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South Africa on the Brink?

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South Africa on the Brink?

Old 9th Aug 2017, 00:33
  #21 (permalink)  
 
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Perhaps as many lives as a cat...8/9.
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Old 2nd Nov 2017, 10:58
  #22 (permalink)  
bnt
 
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I don't know if you've been following the recent news, about two farmers who have been sentenced to 14 and 11 years in prison for mock-burying a thief who they caught red-handed, literally, with stolen copper wire. The local media are having the proverbial field day, rejoicing at the defeat of their "oppressors". An op-ed piece here. summarises the opposing point of view:

Listening to the politicians and the media one could be forgiven for thinking this judgement and the incarceration of these unfortunates was all the country needed to bury its problems. ‘This type of racism has been going on for far too long and it must be stopped,’ was the country-wide message and everyone chimed in with nary a dissenter. The fact that incidents of white on black violence are extremely rare while the reverse is rampant, did not enter the discussion; it would have spoiled the narrative the world loves to read.
All this in the context of some startling statistics. In a country of roughly 60 million people, less than four million pay tax and almost 90% of them are white. The tax base is shrinking as whites take fright and leave and their children are following in large numbers because they are racially discriminated against in the job-market.
Ironically, north of the Limpopo in Zimbabwe, the economic catastrophe that followed the ethnic cleansing of 4,000 white farmers by ‘liberation-war-veterans’ has a recent twist in the tale. Firebrand, ‘war-veteran’ leader Chris Mutsvangwa who played a pivotal and violent role in the purge has called for the return of those he helped force into exile. “We want them (Rhodesians) to be part of the next governance …. this country has been run on a scorched earth policy .. we want it to recover,” he was quoted as saying.
But tragically, it seems no change in attitude or reportage is in sight for South Africa. With the lying ‘mainstream media’ driving the conversation, the moral of the story is, no matter what the collateral damage might be, when all else fails, find a white man; preferably an Afrikaner, and even better, one or two with big beer bellies (Theo Bronkhorst of ‘Cecil the Lion’ infamy was another perfect target) and the pugnacious sheen of the hated ‘Boer’ and clap him in irons, arraign him, humiliate him and then throw him in the dungeons and suddenly, like a national narcotic, all seems swell again.
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Old 2nd Nov 2017, 15:05
  #23 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Metro man View Post
Any western leader with a result as marginal as that, 198 - 177 in his favour would feel compelled to resign as he should have an overwhelming majority.
"Any" western leader? This only applies to nations with a parliamentary form of government. In the US with a very different form of government, a small win is sufficient and indeed one can lose the "popular vote" and still be president.
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Old 18th Dec 2017, 18:38
  #24 (permalink)  
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So - Zuma is still President, but he's been replaced as ANC leader by Deputy President Cyril Ramaphosa. A name I recognise, even though I left ZA over 25 years ago and haven't been back since. For many years he was the head of the National Union of Mineworkers, but since the end of Apartheid he has become rather wealthy.

Ramaphosa was on the board of mining company Lonmin during Aug-Sep 2012 when nearly 50 striking miners were killed by police, 34 of them in one incident. The subsequent enquiry found that he had supported the company's refusal to negotiate with miners and argued for a hard line against them. Now that's what I call worker solidarity, eh?
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Old 20th Dec 2017, 00:24
  #25 (permalink)  
 
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Well we all know when it went downhill... as to be expected really, PC however reluctantly excuses me to elaborate, and I am not being racist, merely factual!
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Old 20th Dec 2017, 04:47
  #26 (permalink)  
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Agree - PC has a whole new meaning when it comes to Southern Africa.
 
Old 20th Dec 2017, 06:11
  #27 (permalink)  
 
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Ahhh... That African comment that I heard once: "I'm not a racist, I'm a realist"!!
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Old 20th Dec 2017, 06:37
  #28 (permalink)  
 
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Ahh, Africa.
Is it just a collection of mostly messed up, no possible decent future, countries ( 54 fully recognized sovereign states) (couple of exceptions) (only a couple) or a morass of a continent that will never raise itself out of the self-created swamp? (Worrying trend of Chinese neo-colonialism being welcomed, failing to see it's just Chinese expansion and access to cheap resources)


Things never seem to be learned. Progress is a fleeting concept. Personal enrichment is always the driving force.


"Ask not what you can do for your fellow people - ask what you can do for me and my tribe, or we will make you."


I see no end to that.
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Old 20th Dec 2017, 06:40
  #29 (permalink)  
 
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I see no end to that.
But then, there's Mma Ramotswe's delightful country just next door,
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Old 20th Dec 2017, 12:11
  #30 (permalink)  
 
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During my time in East and Central Africa I was frequantly told when govt changed that it was the new govts "time to feed". This invaribly required relations getting new posts and jobs. The concept of a greater good does not factor much in Africa IMHO. I always remember converstaions with my staff out there when they could not understand why I would pay tax for education for others when we had no children, or for medical care when we were not sick ! Have to say that SA does not feel much like central Africa, and Botswana / Namibia seem "Africa light" in my experiance as well.


Regards
Mr Mac
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Old 20th Dec 2017, 19:52
  #31 (permalink)  
 
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Africa will never be able to develop functioning states through their own efforts. Even when the occasional semi-decent leader emerges, it is impossible for them to eradicate the cancer of corruption in African societies because it is so deeply ingrained. Thomas Sankara tried in Burkina Faso - and was assassinated. Buhari is trying in Nigeria, but he is fighting the huge power of the throughly corrupt opposition parties and armed forces (particularly Air Force). The only solution I see for Africa is for the west to set up an international anti-corruption court where deposed leaders such as Mugabe, Goodluck Jonathan, Zuma, can be tried if ever they try to leave their home countries. If countries won't sign up to the court, then all foreign aid, IMF loans etc should be withheld.

Once African leaders know that they can never travel out of their home country if they plunder their country then they will start to reconsider their evil ways.
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Old 20th Dec 2017, 20:03
  #32 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Argonautical View Post
In the not too distant future, I can see a land grab looming. I wonder which country is going to offer a home to a couple of million Boers?
We could always make room for them in UK by sending the likes of David Lammy and Diane Abbot back to Africa.
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Old 21st Dec 2017, 06:44
  #33 (permalink)  
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Land Grab already happening

Land grabbing has been happening for years, unpublicised, practically illegal and usually by intimidation or murder.

So what's new? now it's in the manifesto, not that the ANC needs one.
Johannesburg – The ANC has resolved to amend the Constitution to achieve land expropriation without compensation.
https://www.fin24.com/Economy/anc-re...eform-20171220

As for Lammy and Abbot - they wouldn't last 5 minutes without security. Just soft, rich, targets to be stripped, robbed, shot or worse for the contents of a wallet or fancy clothes. Anyone up for a bus tour?, thought not.

(With concern for my relatives who still live in the "Killing Fields")

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Old 21st Dec 2017, 07:18
  #34 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Trim Stab View Post
We could always make room for them in UK by sending the likes of David Lammy and Diane Abbot back to Africa.
Both David Lammy and Diane Abbott were born in the UK and are British Politicians. Can you explain why you would want to send them "back" to Africa?

On another thread you said that your blood was boiling because of racism. Is this any different?
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Old 21st Dec 2017, 07:28
  #35 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Toadstool View Post
Both David Lammy and Diane Abbott were born in the UK and are British Politicians. Can you explain why you would want to send them "back" to Africa?

On another thread you said that your blood was boiling because of racism. Is this any different?
I was being ironic...

The Zimbabwe farmers who had their land stolen by Zanu PF were also Zimbabwe citizens, and born in Zimbabwe. The Ugandan Asians who were expelled from Uganda were also Ugandan citizens, born in Uganda. The South African EFF party are now also calling to confiscate land from white South Africans and expel them.

I am well aware Abbot and Lammy are British - am just pointing out that the policies in South Africa proposed by EFF are equivalent to us deciding to steal the houses of black people in UK and send them back to Africa...
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Old 26th Dec 2017, 10:38
  #36 (permalink)  
 
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The Zimbabwe farmers who had their land stolen by Zanu PF were also Zimbabwe citizens, and born in Zimbabwe
And many got mortgages from the Mugabe Government in the early eighties to buy their farms.

As a white African myself, I am now sadly of the opinion that there is no longer a long term future for whites in Africa.
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 20:06
  #37 (permalink)  
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Oh, so now Zuma gets the message? Totsiens ...
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 21:02
  #38 (permalink)  
 
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So Nelson's three supporters Thabo, Jacob and Cyril. Two have received their reward and the third will.

I do so hope that Cyril Ramaphosa will honour his mentor's morals.
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 22:08
  #39 (permalink)  
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Cyril started off as a troublesome shop floor steward in COSATU. He was radical, clever and poor. Now he is, very quietly, one of the richest men in the country.
He's already had his rewards and has long since shed the mantle that might have fallen from Madiba's shoulders. That cloak of invisibility is pretty shredded anyway because the old man was a rather useless president and didn't deserve his appalling wife who was a great deal cleverer that the Abbott woman and who did live in Africa.
What Mandela did though was to transition the country through a stormy period of potential civil war, the catalyst for which was significantly colour coded. It remains to be seen whether Ramaphosa will add yet more black vehicles to the convoy in which he has himself driven at great speed as he sashays from his home in Saxonwold to wherever his self importance takes him. That convoy extension might depend on the foreign aid the Brits give South Africa. Perhaps Ramo will take delivery of a garage full of those new Rolls Royce 4x4s, thereby further endorsing the corruption that afflicts all black countries on that continent but which will provide jobs at Rolls Royce and a boost for Britain's export trade figures. That is, of course, if the EU will permit trade in the future between Britain and a Commonwealth country.
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Old 14th Feb 2018, 22:42
  #40 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Argonautical View Post
And many got mortgages from the Mugabe Government in the early eighties to buy their farms.

As a white African myself, I am now sadly of the opinion that there is no longer a long term future for whites in Africa.
To coin a phrase, “none dare call it racism”.

GF
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