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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

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UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:02
  #2901 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ATNotts View Post

I doubt there is enough chilled warehousing in the UK to enable the retail giants like Tesco to store adequate products, in a salable condition for long enough.
You can have all the warehousing in the world, makes no difference if you can't get the stock in & out in time. In my illustrious career, I have run fruit & veg operations for supermarkets, distributing produce on an industrial scale. Nearly all of them run a system called line picking, whereby the traditional method of receiving goods, putting them away in racking then dropping them down to floor level for picking & despatch is inverted.

Instead, what they do is pick those goods into store orders directly from the receiving dock, cutting out the putaway element altogether. This may sound trivial to you but what it does is cut out about 12 hours of storage between receipt & despatch and when you're dealing with fast perishables in the 5-6000 pallet range per day, that is a significant cost saving & shelf life gain. Hold even a few of those inbound trucks up & you effectively destroy a system that works on a strict 24 hour rotation. Then you don't have much in store beyond long life Brassicas, spuds, garlics and so on.

It's bad for the consumer, worse for the supplier, haulier & retailer. In the end, we depend on these supply chains. We work for them, we benefit from their efficiency, we are proposing to erect barriers to impede them. It is madness by any rational analysis.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:05
  #2902 (permalink)  
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If the Government is scared of food shortages.

If the problem is logistics.

If the problem is a queue of trucks at Calais.

The solution would appear to be obvious; wave them through. They already go through checks for illegal immigrants etc. What is so different?

Furthermore checks do not have to be at the port.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:09
  #2903 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post
If the Government is scared of food shortages.

If the problem is logistics.

If the problem is a queue of trucks at Calais.

The solution would appear to be obvious; wave them through. They already go through checks for illegal immigrants etc. What is so different?

Furthermore checks do not have to be at the port.

God I love the irony. We want control of our borders. Translation: Make sure they’re wide open so anything everything and everyone can get in without a single check
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:11
  #2904 (permalink)  
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Personally I see two possibilities: a no deal or a delay.

I see a hard no deal as purely a political construct. A hard Brexit must be enforced; without enforcement we would have a soft exit. A delay would have the same issue just kicking the can down the road.

I think most likely, by a small margin, is a soft exit with things tacitly allowed to drift much as has happened for 2.5 years.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:11
  #2905 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Pontius Navigator View Post
If the Government is scared of food shortages.

If the problem is logistics.

If the problem is a queue of trucks at Calais.

The solution would appear to be obvious; wave them through. They already go through checks for illegal immigrants etc. What is so different?

Furthermore checks do not have to be at the port.
You propose this on a 48 hour cycle. It's pointed out to you why it's a non starter, then you come back & propose it again ad infinitum. At some point, you are going to have to put a toe in the shallow end of the real world & accept that it's just not as warm as you hoped.

It's a decent illustration of Brexiteer logic you see everywhere. Vague ideas incapable of working in practice, punted over & over again until they gain currency with people credulous enough to accept anything said to them.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:24
  #2906 (permalink)  
 
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The only reason there’d be queues of trucks for Gendarmes to walk around is if some European politician chose to make it so. Unless you’re suggesting we would be refusing to let our food supplies in.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:27
  #2907 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Parapunter View Post
Art 50 is extendible. By the way, if you believe the EU when they say they won't renegotiate, then please ask the Brextremists on here how like Oor Wullie & Cheetah where that leaves their argument that no deal either forces them back to the table because they need us etc etc.




Maaate. Have you seen the demographic you're talking about?
Don't tell me, it's all over social media too.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:29
  #2908 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShotOne View Post
The only reason there’d be queues of trucks for Gendarmes to walk around is if some European politician chose to make it so. Unless you’re suggesting we would be refusing to let our food supplies in.
An opposing view is fine. Staggering ignorance of how customs works between the European union & third countries isn't. Now go away, do some reading & then think about what you've written.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 09:49
  #2909 (permalink)  
 
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You can have all the warehousing in the world, makes no difference if you can't get the stock in & out in time.
So what happens with Grapes from South Africa, Bananas, Mango's, pineapples, passion fruit, Kiwis, pomegranates, avocadoes, all not from the EU and yet they manage
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:02
  #2910 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by NutLoose View Post
So what happens with Grapes from South Africa, Bananas, Mango's, pineapples, passion fruit, Kiwis, pomegranates, avocadoes, all not from the EU and yet they manage
Grapes mostly Airfreighted, not suitable for long term cold storage.
Bananas Imported unripe, stored in vast warehouses unripe, moved to ripening chambers & artificially ripened with ethylene gas to meet daily demand.
Passion fruit, Kiwis, Pineapples all grown in comparatively small numbers & airfreighted or moved by road from North African growers to Spain & hauled from there.

Why are you asking this? The vast majority of fresh produce is standard tomatoes, lettuce, onions & mainstream fruits. You've picked exotics to make what kind of point?
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:10
  #2911 (permalink)  
 
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EC : hell we are going to end up with piles of rotten fresh vegetables with nowhere for it to be sold and farmers going bankrupt all over. Due 20% plus tariffs and customs checks.....

UK how do you fancy dumping tariffs and customs checks on product groups xxxxc yyyyyyy etc. No mixed loads and travel ling through xxx and yyy entry/exit points.

UK: presume it's exactly reciprocal?

EC: well.... Fishing rights need to be maintained...

​​​​​​Lots of nonsense talked for a few days. Something agreed.

Deal done untill the summer season is over to be revisited on the 1st Nov. Next year... Sod it, it worked last year why bother changing.

Perishable loads of the agreed product classes get waved through. Spot checks carried out and if hauler gets caught with mixed loads they get there approval pulled and have to join the Q with the other product groups.

Parts get told to go via a different port and there is enough time enroute for the onboard customs team to clear paper work enroute. Through the x-ray at the other end and stowaway search prior to that and on the road just like now.

There are plenty of solutions to the problems which will surface very quickly once there is no return and the political posturing is finished with.

Once the politicians and media are removed from the process then it will develop and over a period become streamlined. After a year it will exit infancy after 5 it will be a settled mature system.

​​​
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:11
  #2912 (permalink)  
 
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The food will get through somehow. Some more than others, and some with a shorter sell by date. As stated above, where there is a demand to be met traders will find a way.

The issue is price. Supply and demand. Profits will be
required and made. It's going to hit the poorest - not that it seems to bother the Brexiteers. The Tory right won't care, and the Labour left will be glad of demonstrations on the street.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:25
  #2913 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
...The issue is price...
Spot on.

The observant will have noted how supermarkets raised food prices by 11% over the Christmas break. Not on exotic fruits from exotic locations, but canned soup and other staples.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:25
  #2914 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
​​​​​​Lots of nonsense talked for a few days. Something agreed.



​​​
'Something'. What exactly? What is the detailed, costed, agreed process that you, as a leaver, committing us to this future have put in place?

In no deal, you will see a pinch on supply no question. It cannot be any other way. However, Sally is right, Retailers are businesses, the market is substantial, there will be an uplift in airfeight. We produce about 25% of the produce we consume. 30% of the fruit we eat comes from Europe, the other 70% from the rest of the world. But 80% of vegetables come from Europe & particularly salad crops from Spain. If you up your RoW imports, then you can expect a pretty significant increase in cost as transport is priced in. If you voted leave, then in effect you have voted to make yourself and the other 48% of us poorer.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:32
  #2915 (permalink)  
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Meanwhile, in Germany, the Greens blame Corbyn and that is not without foundation.


eremy Corbyn has played a “damaging” role in Brexit negotiations and the Labour leader must take a huge part of the blame for the chaos that has ensued during exit negotiations with the EU, a German MEP has blasted.

Reinhard Bütikofer, the European Greens’ co-leader in the European Parliament, said Prime Minister Theresa May should not be the only leader held responsible for Britain’s “tragic” exit from the bloc.

During a furious tirade, he laid into Mr Corbyn for his “damaging, anti-European, narrow-minded role” in the “crisis”. Mr Bütikofer said the opposition leader’s stance was “petty nostalgic socialism” and “ridiculous”.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:42
  #2916 (permalink)  
 
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There can be no plan or price until it's set up and it won't be set up until it has to be setup because the lack of progress is being used as a weapon to try and prevent exit.

And you are correct about the amounts of imports involved. Which is a chunk of Spanish GDP and one that there is no alternative market for. Same with Greece and Portugal. Add in the piss heads on holiday and you have a reasonable sized chunk of a nations capital and serviced debt riding on access to the UK market for product. And people having free travel rights to those countries.

All of those countries are in borderline crisis with there banking system with very little room for a huge dump of bad debt landing in the space of 6 months.

Once this phase is over with the posturing and bluffing with no return then hard economics will take over and reasonable practical arrangements will come forward. If they don't they are looking at 3-4 countries banks failing all at the same time.

Which is why an extension is pointless to me it's just prolonging the pain and delaying the cure.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:44
  #2917 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
There can be no plan or price until it's set up and it won't be set up until it has to be setup because the lack of progress is being used as a weapon to try and prevent exit.
.
Oh do pipe down.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:47
  #2918 (permalink)  
 
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I might add I do hope that poor lady has had her C section and something has been done so she doesn't have to go to the house today.

In my mind the fact she had to vote in person in a wheelchair putting her and her child's life at risk is xxxxing disgusting.

My views aside on stay leave it shows how perverse the politics of this whole thing has got.
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:49
  #2919 (permalink)  
 
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:-) pipedown about remain trying desperately to prevent the UK leaving? Using anything they can.

It's not my fault that most of there successful tatical plans have actually backfired and made it more likely a default exit occuring .
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Old 16th Jan 2019, 10:52
  #2920 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tescoapp View Post
:-) pipedown about remain trying desperately to prevent the UK leaving? Using anything they can.

It's not my fault that most of there successful tatical plans have actually backfired and made it more likely a default exit occuring .
It is your fault for making any old rubbish up on the hoof though & then posting it with head turning illiteracy.


Oh & if it's tactical plans you want to discuss, how did the ERG's attempt to oust the Prime minister in order to deliver a wet dream cliff edge Brexit go?
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