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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 24th Jan 2019, 19:36
  #3381 (permalink)  
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Not even a man with a private jet and a brace of crocodile suitcases would move to Britain right now. The place might be the fifth largest economy in the world (Hark the Herald Angels, not Angles said the lusty old medieval king) but it is highly taxed for the limited advantages provided by the state. It has the highest death rate from cancer of any country in the world, relative to its economy. The taxation of anyone earning more than £80,000, is promised to rise to at least 68% top marginal under a McDonnell government. That's the reason there's no inflow of capital to the country. Brexit is taking its toll on investor confidence but it is by no means the only off putting factor in international finance vis à vis Britain. The Bresiteers might have fuddled and lied but the Remainers still cheat and slide.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 19:45
  #3382 (permalink)  
 
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All of that is completely delusional, The place is awash with foreign money, McDonnel isn't chancellor & we are far from the highest tax burden. You & your pals though did vote to burn the place down, so make your peace with it.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 20:05
  #3383 (permalink)  
 
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Airbus - UK

Long and hard earned Airbus working establishments and expertise (along with high tech factories), a workforce borne of long experience, and a very robust support infrastructure. Can these realistically be regarded as transferable to those suggested as being able to take on the task? I think that's highly unrealistic - as was generally accepted in the lead-up to the referendum. To achieve a transfer to other agencies would take years - by which time the loss of orders could be crippling.

All which was discussed in the lead up to the referendum. And rightly disregarded.





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Old 24th Jan 2019, 20:20
  #3384 (permalink)  
 
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I am quite sure in an ideal world Airbus would like to keep things as is..but contrary to some popular beliefs some Europeans are capable of decent engineering...and certainly word on the street for a while in a certain Southern French city has been that the Airbus plant in Seville which has ”long experience and robust infrastructure”, could be in line for wing construction should there be serious issues due to Brexit..

Feel free to claim “Project Fear” and that “no one can build wings like the English”...




Last edited by wiggy; 24th Jan 2019 at 20:30.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 20:45
  #3385 (permalink)  
 
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wiggy

Re Airbus

I posted you a PM with my views. But in reality, it is of no consequence as to the capability of others. The time to put things into effect would cripple Airbus.

Last edited by jindabyne; 24th Jan 2019 at 21:04.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 20:56
  #3386 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by cavortingcheetah View Post
It has the highest death rate from cancer of any country in the world, relative to its economy.
WTF does that mean ?

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Old 24th Jan 2019, 21:09
  #3387 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post
Rotten fish?





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grilled today
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 21:29
  #3388 (permalink)  
 
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Airbus is an interesting case study regards Brexit.

It operates a highly decentralised model, as does Boeing these days - and I'd expect they'd be cautious to throw too many eggs in any one basket, be it French, German or Spanish, for a whole variety of reasons
When pushed the Execs were keen to point to any "future investment decisions" - the implication I took from that being no intent to transfer out the construction of current wingsets - the costs and disruption would simply be exhorbitant you'd imagine
Yes it's a strategic employer in the UK, but it's also a very European project that relies heavily on state handouts, either directly or indirectly, so undoubtedly they are coming under presssure to make all the right noises from all sides
Mr Enders is on his way out, so has the latitude to be a bit more bullish right now, but it'd be a brave future CEO that signed off any such move
I'm not dismissing the words of Mr Enders or his cohorts, but there's obviously an agenda here that goes far beyond any customs faffing in the event of a no deal Brexit...

Whilst the Maybot, and everybody else, are using todays well timed announcements to pile the pressure on to prevent a no deal, I think the atmoshphere would change dramatically if Airbus really meant what they were saying!
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 21:34
  #3389 (permalink)  
 
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I don't think Airbus or anyone else has suggested that the UK plants could or would be shut down overnight.
But if the post-Brexit costs and logistics became difficult it wouldn't be unreasonable for Airbus to start production of perhaps a new wing variant in an EU plant to prepare for a phased removal of the existing work.

​​​​
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 21:44
  #3390 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
I don't think Airbus or anyone else has suggested that the UK plants could or would be shut down overnight.
But if the post-Brexit costs and logistics became difficult it wouldn't be unreasonable for Airbus to start production of perhaps a new wing variant in an EU plant to prepare for a phased removal of the existing work.

​​​​
correct Sallyann, it's a strategically timed "threat", absolutely meant to ratchet up the pressure and help prevent a no deal scenario, which let's face it none of the current players want to happen
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 21:56
  #3391 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
That is of course if he is guilty, even though I cannot abide the guy, however one in a way feels for him ( and the victim / victims of course ) as such a high profile figure even if found not guilty, this will follow him around like a bad smell for the rest of his life.
Maybe I read too much into things but I picked up on Salmond's choice of words about no evidence of "criminality". So he chose not to use wrongdoing, or impropriety or inappropriate behaviour.. I reckon he'll plead not guilty to the worst, criminal, offences and hope he gets off with a couple of lesser "misdemeanour" type offences.

Politically, he's always had way too much swagger, and you can imagine he's got very few friends left, so personally he's in for a difficult ride however it turns out.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 21:58
  #3392 (permalink)  
 
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Smoke and mirrors, one wonders how much political pressure is being exerted on the likes of Airbus to announce these fears, whatever the case, it's no five minute wonder to set up a replacement facility, and that will never take place before the exit, similar is the reluctance of the EU to extend article 50, that I can understand, say you won't in effect puts the frighteners on the no hard Brexit brigade and try's to force them towards Mays deal.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:00
  #3393 (permalink)  
 
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Katherine Bennett (Airbus Senior UK VP) did admit under questioning that they had been briefed by the UK Government on what to say, not that she doesn't agree with the statement. Barnier was adamant that if UK left without a deal, there would not be a hard NI Border. So why is the backstop so essential to the deal? The negotiations are coming to the crunch, and you would be brave to bet your full stake on the outcome. Who will blink first ? (Although, based on the negotiating skills so far, I wouldn't bet on it being the EU).
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:06
  #3394 (permalink)  
 
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The more I watch this farce played out the more I think a hard Brexit is the way to go, one it puts the EU on the back foot and forces them to the table to renegotiate, and two it brings closure for industry and gives them a definite cut off point as opposed to the long drawn out farce we have at the moment.

No wonder the EU is trying to avoid the extension and force the issue. And the take the Hard Brexit off the table brigade are playing into their hands
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:12
  #3395 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Fitter2 View Post
Katherine Bennett (Airbus Senior UK VP) did admit under questioning that they had been briefed by the UK Government on what to say, not that she doesn't agree with the statement. Barnier was adamant that if UK left without a deal, there would not be a hard NI Border. So why is the backstop so essential to the deal? The negotiations are coming to the crunch, and you would be brave to bet your full stake on the outcome. Who will blink first ? (Although, based on the negotiating skills so far, I wouldn't bet on it being the EU).
To think, if only the Maybot hadn't made that disastrous call for a snap GE she'd probably be home and dry by now, backstop or not. One of the biggest errors of political judgement in recent times - right up there with her predecessors decision to hold an EU referendum

Personally, I actually find it enlightening to see the frailties of our political elite so exposed. On the one hand she knows she's got to deliver a brexit (of some form) or she'll be branded the most incompetent PM ever. On the other hand she knows nearly half the country don't want it! And she's got no way of forcing through whatever she wants, so is beholden to others and their conflicting interests. About the only thing in her favour is that JC is the leader of the Opposition!
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:27
  #3396 (permalink)  
 
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Without a doubt we currently have the worst PM and the worst Leader of the Opposition in my lifetime.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:30
  #3397 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
The more I watch this farce played out the more I think a hard Brexit is the way to go, one it puts the EU on the back foot and forces them to the table to renegotiate, and two it brings closure for industry and gives them a definite cut off point as opposed to the long drawn out farce we have at the moment.

No wonder the EU is trying to avoid the extension and force the issue. And the take the Hard Brexit off the table brigade are playing into their hands
In the last week 2 manufacturing places have announced closure in areas where there is not a hell of a lot of other industries (Suffolk and Cornwall) and message elsewhere is nobody making crucial investment decisions because the stuff that happened in 2018 was decided in 2016 and 2017. This means that Industry has basically sat on its hands awaiting for some certainty and has for over a year. Crucial point is that little if any Investment will occur this year as business will wait to see what happens for 6 months or longer.

What I see intersting is Tesco in their own label products have been introducing way more products than a normal year. One arguement is that it is to counter the Lidl / Aldi's but another more nuanced one is they see a recession just like in 2008. Their clubcard pretty much plots what 20% of UK population is doing in shopping, Mrs X has been spending £125 a week for last 5 years on combination of products, now she is spending £105 and switching from Premium Own Label to Basics range. Multiply that through UK and you see a trend quicker than anybody else. In saw similar in 2007/2008 before the wheels came off everywhere.

A hard exit will be quickly followed by a recession in 2nd half of year.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:39
  #3398 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
Without a doubt we currently have the worst PM and the worst Leader of the Opposition in my lifetime.
Nope, Call me Dave was even worse. At a dinner year or so ago in London where a "Lord" and former captain of industry spoke, his wittering assessment of Cameron was a shock to many people. Inept, incompetent and way out of his depth were some of the choice words, then saying he had driven he country over a cliff and ran away like a weasel with his tail between his legs. Bearing in mind said Lord is a lifelong Tory and a known donor it was an interesting after dinner speech.

In terms of Leaders of the Opposition I think Michael Foot, Michael Howard, Billy boy Hague and Ian Duncan Smith were worse than Corbyn. Corbyn has some principles and has never given up on them, irrespective of people's personal opinion of them or him. Media hate people with principles.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:44
  #3399 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by jindabyne View Post
Airbus - UK

Long and hard earned Airbus working establishments and expertise (along with high tech factories), a workforce borne of long experience, and a very robust support infrastructure. Can these realistically be regarded as transferable to those suggested as being able to take on the task? I think that's highly unrealistic - as was generally accepted in the lead-up to the referendum. To achieve a transfer to other agencies would take years - by which time the loss of orders could be crippling.

All which was discussed in the lead up to the referendum. And rightly disregarded.
Nope it wouldn't take as long as you believe.

Just stop investing in UK for future wings and open one up elsewhere close to where they already are. Still produce wings for existing models but nothing for newer versions. I would see it 10 years maximum but by 3 people would already know that new investments is not going to happen.
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Old 24th Jan 2019, 22:59
  #3400 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by racedo View Post
In terms of Leaders of the Opposition I think Michael Foot, Michael Howard, Billy boy Hague and Ian Duncan Smith were worse than Corbyn. Corbyn has some principles and has never given up on them, irrespective of people's personal opinion of them or him. Media hate people with principles.
Principles or not, as "leader of the opposition" Corbyn has been completely useless, as he as done exactly no "leading" and exactly no "opposition". Indeed worse than useless, as he has done quite a lot of supporting the government it's his job to oppose.
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