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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

Old 19th Aug 2018, 13:41
  #15421 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Location: Lakeside
Posts: 428
Originally Posted by tartare View Post
I remain somewhat puzzled.
A quick Google search of cost of security clearances USA shows the cost of a TOPSECRET clearance ranging from $3,000 to $15,000 depending on circumstances.
Now, even though there are roughly 5 million of your countrymen who have some kind of clearance, from SECRET upwards - and noting that there is at least a years wait or more in some cases because of the backlog - surely the total cost still amounts to a rounding error on the Federal budget?
Moreso, how many of those 5 million will have ex CIA Director/DNS level clearance?
Happy to be proved wrong if there is something I'm missing... but I just can't see how this `secret clearance rort, licence to print money at the Feds expense and a massive cost to John and Jane Doe taxpayer' argument holds water...
I don’t see an argument. To me the question is only “What is best practice for National benefit”? It is said the clearance should remain after retirement/termination to sustain “ institutional knowledge” in case a future need arises for consult with the holder.

So does “expertise” leak out the person’s ears if the clearance is removed? I say no, and if the individual has something to add at a later time, arrange a setting to accomodate that.

This clearance retention is ninety percent ego, ten percent gold mine.
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Old 19th Aug 2018, 14:04
  #15422 (permalink)  
 
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I'm starting to wonder whether the Democrats actually want to get rid of Trump. First we had the vote winning proposal to abolish ICE, then this week we had Andrew Cuomo claiming that 'America was never that great' (who was that supposed to appeal to?) and now Elizabeth Warren is proposing Nationalising the largest US Companies..

Where are candidates and ideas that are actually going to be able to beat Trump in the 2020 election? - the clock is ticking..
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Old 19th Aug 2018, 14:10
  #15423 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
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The Dissolution and Reconstitution of the FBI, An Act.....the

The Constitution of the United States says nowt regarding the Federal Bureau of Investigation.

Congress created the FBI. Congress can extinguish the FBI.

Know this: The Sovereign is the People, not Bob Mueller or Donald Trump.

Civics, specifically the Constitution, is not taught in our public schools. Why do you suppose that is?

If the People ever fully understood their power, and informed themselves of what is good, and fair, and beneficial to us all, there is not enough room in our prisons to hold the posers, thieves and deviates from DC.

An Act of Congress (the People). Imagine that.
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Old 19th Aug 2018, 15:52
  #15424 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by tartare View Post
I remain somewhat puzzled.
A quick Google search of cost of security clearances USA shows the cost of a TOPSECRET clearance ranging from $3,000 to $15,000 depending on circumstances.
Now, even though there are roughly 5 million of your countrymen who have some kind of clearance, from SECRET upwards - and noting that there is at least a years wait or more in some cases because of the backlog - surely the total cost still amounts to a rounding error on the Federal budget?
Moreso, how many of those 5 million will have ex CIA Director/DNS level clearance?
Happy to be proved wrong if there is something I'm missing... but I just can't see how this `secret clearance rort, licence to print money at the Feds expense and a massive cost to John and Jane Doe taxpayer' argument holds water...
Then remain puzzled Tatare, roughly two years ago, 60 folks, already in various lower level programs, confidential, etc., to the generic secret level averaged $5K, and that was just the Experion/local law authorites type, easy to do online. The levels we are talking about require visiting, personally interviewing relatives, friends, business acquaintances, travel, bank records and a lot, lot more.

For roughly 10 years prior the Govt., KOR resisted mightily the need to clear these 60 and other low level employees, that is not to denigrate them, simply to designate their access/proximity to “classified” information.
A point of clarification is that they had the same as every man and woman on the street does, everything is in plain sight and publicly available. In the end it wasn’t for the clearence per se, it was for post access, but that is a whole nother story .
Again, personal opinion, those that do genuinely require clearences because of their vocation, absolutely, although that doesn’t always mean anything.

Those with no direct involvement or need other than the Secret Squirrel handshake, why?

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Old 19th Aug 2018, 16:05
  #15425 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by fltlt View Post


Then remain puzzled Tatare, roughly two years ago, 60 folks, already in various lower level programs, confidential, etc., to the generic secret level averaged $5K, and that was just the Experion/local law authorites type, easy to do online. The levels we are talking about require visiting, personally interviewing relatives, friends, business acquaintances, travel, bank records and a lot, lot more.

For roughly 10 years prior the Govt., KOR resisted mightily the need to clear these 60 and other low level employees, that is not to denigrate them, simply to designate their access/proximity to “classified” information.
A point of clarification is that they had the same as every man and woman on the street does, everything is in plain sight and publicly available. In the end it wasn’t for the clearence per se, it was for post access, but that is a whole nother story .
Again, personal opinion, those that do genuinely require clearences because of their vocation, absolutely, although that doesn’t always mean anything.

Those with no direct involvement or need other than the Secret Squirrel handshake, why?

For those that care to Google:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.for...-billions/amp/


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Old 19th Aug 2018, 16:51
  #15426 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by BAengineer View Post
I'm starting to wonder whether the Democrats actually want to get rid of Trump. First we had the vote winning proposal to abolish ICE, then this week we had Andrew Cuomo claiming that 'America was never that great' (who was that supposed to appeal to?) and now Elizabeth Warren is proposing Nationalising the largest US Companies..

Where are candidates and ideas that are actually going to be able to beat Trump in the 2020 election? - the clock is ticking..
BA. There are presently two Democrat parties. The Progressive/Socialist wing, and the traditional wing. The far left want Trump on a platter. “We should avoid discussion of Impeachment” (Nancy Pelosi).

The Republicans still are United, their anthem: “whatever...”

Hillary is no longer the head of the party. She blew it, and there is no reason to believe she has any cred left. The actual and temporary leader of the Democrats is Robert Mueller. Without Mueller, Hillary would be indicted, and she likely would have taken the Party with her. So long as red meat can be offered the radicals on the Left, we have stasis. Without the cover of Mueller and the Media, the Democrats virtually disappear.

Before his “appointment” to Counsel, Mueller was a private citizen. As of now, he has outrageous power to suspend the Constitution, and provide a balance to the clamor for Hillary’s hide from the Right.

Mueller’s appointment was illegal. Special Counsel must be appointed by the Attorney General. Sessions in this case. Rosenstein is a deputy, and has no power to appoint.

Manafort is a demonstrable scumbag, but an innocent scumbag. Until conviction. Not violent, and charged with crimes that are antiquated and refused prosecution years ago.

But Mueller arrests him wth dozens of agents with guns drawn, and puts him in solitary confinement?

I will never forgive the FBI for WACO, and if you are not extremely troubled by the actions of the current Bureau, you should be.
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 08:07
  #15427 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
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Strzok Joins List of 25 Top FBI, DOJ Officials Who Have Been Recently Fired, Demoted, or Resigned

FBI Departures:
  1. James Comey, director (fired)
  2. Andrew McCabe, deputy director (fired)
  3. Peter Strzok, counterintelligence expert (fired)
  4. Lisa Page, attorney (demoted; resigned)
  5. James Rybicki, chief of staff (resigned)
  6. James Baker, general counsel (resigned)
  7. Mike Kortan, assistant director for public affairs (resigned)
  8. Josh Campbell, special assistant to James Comey (resigned)
  9. James Turgal, executive assistant director (resigned)
  10. Greg Bower, assistant director for office of congressional affairs (resigned)
  11. Michael Steinbach, executive assistant director (resigned)
  12. John Giacalone, executive assistant director (resigned)
DOJ Departures:
  1. Sally Yates, deputy attorney general (fired)
  2. Bruce Ohr, associate deputy attorney general (twice demoted)
  3. David Laufman, counterintelligence chief (resigned)
  4. Rachel Brand, deputy attorney general (resigned)
  5. Trisha Beth Anderson, office of legal counsel for FBI (demoted or reassigned*)
  6. John P. Carlin, assistant attorney general (resigned)
  7. Peter Kadzik, assistant attorney general, congressional liaison (resigned)
  8. Mary McCord, acting assistant attorney general (resigned)
  9. Matthew Axelrod, principal assistant to deputy attorney general (resigned)
  10. Preet Bharara, U.S. attorney, SDNY (fired along with 45 other U.S. Attorneys)
  11. Sharon McGowan, civil rights division (resigned)
  12. Diana Flynn, litigation director for LGBTQ civil rights (resigned)
  13. Vanita Gupta, civil rights division (resigned)
  14. Joel McElvain, assistant branch director of the civil division (resigned)
*Status Unclear

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Old 20th Aug 2018, 13:44
  #15428 (permalink)  
 
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It's interesting to see the way that Trump supporters echo Trump himself with their free-form citations of nonsense as fact.

Hillary Clinton no longer heads the Democratic Party ... not that she ever did. Oh well, "alternative facts."

Robert Mueller, registered Republican, is now the head of the Democratic Party, which must come as news to the head of the Democratic Party, Tom Perez.

Mueller's appointment was illegal ... aside from its having been quite legal, and also accepted as constitutional. (Everything's subject to later judicial review that establishes whether or not it's actually constitutional, but this appointment was made by duly appointed Deputy AG Rod Rosenstein following the recusal of AG Sessions.)

There are two markers for Trump-supporting posts: Freedom from fact, since "Truth is not truth," and crap English. Seriously, show me one post that does not have at least one howler in it ... just one! (We are not speaking here of the Chicago Manual of Style, but simply of staying within the lines when writing using Crayons. It's pathetic!) It's even come to light that Trump's assistants insert mistakes in tweets they write for him, just to make them seem authentically Trumpian. Jesus wept.

I read some think-piece headline about what it would take to get Trump's base to drop its support for him. Well, the answer seems to be clear that Trump was correct to claim that he could shoot someone on 5th Avenue and not lose any votes thereby. In fact, the worse the mess he makes, the more fervid the support from his base. The only question now is whether he's left with enough people to sustain himself as our Lord of Misrule. There's no honor in this for him, not that there ever was; it's just a naked bout of mud-wrestling now, a struggle for survival.

Trump's own lawyer, Giuliani, just said quite clearly that putting Trump in the witness seat would trap him in perjury, not that that should matter since there is no truth. "Truth is not truth!" We used to wonder about Nixon saying "I am not a crook," why he needed to make that claim. Trump, now ... it's "While I would love to release my tax returns, and to speak to Robert Mueller, circumstances sadly prevent me from doing these things, much as I want to." Then there's his telling his base not to believe what they are told is happening, because it's not happening, not happening because Trump says it is not happening. What breath-taking arrogance in the presentation of alternative facts this is! Trump deserves that Purple Heart.
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 14:15
  #15429 (permalink)  
 
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Latest Comments from La-La Land

Steve Bannon says GOP must rally behind Trump to survive
Hillary is no longer the head of the party. She blew it, and there is no reason to believe she has any cred left. The actual and temporary leader of the Democrats is Robert Mueller. Without Mueller, Hillary would be indicted, and she likely would have taken the Party with her. So long as red meat can be offered the radicals on the Left, we have stasis. Without the cover of Mueller and the Media, the Democrats virtually disappear.
Before his “appointment” to Counsel, Mueller was a private citizen. As of now, he has outrageous power to suspend the Constitution, and provide a balance to the clamor for Hillary’s hide from the Right.
Mueller’s appointment was illegal. Special Counsel must be appointed by the Attorney General. Sessions in this case. Rosenstein is a deputy, and has no power to appoint.
Manafort is a demonstrable scumbag, but an innocent scumbag. Until conviction. Not violent, and charged with crimes that are antiquated and refused prosecution years ago.
But Mueller arrests him wth dozens of agents with guns drawn, and puts him in solitary confinement?
I will never forgive the FBI for WACO, and if you are not extremely troubled by the actions of the current Bureau, you should be.
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 14:29
  #15430 (permalink)  
 
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[QUOTEIt's even come to light that Trump's assistants insert mistakes in tweets they write for him, just to make them seem authentically Trumpian][/QUOTE]

Knew he wouldn't be fumbling with a tiny phone keyboard on his own but the image of him shouting his dictation of the twits to aides
from the crapper now keeps popping into my mind.

Giuliani is just doing lawyer speak in his adversarial world. There are always two sides. Which one is right, which one is wrong? Truth comes into it sometimes.
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 15:32
  #15431 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
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Classic example of why some people shouldn't have a Twitter account. Kevin McCarthy's own personal settings were to blame.

I wonder how long before he deletes it? That is if he can actually find the delete button!


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Old 20th Aug 2018, 15:47
  #15432 (permalink)  
 
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Turbine D

Think. A Special Counsel has more authority than a US ATTORNEY. US attorneys require the advise and consent of the SENATE. The Special Counsel operates in a “created jurisdiction”. Only the House can outline Judicial jurisdictions.

If Rosenstein can appoint without fear of conflict with Congress, and the jurisdiction is created by other than Congress, and without approval of the jurisdiction, the Special Counsel is without power, having been appointed by “inferior official” (assistant director). If Mueller is appointed by the Director, then it could be argued the President might be subject to subpoena. Rosenstein cannot subpoena, he is subservient to the Constitutional mandate. (See “appointments clause”) neither is he a judge. He cannot issue warrants.

Mueller, essentially, is a “small barking dog”. By DESIGN. Unfettered power bestowed upon a private citizen, given equal power to the EXECUTIVE? Are you losing your mind? You like that arrangement?

Mueller is without standing at Court, he has not been ratified by the Senate. Which means all he can do is petition other officials to take action. He cannot subpoena. He must use the Grand Jury, which then requests subpoena from a Federal JUDGE.

“No Knock” invasion? Manafort? The FBI is out of control, as is Rosenstein. Shall we discuss their conflicts of interest? Mueller’s Service to Clinton which netted her foundation Millions of dollars? Rosenstein’s involvement with the procurement of the “Dossier”? And its affirmation by affidavit signed by Rosenstein?

Don’t look too closely, as a bright observer, you might get chills.

IMO
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 17:15
  #15433 (permalink)  
 
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McCarthy still doesn't get it and continues to dig an even bigger hole for himself! It even states "Violent Crime" in the tweet!


House majority leader Kevin McCarthy (R-CA) embarrassed himself with a complaint about Twitter “censorship” that was actually a function of his own account settings.

McCarthy was unable to see a “sensitive” tweet by Fox News host Laura Ingraham and took to Twitter to post a screenshot and threaten chairman Jack Dorsey with hearings over “censorship.”
https://www.rawstory.com/2018/08/gop...omments=disqus
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 17:21
  #15434 (permalink)  
 
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"Invasion"?

That was a "no-knock raid," not an "invasion." The Feds went to a judge and got a proper, fully legal search warrant, which was executed on a no-knock basis in order to prevent possible destruction of evidence.

Paul Manafort is not exactly innocent, is he? He's been given the presumption of innocence in order for him to get a fair trial, that's all. On the other hand, there's a lot of evidence that he's squirreled away millions of dollars in offshore accounts, money he was supposed to report to the IRS. It's probably so that if he'd never become involved with Trump and his Russian helpers then he'd never have been caught with all that money, but there you are ....

(There's this thing that so many amateur lawyers seem to love to harp upon: the essential injustice of trying an innocent man. There the amateur lawyer is putting the cart before the horse. Say that Trump really does shoot someone right there on 5th Avenue. He's not guilty of a crime then, is he? On the other hand, is there evidence that shows his possible guilt, so that a grand jury might want to send him for trial? Well, yeah! A suspect is not necessarily guilty, but neither is he innocent; he enjoys the presumption of innocence.)

Sure, Mueller really wants Manafort to tell all that he knows about Trump and the Russians; it was not really about that money in those offshore accounts. The raid and the prosecutions (one trial almost concluded, another one to start soon) really seem to be a way to convince Manafort to turn "RAT," as Trump puts it in his Godfatherly way, but so what? It was not unfair to Manafort to bust in without knocking, giving him no chance to wipe out some digital files he might have sitting around there, and it's not unfair to have put him on trial on the basis of solid evidence, so why should some people get their knickers in a twist over due process of law, calling the raid an "invasion" and the trial a "sad thing" being done to a "good man"?

This is not exactly the Waco raid, is it? If you want to have a pity party, wait to see what happens to Donald Trump
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 17:23
  #15435 (permalink)  
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POLITICO review of part of the Edinburgh Fringe.....

”....It’s hard to find an hour of political stand-up which makes no mention of Corbyn, Boris or Brexit —but to Playbook’s eternal gratitude, 24-year-old Olga Koch pulls it off. Koch is from Russia and has very different targets in her sights. She takes us on a rollercoaster tour of Soviet/Russian history since the mid-1980s, told largely through the lens of her own fairly extraordinary family, whom she lovingly teases throughout. Koch’s father was a mid-ranking Russian politician who suddenly found himself charged with overseeing the privatization of the 1990s. As you may have noticed, it didn’t go too well.

Koch charts Russia’s 1990s transformation through the medium of fantastically dated TV clips. She brings us actual Pizza Hut ads starring Mikhail Gorbachev, and the less-than-sophisticated political broadcasts from Russia’s first-ever democratic elections.

“Finally, Russian people elected their first leader,” she tells us. “And Russians have been electing leaders around the world ever since.”.......

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Old 20th Aug 2018, 17:30
  #15436 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Location: Republic of Texas
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It's funny(not haha, but strange/bizarre) that our media has penetrated such a ruse to so many around the world that the US election was highly influenced by anything, anyone Russian.
It's actually laughable that there are millions of Americans who were going to pull the handle for Clinton except they saw some snippet on the internet about Trump and said to themselves; 'hmmm, I think I will change my mind because of that Instagram/Facebook/Twitter post, and now I will vote Trump'.

Oh I know, I know - it's all mind control. We're all dupes for the great Russian Korbal. Millions of Manchurian Candidates, carrying out the will of the Kremlin!


'mmmuuuuuuaaaahahhahahhahahhaaaa (as Putin cravenly pulls the levers behind the curtain and rolls his hands ala Mr Burns). My great evil plan is working! working! I say... muuuaaahahhahahhahahha'

pfft
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 18:11
  #15437 (permalink)  
 
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So, why bother?

EC, why does yer man Trump spend so much time and effort tweeting if it's as ineffective as you claim that it is? I bet that you believe the sort of hogwash he tweets, along with millions of other of his followers, so that it must be having some effect on the electorate. Otherwise, why should Trump bother?

C'mon now, 'fess up, EC. For how long did you believe that Hillary Clinton was part of a child sex ring run out of the basement of a Washington, D.C. pizza restaurant? More than a day, I bet.
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 18:48
  #15438 (permalink)  

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"Disgraced and discredited Bob Mueller and his whole group of Angry Democrat Thugs spent over 30 hours with the White House Councel [sic], only with my approval, for purposes of transparency. Anybody needing that much time when they know there is no Russian Collusion is just someone looking for trouble," Trump wrote on Twitter Monday morning. "They are enjoying ruining people’s lives and REFUSE to look at the real corruption on the Democrat side - the lies, the firings, the deleted Emails and soooo much more! Mueller’s Angry Dems are looking to impact the election. They are a National Disgrace!"

Sorry OBG and others, but your fella' is not well, and certainly not in a state to be in charge of the USA.
I don't know what his problem is, but this is not the behaviour of someone with all four wheels on the ground.

I don't think that this will end well for anyone, even the top 0.1%

Regrets

Mac
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 19:26
  #15439 (permalink)  
 
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information, ideas, opinions, or images, often only giving one part of an argument, that are broadcast, published, or in some other way spread with the intention of influencing people's opinions.

A
nd cheap as the words and even though the results are weak and highly variable, why not use the tool if you are not actually friends.
Russia, Russia, Russia. Long time not friend.
Not the only 600lb gorilla in the room when you determine just who is a only a superficial friend of the US. The room is crowded. Anyone think China is not doing it?
Just words here and there in the end.
Get worrisome when politicians or others with opposing views start getting knocked off by foreign political entities.. That's never happened, right?

Trump does domestic propaganda......endlessly.........mind numbingly............
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Old 20th Aug 2018, 20:03
  #15440 (permalink)  
 
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Mac

Well there good Doctor, sounds like you need to worry about your own nation instead of mine. Hope you’re not a land owner
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