Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Social > Jet Blast
Reload this Page >

Just one thing

Jet Blast Topics that don't fit the other forums. Rules of Engagement apply.

Just one thing

Old 18th Oct 2016, 17:19
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 133
Just one thing

Here's a brain-bender!

Imagine a particle, massless and thus able to travel faster than light. As fast as it wishes, in fact!

This is a busy particle indeed. It travels all over the place, incessantly. Everywhere in the Universe.

And it's travelling so fast that it can be anywhere and everywhere...at once! Cor!

So you see, the Universe is just this one particle, travelling so widely and rapidly that it appears next to itself, over and over again. This gives the impression of lots of particles, i.e. the Universe as we perceive it.

Just the one particle, producing it all.

Let's hope it never stops for a rest. Then again, if it did, would we know?
John Marsh is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 17:33
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LPPT
Age: 55
Posts: 431
You're describing a "cathode-ray tube" like Universe.

Not very logical, because for it to be 'everywhere' it does need to change position and direction, very difficult to attain for a massless particle.
GearDown&Locked is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 17:46
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀
Posts: 1,960
Actually, going by Einsteins e=mc2, if mass = zero then e=0xc2. That makes e=0.
Hempy is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 17:48
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,287
So how (from this model) do you explain the properties of mass and energy that we *can* observe. How does this theory predict the mass of the electron, the mass of the proton and the speed of light?

There is nothing inherently impossible in the concept of a massless particle, and there are arguments which would suggest that it would be capable of infinite velocities without relativistic constraints. But just suggesting it isn't enough; you have to suggest how it explains current observations and how the model would predict specific observations that we could look for.

FWIW - particles with *negative* mass have been suggested as one explanation for gravity, although the theory doesn't have that much support.

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 18:00
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Newcastle/UK
Posts: 1,477
Plagiarist!
PPRuNe Forums - Search Results
tony draper is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 18:05
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,287
Of course there WAS the photon that checked into a hotel, and when the girl at the desk asked if it had any luggage it said "No - I'm travelling light"...

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 20:24
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: San Jose
Posts: 726
Then Man invented religion and the entire Universe came to a shuddering halt because suddenly there was Mass.
llondel is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 20:44
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Newcastle/UK
Posts: 1,477
Tiz begining to look like the entire universe and all that in there dwells is nowt but a illusion anyway, it has no objective reality and exists only inside the goo in our noggins.
All them Quantum physicists are wandering about with worried looks on their faces touching and feeling everything that seems solid.
tony draper is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 21:08
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 172
Originally Posted by tony draper View Post

But I only get this message below after I click on that link :-.

PPRuNe Message
Sorry - no matches. Please try some different terms.


Forum Jump

Nervous SLF is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 21:48
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Newcastle/UK
Posts: 1,477
Hmmm, strange it were on before,obviously the powers that be dont want you folks to learn the truth..
Anyway here is what I wrote thence,and damm the black helicopters.

Of course one's own theory is that there is only one photon in the entire universe,because there is no time when it is tootling about at c it can be everywhere and everywhen simultaneously,we however our senses being locked into this particular spacetime continuum of with its thermodynamic arrow of time experience photons as many individuals, this helps explain the wave particle duality problem.
The other thing is, the Universe is not really there you see.
tony draper is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 22:07
  #11 (permalink)  
Psychophysiological entity
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Tweet Rob_Benham Famous author. Well, slightly famous.
Age: 81
Posts: 4,916
A photon has zero rest mass but is born travelling at the speed of light. What I want to know is, how do you get it on the scales to weigh it?

There are certain things I think we shouldn't be told.
Loose rivets is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 22:36
  #12 (permalink)  
Resident insomniac
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: N54 58 34 W02 01 21
Age: 76
Posts: 1,863
Originally Posted by tony draper View Post
Tiz begining to look like the entire universe and all that in there dwells is nowt but a illusion anyway, it has no objective reality and exists only inside the goo in our noggins.
I have long held the belief that all life is but a reaction in a Petri dish.

All the (complex) interactions (and sensations/feelings) are programmed into a sort of 'game' (of Life).

It is difficult to disprove the idea that it is all a figment of someone's imagination.
G-CPTN is offline  
Old 18th Oct 2016, 23:07
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Melbourne Australia
Posts: 272
Following on...

If you accept the concept of infinity, how many retired controllers are on PPRuNe forums in the universe discussing this topic from an atoll in the mid Pacific?

MJG
In the office in Tarawa taking a break to check PPRuNe and then getting back to work.
mgahan is offline  
Old 19th Oct 2016, 01:29
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 172
Originally Posted by G-CPTN View Post
I have long held the belief that all life is but a reaction in a Petri dish.

All the (complex) interactions (and sensations/feelings) are programmed into a sort of 'game' (of Life).

It is difficult to disprove the idea that it is all a figment of someone's imagination.

Many many years ago in a Sci-Fi comic there was a story of a planet upon which lived someone who said their world
would end very soon.They were laughed at and no-one believed them until a worldwide flood destroyed everything.

The next picture showed a lab technician washing out a Petri dish with a bubble saying "Oh well that experiment failed
as I couldn't detect any life even microbes" or words to that effect.
Nervous SLF is offline  
Old 19th Oct 2016, 11:01
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LPPT
Age: 55
Posts: 431
The other thing is, the Universe is not really there you see.

So, so you think you can tell Heaven from Hell, blue skies from pain...


(how's that for plagiarism)
GearDown&Locked is offline  
Old 19th Oct 2016, 11:05
  #16 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: UK
Posts: 133
GD&L:
You're describing a "cathode-ray tube" like Universe.

Not very logical, because for it to be 'everywhere' it does need to change position and direction, very difficult to attain for a massless particle.
Hmmm... I hadn't thought of that. Maybe we need to allow ourselves some 'persistence of vision'? So that the minute 'blanks' caused by the particle's delay do not trouble us.

What if the particle has infinite speed? Delay would be infinitely small...

Hempy:
Actually, going by Einsteins e=mc2, if mass = zero then e=0xc2. That makes e=0.
Of course, this equation may be limited to our current perceptual creation of reality.

PDR1:
So how (from this model) do you explain the properties of mass and energy that we *can* observe. How does this theory predict the mass of the electron, the mass of the proton and the speed of light?
I'm not sure it has to predict the mass of the electron, etc. I think it's quite possible that we are the ultimate creators of mass, via our perception. In this, we create the apparent and experiential solidity of things from a vast Universe of energetic information. Some call it a hologram.

Acting thusly, our scientists would affect experiments which seem to show that electrons etc have mass.

Dr Draper: Bang to rights am I! Although I did get the idea from elsewhere: the singular Darryl Anka.

Source video.

Loose rivets:
There are certain things I think we shouldn't be told.
Absolutely right! How much can our minds assimilate, per day or per generation?
John Marsh is offline  
Old 19th Oct 2016, 11:34
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LPPT
Age: 55
Posts: 431
John Marsh,

You're not considering the fact that, much like the CRT scenario, that particle had to move to/be at anywhere based not only on massive amounts of energy but, more importantly, based on a matrix of precise and detailed information on where it has to be at any given time.

Otherwise the perceived Universe would be just white noise.
An intelligent particle (of the Creator)?
GearDown&Locked is offline  
Old 19th Oct 2016, 20:30
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: London
Age: 55
Posts: 435
Imagine a particle, massless and thus able to travel faster than light. As fast as it wishes, in fact!


OP Tell you what, you put the equations that prove a massless particle can travel faster than light and you will have a Nobel Prize in your hands.

These things come up on here a fair amount of time. Trouble is saying something is easy. Mathematically/Scientifically proving it is a completely different thing
ExRAFRadar is offline  
Old 20th Oct 2016, 10:58
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: London
Age: 55
Posts: 435
Relativistic equations show that the particle has momentum despite the fact it has no mass.

p=mv and that would indicate that if you have no mass you have no momentum

But things take a very different direction from that simple formula when you bring Relativity into play.

I am not trying to be a di*k about this but there is a reason no lesser a mind than Einstein grappled with the subject for years before coming to an understanding.

And a round of applause for Maxwell and Plank as well while I am here.
ExRAFRadar is offline  
Old 20th Oct 2016, 11:04
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,287
Originally Posted by Loose rivets View Post
A photon has zero rest mass but is born travelling at the speed of light. What I want to know is, how do you get it on the scales to weigh it?
Nepotsim

There are certain things I think we shouldn't be told.
You want the truth?

YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!

PDR
PDR1 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright 2021 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.