think the EU would have been rather happy for us to stay in the Single Market, and were rather surprised at Mrs May’s Lancaster House speech. It was this that put us down the road of a hard Brexit.

Last edited by zoigberg; 6th Mar 2019 at 16:04. Reason: First attempt was nonsense
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 16:03
  #5765 (permalink)  
 
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...When 80% of the economy is services. Good old Mrs. May. Elsewhere, I note the business secretary, Greg Clarke has said HMG will not publish tariff levels unless we leave with no deal. As dry as that may sound, it blows a hole through any efforts at effective preparations the same HMG has been urging businesses to take.

Make a million widgets? Today? That's a no.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 16:57
  #5766 (permalink)  
 
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Parapunter: There you go again! If you want to pick on someone with a non-argument, try a bit harder than on the spelling of Nasser's name. As there are to all intents and purposes, no vowels in Arabic (except for 'Alef' the equivalent of 'A') it makes no difference how you write his name in English. it is still the same name. One thing about Nasser though is that he was the only President anywhere who was called "beautiful". Seriously, Gamal, pronounced with a hard G in Egypt but a soft G (J) elsewhere, is the Arabic for beautiful. I seem to remember the name Nasser means Victor, as in the Winner. So, all in all, he was named Beautiful Servant of the Winner. On the one hand, I disliked him a lot as he was behind arming terrorists in Aden in the 1960s and, at the same time, encouraging the Republicans in the Yemen civil war to cross the border into the Radfan (part of Aden) and cause murder and mayhem there. On the other hand, he repaid Eisenhower for his intervention in Suez. The CIA thought they were backing a winner when they supplied him with $2Million to fund who knows what? Nasser took the money and built a tower, still standing in Cairo and known to the locals as the CIA tower!
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 17:29
  #5767 (permalink)  
 
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Wow! Clearly some paid extra to have the "all day" argument. I only paid £5, so can only have 5 minutes.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 17:42
  #5768 (permalink)  
 
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America builds canal in foreign country, takes control of it's environs, canal opens in 1914, handed over to indigenous population 1999. US hypocrisy over the Suez Canal? surely not...…..
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 19:13
  #5769 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Ancient Observer View Post
Wow! Clearly some paid extra to have the "all day" argument. I only paid £5, so can only have 5 minutes.
not even the full half hour!
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 20:33
  #5770 (permalink)  
 
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Single market only helps with inter member standards and tariffs. Anything external to member countries gets tariffed and also vat gets paid on everything imported.

Means UK import market gets excluded from all EU trade deals. Plus it collects it's its own import vat. It's a collosal change in balance.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 20:49
  #5771 (permalink)  
 
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Fair enough Tescoapp, which shows that nothing in this process is simple. Mind you, it is a much smaller collosal change in balance to the collosal collosal one we have facing us now.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 20:50
  #5772 (permalink)  
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https://order-order.com/2019/03/06/g...mes-harder-uk/
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 20:55
  #5773 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
Single market only helps with inter member standards and tariffs. Anything external to member countries gets tariffed and also vat gets paid on everything imported.

Means UK import market gets excluded from all EU trade deals. Plus it collects it's its own import vat. It's a collosal change in balance.
Anything external gets tariffed. Oh really?

As a huge fan of the Euro stats website, you must surely be aware that 70% of imports into the EU are zero or reduced tariff. I mean you keep on punting any thought that crosses your mind if it can paint a negative image of the EU & people like me bat them away with remarkable ease & you just keep going.

The shamelessness is really something. I couldn't do it, I'd be too embarrassed to flaunt my ignorance in public like this.


https://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statis...oods_-_tariffs
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 20:59
  #5774 (permalink)  
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Maybe I’m missing something. Everything external gets tariffed, the rate might be 0% or 30%, but it gets checked and tariffed.

On the converse, I believe the UK is supposed to pass on any VAT receipts to the EU in accordance with VAT regulations. Willing to be corrected.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 21:28
  #5775 (permalink)  
 
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Orac you have it right. It also gets vat levied as well.

Which means a hard border would be required still between Ireland and NI just as there is between Norway and Sweden.

Products from Canada couldn't come in zero tariffs into Rotterdam clear import customs and then get shipped straight to UK. They would be liable for vat and tariffs entering UK plus inspection. Same product from say Sweden would automatically be presumed to comply with standards, it's eea produce cert would allow it zero tariffs but again vat would be extracted.

uk could import as much sugar cane as it likes at WTO tariffs and produce all its own sugar and not charge the elevated EU tariff in place to protect the sugar beat farmers. As the UK uses the bulk of the sugar produced in the EU from sugar beat it would decimate beat production in main land europe.

Long way of saying it would be unacceptable from a backstop pov and also escape from customs Union to the EU so it's a bit of a pie in the sky idea.

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Old 6th Mar 2019, 22:05
  #5776 (permalink)  
 
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Para single market EEA member iaka Norway is different to being part of the customs Union like EU members who are part of both.




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Old 6th Mar 2019, 22:46
  #5777 (permalink)  
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As the UK uses the bulk of the sugar produced in the EU from sugar beat it would decimate beat production in main land europe.
One problem with the EU was high value chasing monoculture. An example would be rape. One country producing more than it needs for local market but able to supply other EU markets. The UK lamb production is a case in point. Much land capable of lamb production is less or unsuitable for other crops. UK wine production has probably displaced another crop.

Sugar beet, as Tesco observed is imported from the EU. Sugar beet was a major product in Lincolnshire but was displaced to Europe.

It will take time for farmers to rebalance their production.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 23:00
  #5778 (permalink)  
 
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Pontius Navigator:
One problem with the EU was high value chasing monoculture. An example would be rape. One country producing more than it needs for local market but able to supply other EU markets. The UK lamb production is a case in point. Much land capable of lamb production is less or unsuitable for other crops. UK wine production has probably displaced another crop.
What you are describing is the specialization which free trade (or customs union + Single Market) generally brings about and which has long been realised as mutually beneficial. This has been a basic feature of British trade policy since the abolition of the Corn Laws in the 1840s. Now it appears that all this is to be undone in the age of Trump and Brexit. That's progress!
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 23:03
  #5779 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post
One problem with the EU was high value chasing monoculture. An example would be rape. One country producing more than it needs for local market but able to supply other EU markets. The UK lamb production is a case in point. Much land capable of lamb production is less or unsuitable for other crops. UK wine production has probably displaced another crop.

Sugar beet, as Tesco observed is imported from the EU. Sugar beet was a major product in Lincolnshire but was displaced to Europe.

It will take time for farmers to rebalance their production.
Sugar beet is still a huge crop in Lincolnshire and Norfolk. 8,000 tonnes a year.
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Old 6th Mar 2019, 23:11
  #5780 (permalink)  
 
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There is a collosal sugar cane refinery on the Thames which is operating at a fraction of its capacity due to the amount of cane the UK can import at a normal tariff before the protective tariff kicks in.

Which is the objection in the WTO UK and EU want to split the allocation. The EU doesn't want a single stick of it never mind half the allocation. The UK pretty much takes the whole allocation now. If it didn't have to apply the protective tariff the factory could ramp up to full production and no more imports of beat from EU. Using the beat for bio fuel is worth about a third as it is for sugar.

Other countries want the full allocation in both EU and UK.

And owners of said sugar refinery on the Thames is on my list for post exit investment after the 29th.
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