Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Social > Jet Blast
Reload this Page >

UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Jet Blast Topics that don't fit the other forums. Rules of Engagement apply.

UK Politics Hamsterwheel MkII

Old 4th Jan 2019, 15:12
  #2361 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,416
Originally Posted by Sprogget View Post
Tory membership = 125k.
Generally believed to be below 100k now - smaller than the Lib Dem membership.
Gertrude the Wombat is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:06
  #2362 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,416
Originally Posted by KelvinD View Post
Had "representative democracy" been suspended for a few days?
Yes.

And many people, myself included, believe that this was a monumentally stupid cock-up, not least because we don't know how to do referenda and got almost all of it wrong.
Gertrude the Wombat is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:07
  #2363 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Lincoln
Age: 67
Posts: 454
I wonder how the EU leadership will deal with this and what effect it might have on the UK should it stay in/not quite out:

https://www.rt.com/news/448057-afd-g...eu-withdrawal/
Exrigger is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:12
  #2364 (permalink)  
I don't own this space under my name. I should have leased it while I still could
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Lincolnshire
Age: 76
Posts: 16,583
Originally Posted by Sprogget View Post
Extrapolation is a dangerous thing!
Very true unless the opinion poll supports your own view.
Pontius Navigator is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:24
  #2365 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Currently within the EU
Posts: 315
Originally Posted by Exrigger View Post
I wonder how the EU leadership will deal with this and what effect it might have on the UK should it stay in/not quite out:

https://www.rt.com/news/448057-afd-g...eu-withdrawal/
RT would of course like to see the EU break up. Russian money supported Brexit, and no doubt would be used to support Germany leaving as well.
Sallyann1234 is online now  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:34
  #2366 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Dreamland
Posts: 525
Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
Not me. I'd rather avoid the expense, work, hassle, faff, of another referendum and just revoke A50. Thereby saving me thousands of pounds and hundreds of hours' work.
Gertrude, this is not being done for your convenience
Harley Quinn is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:36
  #2367 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,416
Originally Posted by Harley Quinn View Post
Gertrude, this is not being done for your convenience
Thing is, it's not being done for anybody's convenience. So why are we doing it?
Gertrude the Wombat is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:39
  #2368 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Lincoln
Age: 67
Posts: 454
Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
RT would of course like to see the EU break up. Russian money supported Brexit, and no doubt would be used to support Germany leaving as well.
I could of posted numerous links from various sources, like this one: https://euobserver.com/tickers/143824 or any from several UK media sources, no doubt they would all have reasons why they would post that information, will still be interesting to see how the EU management deal with it, will they change.
Exrigger is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 16:49
  #2369 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: UK
Posts: 1,629
Originally Posted by Sallyann1234 View Post
RT would of course like to see the EU break up. Russian money supported Brexit, and no doubt would be used to support Germany leaving as well.
If the AfD could must more than about 14% support in national elections their rants might prove more worthy of attention. As it is they are a rather nasty now even more right wing party, who's support, for some reason is largely to be found in states like Sachsen, Sachsen Anhalt, and Thüringen, where there are comparatively few migrants, and where a lot of EU and German Federal Government money has been spent.

The parallels with those areas and the big Brexit voting areas are uncanny.
ATNotts is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 17:25
  #2370 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Lincoln
Age: 67
Posts: 454
One recurring theme within this thread and the original Brexit one is the debating methodology from some remain supporters who post a lot of verbiage and rhetoric, all of which is predominately personal opinion posted as fact, yet consistently require factual evidence from those who hold a different view to theirs, without being able to produce any to support their own opinions. It is almost as if in their minds remain must know what is best for everyone, ergo, their opinion is fact not to be questioned or refuted and that makes them the only intelligent posters, it would be funny if it was not so sad.

When they run out of sensible opinions, resort to the old faithful of going off on a tangent and also insulting the opposite side, not usually considered by most intelligent people as the cleverest strategy for debating a subject, usually resulting in alienating those they hope to bring on side and end up with them remaining on the losing side.
Exrigger is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 17:56
  #2371 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
Thing is, it's not being done for anybody's convenience. So why are we doing it?
Because it (EU membership) was the subject of a referendum in 2016, during which Remain fought a lazy campaign on the false assumption the majority of the UK populace were thick and would be swayed by the potential for irreparable damage to the UK if we left (aka project fear), and that nobody really gave a damn about whether we could squeeze in another few million migrants as long as the numbers indicated GDP would keep growing.

Thankfully, more people than anyone imagined rejected this lazy and self-serving narrative and opted to leave, in the full knowledge it would likely be an imperfect departure, but with confidence they were making the right choice for the right reasons, and with the added bonus that a Leave victory made many of the establishment decidedly uncomfortable.

Let me know if I can help with any further explanation Wombat
andrewn is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 17:56
  #2372 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
Age: 67
Posts: 58
Another recurring theme is the poor use of English by Leave supporters. I hadn't like to mention it before but the transposition of "too" with "to" , the use of "should of" and "your" to mean " you are" is rife. For people who are so keen on having sovereignty I would of ( see what I did there?) thought they might cherish there (sic) language more.
Effluent Man is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 18:13
  #2373 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
Age: 67
Posts: 58
Channel 4 News exposure of the boss of Seaborne Freight. It doesn't look good. Went into liquidation in 2013 owing one creditor $1million + as well as unpaid debt to HMRC. Grayling has apparently played another blinder.
Effluent Man is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 18:15
  #2374 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Lincoln
Age: 67
Posts: 454
Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
Another recurring theme is the poor use of English by Leave supporters. I hadn't like to mention it before but the transposition of "too" with "to" , the use of "should of" and "your" to mean " you are" is rife. For people who are so keen on having sovereignty I would of ( see what I did there?) thought they might cherish there (sic) language more.
Very funny and erudite, but it has already been recognised that I am thick and illiterate, also it does not change the context of what was written. here is some more for you to demonstrate your superior writing skills on and for the amusement of all:

Can we be provided with verifiable evidence, or facts if you will, rather than opinion on the following:

1. Without paying large sums for Irish passports, your UK passport will not allow you to move freely throughout Europe.
2. UK passport holders will no longer be able to work within European countries.
3. Europeans will not be allowed to work in the UK.
4. The booked cruise to Europe towards the end of this year, will UK passport holders not be able to get off the port in European countries.
5. There will actually be a shortage of medicine and food stuffs from April 1st this year.
6. Will airlines cease to fly into and out of Europe?
7. Will there actually be a large mass of lorries parked up on both sides of the channel from April 1st trying to come into and leave UK.
8. Will the NHS collapse because all the immigrant staff will all be leaving the UK.
9. Will we actually end up with treated chickens from the USA, instead of buying the ones we currently buy?
10. Will the Irish troubles really kick off post Brexit, or is this just being used as a convenient scapegoat to ride on for those who want to cause issue over there?
11. Will Labour undo the referendum result and not exit if you try hard enough to get them into power in time.

All these, and more, have been quoted as actual factual consequences of leaving the EU, the obvious unintelligent response will probably be to say yes the above as a fait accompli, or just fall back on the obvious retort and that is; prove it won’t, knowing full well that like them I cannot, but historically I think it won’t be as bad as painted, it is not as if the UK has not been through really bad economic times before and recovered and it is not as if things like trade, travel and employment won’t carry on, agree that there may, or may not, be a few hold ups/issues, but we get them now and they are nothing to do with Brexit, or still being in the EU and none will be insurmountable.
Exrigger is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 18:24
  #2375 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Cambridge, England, EU
Posts: 3,416
Originally Posted by andrewn View Post
Because it (EU membership) was the subject of a referendum in 2016
But, at the risk of sounding like a why-why-why toddler, why did we do that?

(Don't mind me, I've just been reading some (not very interesting) stuff on root cause analysis.)
Gertrude the Wombat is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 18:54
  #2376 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by Gertrude the Wombat View Post
But, at the risk of sounding like a why-why-why toddler, why did we do that?

(Don't mind me, I've just been reading some (not very interesting) stuff on root cause analysis.)
No problem Gerty as there is a really easy answer to that one, in that the Tories made it part of their 2015 GE winning manifesto!
andrewn is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 18:59
  #2377 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
Another recurring theme is the poor use of English by Leave supporters. I hadn't like to mention it before but the transposition of "too" with "to" , the use of "should of" and "your" to mean " you are" is rife. For people who are so keen on having sovereignty I would of ( see what I did there?) thought they might cherish there (sic) language more.
That's hilarious EM, and so true of course. And not wholly surprising given the estimated low IQ of the average Leave voter!

But thanks for highlighting this material issue to us all

(FYI - have a quick look at some of the spelling / grammar of some of your fellow Remainers in posts on this page - LOL)
andrewn is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 19:07
  #2378 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
Age: 67
Posts: 58
That really was my point exactly. I generally don't need to because most of the Remainers don't commit the kind of basic errors that the Leavers do. Beneath it there is a real difference in the level of understanding of the salient issues. It is those who don't use language well who are prone to being fooled by the punctuation of a slogan on the side of a bus.

It highlights the smart-alecery of those who seek to deceive for their own ends. Paradoxically it's this same philosophy that generated the alienation in those who voted to leave two and a half years ago. They are serially taken for mugs and they've just been taken again. Btw my jibe wasn't primarily aimed at you Exrigger, but, if you feel that the cap fits then feel free to sport it.
Effluent Man is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 19:50
  #2379 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: cheshire
Posts: 200
Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
Channel 4 News exposure of the boss of Seaborne Freight. It doesn't look good. Went into liquidation in 2013 owing one creditor $1million + as well as unpaid debt to HMRC. Grayling has apparently played another blinder.
But what about some of your high profile Remainer friends - let's examine their moral bankruptcy and financial ineptitude for a moment:

Lord Andrew Adonis - A true champagne Socialist that wants to create a new Growth Arc, in one of the most economically overheated areas of the UK, creating 1 million new homes and a new outer M25, causing untold environmental destruction in the process, whilst helping his friends like the Persimmon boss pocket a 75 MILLION annual bonus.

Gideon George Osborne - Former Chancellor of the Exchequer and architect of the utterly pointless Northern Powerhouse and the fabulous vanity project that is HS2, that again will cause massive environmental destruction, all so Gorgeous George and his banker mates can shave 20 mins off a journey back home to the sanctuary of the City

Any public monies being diverted, as no-deal Brexit contingency, into these ferry companies is inconsequential in comparison to the BILLIONS your Remainer mates are using to facilitate state sponsored corruption and gross misuse of public funds.
andrewn is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 20:19
  #2380 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Southwold
Age: 67
Posts: 58
FWIW I don't think that Ramsgategate (see what I did there!!) is actually intended to be anything more than a smoke and mirrors performance to say to the EU and the more lily livered MP's "Look at how far we are prepared to go". It is significant that we are ten days away from Theresa's much vaunted and delayed vote and a million or so spent on a display of "Who do you think you are kidding Mr.Juncker?" is probably judged as money well spent.

Actually on that line, this is turning out to be a half decent parody of Dad's Army. It's just un be f..ing lieveable that the people orchestrating it are masquerading as a semi serious government. You really couldn't make this stuff up.
Effluent Man is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us Archive Advertising Cookie Policy Privacy Statement Terms of Service

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.