Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > PPRuNe Social > Jet Blast
Reload this Page >

US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

Jet Blast Topics that don't fit the other forums. Rules of Engagement apply.

US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

Old 4th Jan 2019, 22:28
  #17001 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: surfing, watching for sharks
Posts: 3,675
Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
Turbine, do you agree with the article you quoted?
Or do you disagree with it?
Or do you have no opinion on its accuracy.

We need to know.
Legitimate question given TD’s attempt to retreat from the last article he posted.
West Coast is online now  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 22:29
  #17002 (permalink)  
Below the Glidepath - not correcting
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: U.S.A.
Posts: 1,694
So King George III seems to be having a bit of a day.

Extending the trump Federal shutdown for "months or even years", declaring a National Emergency so he can build the wall (AKA his penis extension) without Congressional approval, and using the US military version of eminent domain (WTF?) as a method of obtaining private property for wall construction. True democracy in action, or senile dementia, I guess we decide which it is in 2020, unless Mueller has repatriated them all back to Dzerzhinsky square by then.

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...ks-fresh-talks

As a partial US government shutdown hit the two-week mark, Donald Trump told congressional leaders at the White House he was prepared for the standoff to last months or even years. “Absolutely I said that,” said Trump during a Rose Garden press conference, when asked if Senator Chuck Schumer was correct in his claim that the White House was prepared to continue the shutdown indefinitely. The president also upped the ante, threatening to declare a national emergency and build a border wall without congressional approval. “I can do it if I want,” he said. He also suggested what he called “the military version of eminent domain” as a method of obtaining private property for wall construction.
Two's in is offline  
Old 4th Jan 2019, 23:08
  #17003 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: surfing, watching for sharks
Posts: 3,675
https://www.yahoo.com/news/fearing-c...233021154.html


Democrats, quickly huddle and find reasons to oppose the deployment.
West Coast is online now  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 01:33
  #17004 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Florida
Posts: 5,363
Extending the trump Federal shutdown for "months or even years", declaring a National Emergency so he can build the wall (AKA his penis extension) without Congressional approval, and using the US military version of eminent domain (WTF?) as a method of obtaining private property for wall construction. True democracy in action, or senile dementia, I guess we decide which it is in 2020
Yes it could progress to that, but it can't wait to be resolved in 2020 as it will have already happened by then.

There is little that a divided congress can do to restrict his authority to act under emergency powers.

We the people seemingly have brought this on ourselves, by providing clashing powers to our form of government and then to stoke the fires by threats of our votes every two years against a 4 year term
lomapaseo is online now  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 04:49
  #17005 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: E.Wash State
Posts: 0
There is an upside to this divided government. Let Trump and Pelosi sling crap at each other, thus ensuring full employment for the media to continue their breathless manta of doom, gloom, and "breaking news". Meanwhile they leave the rest of us alone and have no time to think up ways to screw over the people.
obgraham is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 06:32
  #17006 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Germany
Age: 72
Posts: 1,561
The widening gyre ....

Rashida "Impeach the motherbleeper!" Tlaib is a graduate of the same low-ranked law school as Michael Cohen, convicted felon and former personal lawyer to Donald Trump. Can we guess where she picked up such bad language?

C'mon, Turbine D, nail your colors to the mast! The stuff you cited was reasonable, albeit opinion not fact. Think of Thoreau telling us that finding a trout in the milk is reasonable grounds for suspecting the dairyman. Anyway, who cites stuff they do not find believable? (The problem with the Donald is that he cites stuff that way that contradicts other stuff he also finds believable. Able to believe two contradictory things before breakfast, Trump? Absolutely!) You are being bullied into retreat in the name of being reasonable by two of the least reasonable figures presently posting.

I wonder why nobody has picked up on the Trump threat to close the southern border. He was going to do that without a wall, so what does he need a wall for? Needs a wall; can close the border without one ... there's Trump telling us, without meaning to, that he does not need a wall for border control.
chuks is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 07:53
  #17007 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: apogee
Age: 66
Posts: 59
Can we guess where she picked up such bad language?
Long before law school. Friends, the neighbourhood, family, media. Embedded enough to use it casually in front of her children. Do people even listen to themselves? To what they are actually saying?
Quite a vile swearword if you look hard at it. Also an indicator of lack of maturity and intelligence.

That said it is reported the prez swears like a longshoreman, to people, at people in his private meetings.
It is an indicator of intelligence not necessarily of where and how you grew up. And, she was playing to her base.
meadowrun is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 08:12
  #17008 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2015
Location: Farnham, Surrey
Posts: 1,284
Originally Posted by meadowrun View Post
"I did say shutdown could last for months or even years". Trump.

Sabotaging the running, disrupting the functioning of a country. That's got to be a crime of some sort.
Surely this is expected behaviour for someone who takes his instructions from a hostile foreign power - this is exactly what Putin bought when he invested in buying the presidency. The unpaid support of communist activists like WC and OB is just a free bonus.

PDR
PDR1 is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 13:30
  #17009 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: E.Wash State
Posts: 0
Originally Posted by PDR1 View Post
The unpaid support of communist activists like WC and OB is just a free bonus.

PDR
That just might be the post of the year, PDR!
obgraham is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 13:50
  #17010 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: apogee
Age: 66
Posts: 59
This Paul Whelan sideshow......
Why would it be normal to hold four citizenships and passports?
He has been visited by consular officials from all four countries.
meadowrun is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 15:02
  #17011 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Middle America
Age: 80
Posts: 1,158
Original post by obgraham:
Turbine, do you agree with the article you quoted?
Or do you disagree with it?
Or do you have no opinion on its accuracy.
We need to know.
Original Post by West Coast:
Legitimate question given TD’s attempt to retreat from the last article he posted.
Thanks for asking, a first from you both.

Yes, I fully agree with the WSJ article about how Trump out and out lied at his cabinet meeting. It is accurate, supported by data and history.

Now to you both, Do you agree with what Trump said? Do you disagree with the content of the WSJ article? Or do you have no opinion? If no opinion, why?
We need to know...
Turbine D is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 16:27
  #17012 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: E.Wash State
Posts: 0
Turbine:
Do you agree with what Trump said? Do you disagree with the content of the WSJ article? Or do you have no opinion? If no opinion, why?
We need to know...
By and large, on this one I have no opinion. I'm not required to -- you're the one who posted it. Because I didn't listen to what Trump said (I don't obsess about his every word), I don't have access to WSJ through their paywall these days, and I don't trust the media to accurately report anything Trump says.

However, I'll be clear: I do not agree with any commentary denigrating the sacrifices of other nations in places like Afghanistan and Iraq. Among others, UK and Canada have made great sacrifices there.

But once again, I'll judge Trump by his actions, not his words. You should try the same.
obgraham is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 16:54
  #17013 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Middle America
Age: 80
Posts: 1,158
ob,
By and large, on this one I have no opinion. I'm not required to -- you're the one who posted it. Because I didn't listen to what Trump said (I don't obsess about his every word), I don't have access to WSJ through their paywall these days, and I don't trust the media to accurately report anything Trump says.
About what I expected from you.

Would you say the transcripts of the cabinet meeting posted by the White House is not accurate? Perhaps fake news? That is where the WSJ information came from. You can see the transcript, the link is contained in the WSJ article, but I understand you are not interested in details or facts, they take time to read and mentally digest, time you don't have...
Turbine D is offline  
Old 5th Jan 2019, 18:43
  #17014 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: E.Wash State
Posts: 0
I think, Turbine, that I will not get my news from WH Transcripts, then excerpted by WSJ, then selectively quoted by Turbine. As I stated above, if Trump denigrated the sacrifices of allies in the Middle East, I do not agree with him.

In other news, he is withdrawing from Syria, and wants to withdraw from the rest of the sandbox too, and I support this goal. Apparently, however, here on JB that is a Commie position.
obgraham is offline  
Old 6th Jan 2019, 00:39
  #17015 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Middle America
Age: 80
Posts: 1,158
Original post by obgraham:
I think, Turbine, that I will not get my news from WH Transcripts, then excerpted by WSJ, then selectively quoted by Turbine.
Well, I think then your system of reasoning is clearly best described as "System 1", which is rapid, intuitive emotional and prone to bias, whereas "System 2" is more deliberate, more reflective, more dispassionate and more accurate.

Keep going ob, and your case, I can now completely support John Ehrenreich's article as to Why Conservatives Are More Susceptible To Believing Lies. This I can confirm although you never asked... You are one of the best examples of why his article goes beyond opinion and becomes factually true.

Last edited by Turbine D; 6th Jan 2019 at 00:41. Reason: word correction
Turbine D is offline  
Old 6th Jan 2019, 01:08
  #17016 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: E.Wash State
Posts: 0
I will confess, Turbine, that I have no idea what you are on about. But it seems to keep you happy.

I'm more concerned with jobs for people who need them, legal immigration and secure borders, and disentangling from international cons which harm America. Clearly your priorities are elsewhere.
obgraham is offline  
Old 6th Jan 2019, 06:38
  #17017 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: surfing, watching for sharks
Posts: 3,675
Originally Posted by Turbine D View Post
Well, I think then your system of reasoning is clearly best described as "System 1", which is rapid, intuitive emotional and prone to bias, whereas "System 2" is more deliberate, more reflective, more dispassionate and more accurate.

Keep going ob, and your case, I can now completely support John Ehrenreich's article as to Why Conservatives Are More Susceptible To Believing Lies. This I can confirm although you never asked... You are one of the best examples of why his article goes beyond opinion and becomes factually true.
Your tipping point to “factually true” is a back and forth discussion on an anonymous BB. Never mind you’re a combatant in that discussion, dismissed even by your own troops on its validity.

How say you other liberals, sufficient proof?



West Coast is online now  
Old 6th Jan 2019, 09:21
  #17018 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Germany
Age: 72
Posts: 1,561
Absolutely, Mr. Gallagher!

The study referred to the odd fact that conservatives, although often quite intelligent, often refuse to use their powers of cogitation because they fail to understand that they are operating not from logic but from gut feelings. The basic premise is that the liberal is more aware of his feelings so that he can discount the effect that has on the way he uses facts to form opinions. Not always, as a few real-life examples I cited show, but more often than the conservative.

Whether or not the premise is accurate enough to be useful, there it is as presented. How, WC, did you and your fellow Communist operative OB react? By whining about being called "stupid" is how! That's your prerogative, except that the study did not do that. In fact it did quite the opposite; the complaint is that you fail to use your intelligence. By reacting to an obvious "gut feeling" as you two did you bore out the very premise of the study you rejected ... on spurious grounds. If you had stated that, no, you are in touch with your feelings, then that would have been a valid response, one that refuted the premise. As it was, your response validated the premise, and you two do not seem to be able to see that, even.

Back to Trump: He is on record as stating that he goes by his gut. He has even stated many times that he does not need to learn about stuff because he already knows stuff from being "like, really, really smart."

Okaaaay. So ... really, really smart me (unlike the Donald I can show that in factual terms in various ways that we are not going to get into here) should not have had to do a month in ground school to learn how to fly one particular sort of "large aircraft" if the Donald's premise is correct. I should have been able to just sit myself down, have a quick look around, and know everything I needed to about a rather complicated machine. In reality that would have looked about like the Donald, this self-proclaimed master of technology, trying to put a simple telephone on loudspeaker ... and failing.

There is having a gut feeling that you are possessed of necessary knowledge because you are "like, really, really smart," and then there is the reality of needing to understand that even if you were as smart as all that, you still need to learn about complicated things the same way anyone else does. We can see the arrogance at work here that comes from a sort of wilful stupidity, either the stupidity of being, well, stupid (Trump), or the stupidity of refusing to settle down and learn what is going on before forming an opinion.

I have had to work with the stupid fairly often. It's not a problem when that is someone who knows their limitations. When it's someone who genuinely believes that they are either not stupid or not acting stupid, though ... that can be a serious problem. I had a guy who had to read us the Emergency Checklist for one gear not showing down, when he started at Item 2. When we got all the way through the checks I realized that something had gone wrong there. His lapidary response? I was the Captain, so I should have known that he had started with Item 2! Stupid mistake made under stress ... okay, sort of. Stupid response to seeing the mistake ... not okay.

It be like that with the Donald and his followers: Stupid mistake followed by stupid response, and so on and on. Here we are in a government shut-down of uncertain duration when Trump and his troupe of clowns are groping for some sort of logical basis for this. We need a wall that's not a wall or else yes it is a wall, one made of concrete, no, steel, no, concrete .... And meanwhile the little people who are going without pay are supposedly happy to be in this situation because they understand the importance of whatever it is that the Donald wants to see built. In the end, I think even a certain number of Republicans are going to tell him to naff off and get the money from Mexico as he often had promised to, and to end the shut-down in the meantime. (The scary thing is that he may see this shut-down as buying himself some time to evade these various investigations into his and his family's shenanigans, so that he has a perfectly sensible reason to see it continue and to expand.)

Last edited by chuks; 6th Jan 2019 at 15:54.
chuks is offline  
Old 6th Jan 2019, 14:00
  #17019 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Middle America
Age: 80
Posts: 1,158
Speaking of Stupid

Trump has often bragged about what a genius he is, an IQ above 150 and purported to be a member of Mensa, something the organization denies. Here is what a Mensa member has to say about Trump:

Candace Sommer-Van Auken, M.A. from U. of Pennsylvania (1980)
Answered Nov 15, 2018 · Author has 80 answers and 160.8k answer views

I have been a member of Mensa, but do understand that one only has to be in the top two percent of intelligence to join Mensa. So Mensans are very bright, but most would not be regarded as geniuses. I was also trained, in graduate school, to properly administer IQ tests, and my scoring was considered extremely accurate. After you give a certain number of those tests you can “eyeball” soneone’s intelligence fairly well.

My guess is that Trump would score above average in intelligence, but nowhere near high enough to be regarded as gifted. What makes it tough with Trump is that he is also (1.) a decidedly anti-intellectual person, (2.) an extremely intellectually insecure person, and (3.) someone who would score very high on a scale of psychopathy or sociopathy. He tends to bluster and “BS,” he’s extremely manipulative, and his “emotional IQ" (empathy, compassion, knowing how to work well with others) is *way* below average.

He seems to be highly resistant to new information, which is not true of most intellectually gifted people. (It is, however, a hallmark of an outlook that I think of as, "Stupid and Proud of It.") He seems to accept, uncritically, misinformation or conspiracy theories that fall in line with his deeply held prejudices, which is also not characteristic of really bright people, unless they are paranoid. He seems extremely unwilling to question, or even recognize, his prejudices, and one could argue that the hallmark of real intelligence is to be able to question such things.

Trump likes to brag that he graduated from an Ivy League business school, but he never got an MBA from the highly regarded Wharton graduate school, just an undergraduate degree. He's never offered to share his transcripts, and given his tendency toward braggadocio, I'm sure he would have if his grades were even marginally impressive.

Maybe he could squeak into Mensa, but it would be most likely that he'd do so by promising money to someone to take the test for him (and then he wouldn't bother to pay his rent-a-brain). Sad.
Most intelligence tests fail to capture real-world decision-making and our ability to interact well with others. This is, in other words, perhaps why “smart” people, do “dumb” things.

The ability to think critically, on the other hand, has been associated with wellness and longevity. Though often confused with intelligence, critical thinking is not intelligence. Critical thinking is a collection of cognitive skills that allow us to think rationally in a goal-orientated fashion, and a disposition to use those skills when appropriate.
Turbine D is offline  
Old 6th Jan 2019, 15:53
  #17020 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Germany
Age: 72
Posts: 1,561
What I want to see is a challenge to Trump from someone he has denounced as stupid, to take matching IQ tests. I understand that would be beneath Rex Tillerson's dignity, but, Rex, do it for our country! "Put up or shut up, Donald." Let some neutral party pick the testing body, and then let's see who is a "stable genius" or not.

An IQ test takes far less time than 18 holes of golf for a foursome, when Trump has found the time for many such rounds of golf. I do not understand why so many people have taken this stupid insult from this stupid man so tamely when the comeback is so obvious.

This is not being pointlessly cruel to those of limited intellect, people such as J. Danforth "Potatoe" Quayle or Eric "Lights on, Folks not Home" Trump. Neither of these two prominent dimbulbs has ever claimed geniushood nor denounced others for their stupidity, so that we should just leave them both festering happily in their limited states. Trump, on the other hand, deserves to be unmasked as the moron he is since he has repeatedly claimed to be "like, very, very smart." I fear that we have people even more stupid than Trump who now look at him and think, "So that is what it means to be a genius! Durn, but I am almost there. Maw, hold my beer, and hand me that Rubik's Cube!"
chuks is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell My Personal Information -

Copyright © 2018 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.