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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 16th Feb 2019, 10:11
  #4741 (permalink)  
 
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As Keynes observed: " In the long run we're all dead".
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 10:19
  #4742 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
There have been more than a few opened up offices in the UK. Engineering firms have had an increased presence for over a year now. They are just paper work exercises at the moment.

There are more than a few EU funds and company's that don't want to be only be listed in EU markets and want access to London.

Nothing will be declared or much happen until its known definitely out or in. Then there will be a flurry of companies rearranging things. And it won't be as the media are reporting or as any of us have predicted. Its a bit to fluid for them to commit to anything yet.

My mates engineering firms have all the scripts setup and ready to run on the computer databases. But they won't hit the button until its 100% certain UK is out and that won't happen until the second hand goes past the hour on the 29th.

For them given the choice between the 29th of March and a couple of months later the 29th of March will save them a heap of problems with accountancy and tax years.
So that's the best you can offer. Firms running computer scripts to keep a notional paper presence in the UK.

You reckon that's going to make up for the firms who have been moving head offices, moving production, out of the UK.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 10:44
  #4743 (permalink)  
 
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It’s not about what Tesco has to offer: is your position that any democratic exercise be nullified after the event based on the views of Nissan or Airbus Industrie? What if Corbyn were to win an election? That would cause economic damage way beyond anything from Brexit (and probably not stop it!) Would you be demanding the election be nixed?
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 10:49
  #4744 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShotOne View Post
It’s not about what Tesco has to offer: is your position that any democratic exercise be nullified after the event based on the views of Nissan or Airbus Industrie? What if Corbyn were to win an election? That would cause economic damage way beyond anything from Brexit (and probably not stop it!) Would you be demanding the election be nixed?
If you would care to look back to the Brexit thread in 2016, you will see that I accepted the result of the referendum there and then. There will be no re-run.
That doesn't stop me pointing out at every opportunity how disastrous Brexit is for the UK.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 10:53
  #4745 (permalink)  
 
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It’s not about what Tesco has to offer: is your position that any democratic exercise be nullified after the event based on the views of Nissan or Airbus Industrie
Well, if the exercise is based on a campaign of misinformation and promises that are broken after the "exercise" over and over again or turn out to be undeliverable - the answer appears to be "yes".

The point, however, is moot. The EU by now is probably so fed up with the UK that they will only accept them back on terms the UK will not like at all. You know, like the obnoxious kid in kindergarten that everybody else hopes will move to pastures new as soon as possible after endless teacher-parent conferences with headmaster Jean-Claude have led to nothing so that chaos ends and resources can be spent on all the other kids again.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 11:16
  #4746 (permalink)  
 
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Why even start with the “they won’t have us back” nonsense? That’s only for remoaner wet dreams.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 11:55
  #4747 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by Parapunter View Post
those pesky/treacherous/quisling remainers even though they represent by a fag paper, just under half of the plebiscite & almost certainly a majority of the people is convenient.
Keeping saying we 'won't often enough even though we lost does not make It any different. There is no way you can attribute the majority of non-voters to 'content with the status quo'. Equally they could all be in the confused/abstained/couldn't give a shit camp.

​​​
It should have been a 'I don't know what I'm doing' klaxon as soon as we heard 'Brexit means Brexit' and 'Red, white & blue Brexit', as meaningless a pair of phrases as it's possible to conjure
Now that I agree with.

. From there, we had the triggering of Article 50 which set the clock ticking in much the same way as lighting the fuse on a stick of dynamite
My neighbour is a county disaster planner and Brexit has taken over his life. He said of only we had left back in 2016 and moved on from there. He would also agree that the majority thought as Farage said back at the time, we were out the day after the vote.

May maybe incompetent but Cameron is the one who caused this fiasco and then jumped ship despite saying he would stay.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 11:57
  #4748 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShotOne View Post
It’s not about what Tesco has to offer: is your position that any democratic exercise be nullified after the event based on the views of Nissan or Airbus Industrie? What if Corbyn were to win an election? That would cause economic damage way beyond anything from Brexit (and probably not stop it!) Would you be demanding the election be nixed?
So it boils down to this. Protect the outcome of a flawed exercise in democracy that was almost certainly interfered with by foreign powers whether Brexiters accept it or not, that was won by a technically laughable margin and that will clearly damage the country to a huge extent for years to come, entirely contrary to the promises made by it's proponents, all of whom have left the stage as in the shortish term will those who propelled us to it at the ballot box, or take a step back and ask whether we are setting course to our benefit.

As a patriotic Briton, proud of my country, it's beyond me how any leaver can possibly put themselves in the same bracket.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 12:09
  #4749 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post


My neighbour is a county disaster planner and Brexit has taken over his life. He said of only we had left back in 2016 and moved on from there. He would also agree that the majority thought as Farage said back at the time, we were out the day after the vote.

May maybe incompetent but Cameron is the one who caused this fiasco and then jumped ship despite saying he would stay.
Not sure where to start with this. Should we take your neighbour's existential crisis as a sign we're all doomed, or is the lesson that had we cut ourselves off the day after the referendum we'd all be eating grass now, which is after all, what the past two years of fraught negotiations have been largely concerned with avoiding? Or supplementary observation, stupid people taken in by snake oil salesman & serial liar Farage shouldn't be enfranchised?

Hard to see the thrust of your points On politicians, to address the final point, I think you'll find the big beasts of Brexit, Gove, Johnson & Stewart have all either resigned, kept their heads down or as in Gove's case, buried themselves in their brief at DEFRA, undoubtedly to position himself for May's departure. Enough, I think will not forget who approved those lying ads, transfers of moneys to other campaigns acting in concert & the involving Cambridge Analytica & others.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 12:48
  #4750 (permalink)  
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[QUOTE=Parapunter;10391685]

So it boils down to this. Protect the outcome of a flawed exercise in democracy that was almost [bit like almost unique] certainly interfered with by foreign powers whether Brexiters accept it or not, that was won by a technically laughable [but democratic] margin and that will clearly [supposition though I won't say you are wrong] damage the country to a huge extent for years [arguably and unprovable at this time] to come, entirely contrary to the promises made by it's proponents, all of whom [such as?]have left the stage as in the shortish term will those [Cameron and Osborne - come back? You jest] who propelled us to it at the ballot box, or take a step back and ask whether we are setting course to our benefit.

As a patriotic Briton, proud of my country, it's beyond me how any leaver can possibly put themselves in the same bracket.

Not sure point either but you do your argument no good by asserting possibilities as clear, self-evident facts.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 13:02
  #4751 (permalink)  
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By far the best thing now that could happen for Britain and Europe, would be for the ERG to steal a march on Corbyn and settle on no deal at all. By that of course, I mea that Britain doesn’t leave the EU, Article 50 is repealed, the £39 billion doesn’t get paid, and you all merrily whizz on as you were before.
This will totallly blind side Labour, destroy Corbyn, who is an arch exited and bring credit upon the ERG.
Britain will then be placed in a unique position to sabotage the EU at every turn especially after the Remainer Tory MPs have bee deselected, the Conservatives having won a snap general election.
Britain will be able to link its every EU action and contribution to a requirement for reform, especially as its economy grows and those of France and Germany fall.
They’re won’t, as one example of leverage, be an EU army because the British refuse to participate until the Gibraltar issue is finally settled.
Endless fun and games and the Remainers will have to go away and smoke their feet and it willl have been rage Rees Mog gang that gave it to them good!
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 13:22
  #4752 (permalink)  
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Now I live 4,000 miles to the left of all this nonsense (with my own lunatic "man who would be king" to deal with) I try very hard to understand this whole farrago. I have lifelong friends in the UK on both sides of the argument, and some of them are even able to have sensible discourse with each other on the probable or possible outcomes. From the outside (but understanding how UK politics work) it appears that a policy of procrastination and delay has been adopted by Theresa May, coupled with that well known and effective strategy of "well let's see what happens shall we...". However negligent this all may be, the extremist agitation from both sides is certainly preventing any salient facts being presented (if there are any) and forcing a very un-British approach of "NO COMPROMISE - DEATH TO THE UNBELIEVERS!"

It's disappointing that people can't or won't see when they are being manipulated en masse, and it's even more disappointing that there isn't a solid plan to take control of the UK's destiny, rather than this rudderless Chinese parliament approach currently in place. I hope it all works out, I still travel "home" frequently; but maybe it's time for a bit more Winston Churchill and less Neville Chamberlain - and that applies to both sides of the argument.

Last edited by Two's in; 16th Feb 2019 at 15:07.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 13:26
  #4753 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cavortingcheetah View Post
By far the best thing now that could happen for Britain and Europe, would be for the ERG to steal a march on Corbyn and settle on no deal at all. By that of course, I mea that Britain doesn’t leave the EU, Article 50 is repealed, the £39 billion doesn’t get paid, and you all merrily whizz on as you were before.
This will totallly blind side Labour, destroy Corbyn, who is an arch exited and bring credit upon the ERG.
Britain will then be placed in a unique position to sabotage the EU at every turn especially after the Remainer Tory MPs have bee deselected, the Conservatives having won a snap general election.
Britain will be able to link its every EU action and contribution to a requirement for reform, especially as its economy grows and those of France and Germany fall.
They’re won’t, as one example of leverage, be an EU army because the British refuse to participate until the Gibraltar issue is finally settled.
Endless fun and games and the Remainers will have to go away and smoke their feet and it willl have been rage Rees Mog gang that gave it to them good!
Inbelievable...I have to ask.... are you currently employed in a job that relies on a healthy U.K. economy?
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 14:09
  #4754 (permalink)  
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Certainly not.

The destruction to democracy intended by the remainers has been apparent since the day after the 2016 referendum. Similarly,the viciousness of the UK’s Marxist opposition has been obvious for some time now.
Time to make a plan to diversify from a wonky battleship.
By the same token, it’s been obvious for a while that Britain is the only EU power with the clout to actually destroy the dictatorial monstrosity that now manifests itself in the evil European empire. But it has been equally apparent that, in order to achieve that objective, Britain would have to insidiously insert itself into the fleshy underbelly of the beast and work it’s destructive charms from within. This, thanks to a clever long game on the part of the ERG, it can now do.

Two years orgaizational time since the referendum has been long enough for many to diversify from both Europe and Britain. The plan has been a very long game but the destruction of the EU economy is now almost certain, welcome news in many trade halls. The probable short term loss of some of Britain’s economy is to be regretted but it will be short in duration.
If only in international trading terms let alone because of in its dictatorial government, the emasculating of the hated European Union, at the expense if a bloody nose to The United Kingdom will have been worth the penalty, in the eyes of some but not all, of course.

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Old 16th Feb 2019, 15:17
  #4755 (permalink)  
 
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Just unbelievable!
That someone could be so obsessed by their irrational hatred for the EU that they are blind or careless (or both) to the long-term damage they have caused to the UK.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 15:30
  #4756 (permalink)  
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I have done nothing other than provide an idea for the possible bloodless destruction of an empire controlled by a few men of of almost unbelievable and virtually unelected power. This controlling conglomerate is one that some deem antithetical to democratic government and thus deserving of overthrow.
res Ipsa loquitur.


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Old 16th Feb 2019, 15:31
  #4757 (permalink)  
 
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It's the EU that will get the bloody nose, the UK will get two broken legs.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 15:52
  #4758 (permalink)  
 
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Sallyann1234
Just returned from a long trip through the Far East (Japan, Korea, China, Taiwan, Singapore, India) and the view I received from companies , individuals, government ministers was generally what the "F...K is the UK doing". More worryingly for UK based companies there was a fair bit of muttering of getting even with old colonial power, so I do not believe there will be a greeting with open arms post Brexit, if it happens. Indeed a Chinese trader I was talking to mentioned the "British opium wars" and an Indian the "Salt tax" all of which pre dates 1900, which I think is playing a very long game. I did point out that France and Germany were also colonial powers, and was politely told that they made things that they wanted, and were of superior quality.
My own company is no longer UK based, so we are not that exposed to what happens here, but as a citizen it is worrying to see people who appear intent on setting of to give the UK its own personalised recession, when businesses and their employees have just spent the time since 2008 digging themselves out of one recession, to have the extreme right of the Tory party grant them another one ! I used to be a Conservative supporter although on the left of that party but no more after this.
Regards
Mr Mac
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 16:37
  #4759 (permalink)  
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All of the above being inimitably true, it is thus high time that the UK cancellled Breixt, saved the moolah, confounded Corby and resumed her place at the top table with a self given brief to become the #1 European power instead of the little bit of a lackey to the Franco/German/Luxembiurg led triumvirate that she always has been so far.
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Old 16th Feb 2019, 16:58
  #4760 (permalink)  
 
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Fantastic idea, but look at many of our MEPs - UKIP and anti-EU. Many can't be arsed to turn up even.
Could they even muster a united front - I certainly doubt it?

As the polls still represent May 2016, little has changed in the opinion of the general wide public - man the lifeboats.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...ere-the-polls/
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