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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

Old 18th Mar 2018, 17:36
  #12861 (permalink)  
 
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The Trump v porn star thing gets more curious. Didn't he say he had never had anything to do with her? Now he is suing the porn star for $20M for breaching the terms of a non-disclosure agreement he apparently didn't sign.
Trump lawyers seek $20m in damages from porn star Stormy Daniels - BBC News
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 20:33
  #12862 (permalink)  

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"The Mueller probe should never have been started in that there was no collusion and there was no crime. It was based on fraudulent activities and a Fake Dossier paid for by Crooked Hillary and the DNC, and improperly used in FISA COURT for surveillance of my campaign. WITCH HUNT!"

Sorry guys, your fella is either seriously guilty (of something) or seriously ill (or both).

Mac
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 22:07
  #12863 (permalink)  
 
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The Trump v porn star thing gets more curious.
Good grief, this behavior was many years ago. He screwed a porn star. Who really cares? Maybe we should investigate everything he said or did on his silly TV reality shows to see if there might have been a lie in there somewhere.

For those who were insistent that Clinton's activities were "just a BJ in the oval office", their sudden interest in complete moral righteousness is amusing.

Once again, Trump is right: the Mueller probe should indeed be shut down as it is a complete waste of time and resources.
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 22:36
  #12864 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
Good grief, this behavior was many years ago. He screwed a porn star. Who really cares?
Apparently Trump and/or his lawyer cared enough to spend $130,000 to keep her quiet.

...the Mueller probe should indeed be shut down as it is a complete waste of time and resources.
As compared to, say, the Clinton Benghazi and Email probes - which cost how much, and to what practical end?

Don't stage political investigations if you can't take the heat yourself, boyo. Because conservatives, populists and Republicans are not a privileged class who get to avoid scrutiny while dishing it out to Dems and/or liberals...
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Old 18th Mar 2018, 23:50
  #12865 (permalink)  
 
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As compared to, say, the Clinton Benghazi and Email probes - which cost how much, and to what practical end?
Precisely my point.

Nobody got any sanction for Benghazi.
Nothing came of the Email investigations.
And nothing is coming of this Mueller investigation.

These affairs are just fronts to allow politicians to pretend they are doing something, when in fact they have no desire whatsoever to upset their own applecart.

That and to fill space on the media headlines.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 03:11
  #12866 (permalink)  
 
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I find it disconcerting that so many conservatives continue to support and defend Trump and his nefarious gang of goons. Party loyalty is one thing, but far too many conservatives are setting themselves up for a further decline in the morality and dignity of what was once a great party, let alone the states of their own personal integrity.

Perhaps its just a refusal to see the impending disaster on the horizon, or perhaps, it is nothing more than the myopathy created by partisan blinders. Either way, I foresee a terrible fall from former glory and respect for the GOP in the near future, thanks nearly entirely to Trump and those of limited moral turpitude that support him.

It would be far healthier for our Democracy and your own dignity and conscience to stop making excuses, and embrace the fact that the Republican Party has a malignant cancer in their chosen leader. There are many that see the damage to the party already surpassing that of Nixon's fall. It's not too late, but right now, there are just a handful of brave Republicans, integrity intact, that have stood up for what is right.

History is watching, the future is watching.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 03:21
  #12867 (permalink)  
 
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The issue is not a blow job vs boinking a porn star, OBG. It is the utterly shameful hypocrisy that exists in defending Trump for his lying, misogynist, racist ways. The GOP's core values are supposedly based upon the modern interpretation of Judeo-Christian principles, and Rump has transgressed nearly all of them.

I would be willing to bet that this man, as president, has publicly lied more than all the other presidents combined. These are not just little white lies, these are proven whoppers. He has forced the GOP members of Congress to defend his onerous statements numerous times, and has insulted entire continents and religions with his bigoted/racist-laden remarks. At what point do we say, enough?

Once again, Trump is right: the Mueller probe should indeed be shut down as it is a complete waste of time and resources.
"Wait for the report" "Shut it down now" Which one is it?
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 05:23
  #12868 (permalink)  
 
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Actually VAP, I am not "defending" Trump. He's a combo product of New York and Hollywood arrogance. About as far away from my standards as one can get.

However, I am pleased with most of the decisions he has made, and the policies he has enacted. Though it is too soon to tell, there is even the possibility that he might be successful in foreign policy.

We haven't had a President of upstanding character in decades, with the possible exception of the Bush lads and Carter. And you know how much scorn was heaped on them. So why would I insist on it now? And who should I have chosen, if not Trump? Was there some other candidate of such great integrity running?

Nixon was a dirtball. But he accomplished a lot regarding China. Carter was a solid man of conviction, but a terrible leader. The two aspects of a President do not usually go together.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 05:41
  #12869 (permalink)  
 
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Thank you, Obgraham for that insight into your thinking.

I cannot fault you for being conservative. I have conservative leanings myself in certain areas of governing and security. I'm for a strong defense, and believe government is too big. My issue is the continuing support of a man that has so many moral and intellectual faults, it nearly boggles the mind. It's difficult to reserve judgement in cases like this.

I'm generally in agreement with your characterization of the integrity of past presidents, but I would lose one Bush and add one fella with the Hawaiian birth certificate, although I'm sure the latter fellow will not be agreed upon.

We are stronger united than divided. The 2016 election has caused a further divide, and Trump made no attempts to bridge that chasm and continues to foment division and hatred, two things that, apparently, he feeds upon.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 06:00
  #12870 (permalink)  
 
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although I'm sure the latter fellow will not be agreed upon.
He’s a funny guy, loved his performance at the journalist banquets. Love to grab a few beers with him, but best kept far from the WH.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 15:11
  #12871 (permalink)  
 
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What if? And CBSNews is not a Trump supporter.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/comment...-no-collusion/

Every side must consider the possibility of being wrong.

GF
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 15:50
  #12872 (permalink)  
 
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“I think there’s a big sigh of relief and a good feeling about the fact that an FBI element, and organization in the FBI, recommended that he be fired, as opposed to them being mute and having someone else make that recommendation,” Kallstrom said. “So I think they’re very happy about that.”

Former assistant Director of the FBI.

Mueller has ended up in the unenviable position of kangaroo investigator, for the benefit of the DNC. Whether or not that is true, the case can be made.

I think Trump is despicable. I also believe in the American system of government. That there is a link between the Democrat Party (DNC), Hillary Clinton, and the recently civilian players is sufficient to disqualify by Law the extension of a broad extralegal power to go fishing in personal data.

We have come so quickly to witlessly support some bs in the Press merely because it is assumed to support a position that cannot be supported by data: both “positions”.

Trump is a shit. But the office must be respected. It was ever so. And must remain.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 16:15
  #12873 (permalink)  
 
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If there was collusion in the election, just as likely it occurred between the Democrat party and the Administration as anywhere. Completely agree with Concours77 on Trump lacking character for the job, but that isn’t a constitutional requirement as history shows.

GF
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 17:03
  #12874 (permalink)  
 
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Mueller’s work is breathtakingly illegal. He is utilizing an improper entry into the arena of deep sea fishing, not for crime, but for a novel legal method to control governance.

He is a separate and illegal Branch of American Government. Linking new work to prior work, work that is improper, making new work irrelevant to the Law.

To gain access by subpoena to records of a private firm requires evidence of crime. Mueller has consistently extrapolated his authority by citing an original remit that fails the test of its own origination....

“But there may be collusion....”

Listen up. “COLLUSION” is not illegal, and cannot be grounds for the creation of a Special Counsel, only actual evidence of conspiracy would support Mueller’s work, and his artificial claim to subpoena power.

Conspiracy is a felony. Collusion is planning to have coffee with a girlfriend.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 18:04
  #12875 (permalink)  
 
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We talked about orphans, but why do you ask?

"To gain access by subpoena to records of a private firm requires evidence of crime." Umm, no!

I think you will find that a subpoena is used to seek evidence. Say, for example, that there's mere suspicion that you are doing internet fraud, taking money for goods you never deliver. Then the state might hit you with a subpoena to provide records of your e-mail traffic, seeking evidence of that crime.

Concours, you keep coming up with very, very strange interpretations of law. Are you, perhaps, a "sovereign citizen"? Just asking ... no subpoena.

As to this "collusion" thing, try this one on for size:

Say that I met with the Colombian lawyer for a big-time drug smuggler in a side room at our FBO, with the owner there one floor up in his office. Later I first say, "No meeting, nothing like that."

Then, when news of the meeting leaks out, I say, "Oh, that meeting! Umm, we were meeting about adopting Colombian orphans."

Some time later I say that, well, actually that Colombian lawyer had requested the meeting to discuss shipping some sort of packages, some sort of white powder, from Medellín to Miami, but that never came up at the meeting so that was that. Yes, the boss was there in his office then, but I never bothered to put him in the loop about dealing with the lawyer for a Colombian drug smuggler; I did that one all on my own, for the first time ever.

Come now! With a history like that one, would the boss really be able to cry "Witch hunt!" if he got a subpoena or two from the DEA looking into his probably having conspired to ship drugs? (Bear in mind that he would not have needed ever to have done any drug runs. Merely conspiring to do them is enough to get him into big trouble.)

Just swap "Russian" for "Colombian" lawyer; swap "dirt on Hillary from stolen e-mails" for "big bucks smuggling cocaine"; and then consider how very, very evasive some people, particularly Donald Trump, have been about a meeting that was supposed to have been perfectly innocent.

Some of us here are trying to make this all about politics, when it really is about looking into Trump possibly, even probably, having colluded with Russia to gain an advantage in his successful campaign to become our 45th President.

Last edited by chuks; 19th Mar 2018 at 18:57.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 22:03
  #12876 (permalink)  
 
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Mueller’s work is breathtakingly illegal.
How so, Concours77? Do you have special insight into the investigation that the rest of us are not privy to? Or perhaps you're a Hannity/Tucker Carlson/Lou Dobbs/Faux News fan.

Speaking of jumping to conclusions, Trump's new 'mouthpiece' has a recent history of making conspiracy-laden and completely unfounded accusations against the FBI and special council and former FBI Director Robert Mueller and his team.

“Make no mistake about it: A group of FBI and DOJ people were trying to frame Donald Trump of a falsely created crime" -DiGenova Faux News January 2018

We are headed toward a very sad ending for the FBI and senior DOJ officials. ... I believe that several high FBI officials will be charged criminally. And it is conceivable that some DOJ people will also be charged criminally. ... I would consider this the largest law enforcement scandal in history for this reason. The activities of McCabe and others and Bruce Ohr and others were designed to subvert the Constitution and a national election, the most serious offense under our Constitution. -Faux News - Hannity
"He's [McCabe] done a number of things worth punishment, including careening through obstruction of justice from the beginning of the Trump campaign, doing everything he could to exonerate Hillary Clinton in the email server case correctly. ... He should be fired. He should have been fired a long time ago. And if he loses some of his benefits, that's good for the country. And it's the least that can be done to him. "

"It means that the system of equal justice has been rent asunder by the conduct of James Comey, America's best-known dirty cop, Andrew McCabe and others, including senior Obama administrator Justice Department officials. This is a moment in history that has sullied the reputation of the FBI and the Department of Justice, and deservedly so. Every one of these people should be put in a wanted poster at a post office, even though they may never be arrested."

-DiGenova, Faux News - Tucker Carlson
DiGenova seems to be using the same crystal ball that our Concours77 has. Saying Mueller's team is "trying to frame Trump of a falsely created crime" is putting the cart way before the horse since nobody at the DOJ, or FBI, or in any of the lesser vehicles of Congressional investigation committees have presented evidence of a crime by Trump - yet, although, several of his campaign people and administration have been indicted, with a few pleading guilty to lying about their contacts with Russians.

The typical way criminal investigators do their work in cases like these is to follow the money. That's why they need a look at the Trump organization's business. We've heard Trump previously say that's his personal line in the sand. Now that we've reached that stage of the investigation, suddenly, Dept AG McCabe is ousted and Rump begins public calls for the special counsel to be dissolved and accuses what is most likely one of the most conservative agencies in our government of some vast left-wing conspiracy.

So far, team Mueller has indicted 19 people and 3 corporate entities so far, obtaining guilty pleas from 5. These are just the indictments and pleas publicly known, by there way, there could be others. Another criminology 101 lesson: when people all lie about the same thing, there's something being covered up and more often than not, worthy of further digging.

So to say that there's no "there there" is an exercise normally reserved for criminal defense attorneys, often with guilty clients. To say there's a vast conspiracy is another thing altogether, and this is the publicly stated view of Trump's new shyster. Sounds like a good match.

If as DiGenova and others have suggested, there was some kind of collusion in our government against Rump, you can bet your ass GOP members of Congress, particularly those in the House, would be shrieking like scalded weasels about it by now. So far, not a peep.

Last edited by vapilot2004; 22nd Mar 2018 at 09:59.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 22:18
  #12877 (permalink)  
 
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Nothing Mueller has done as yet is related to his original remit. No evidence there was any conspiracy to collect money from, or inkind from, a foreign entity.

The Dossier is evidence of collusion, and to the extent it may have been successfully utilized by Clinton, a conspiracy to defraud. No one here knows of any evidence derived by Mueller linking Trump or his campaign to the Russian government. If you have some, leak it.

The person who appointed Mueller, Rosenstein is inextricably mired in conflict, since it was he who stipulated to the Dossier as authentic, in reissuing by application the FISA warrant. That is an easy case to make for material conflict in an ongoing investigation, and grounds for termination.

“No actual conflict need be demonstrated, an appearance of impropriety is sufficient...”

The case against Clinton was Perjury. The case against Trump is hatred, and fear.

Perhaps unwarranted, but seemingly sufficient to motivate careerists to lie, and conspire.

If you want the man, wait for Impeachment.
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Old 19th Mar 2018, 22:31
  #12878 (permalink)  
 
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Have you shared your PPRuNe login credentials with our SASless, Concours?
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 10:01
  #12879 (permalink)  
 
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SASless has "been given some time away."

SASless, only slightly to the right of Genghis Khan, but safely to the left of a certain Austrian we shall not name, is far saner than some who post here, I find.

Anyway the Trumpistas love to roll in their man's filth. It reminds me of a beagle we once had. Freshly bathed it was out the door like a furry rocket in search of the nastiest stuff it could find to roll in and thus regain its desired state of mankyness.

All we can do for now is to put up with the pong and wait for fate to catch up with the Orange Abomination.

In his crazy sort of way Trump is actually speeding the process along. It seems that he thinks, having got away with so much already, that he can get away with anything, perhaps including firing Bob Mueller and certainly including getting into a nasty court battle with a porn star and her attack dog lawyer.

Trump is relying on Michael Cohen, who has to be the clumsiest perpetrator of a cover-up ever, given that the whole world now knows that David Dennison is Also/Known/As Donald John Trump. Cohen's now going up against a guy, Avenatti, so much sharper than he that this looks like a man armed with a butter knife duelling with a man armed with a katana. Not that right must prevail, but it's hard to see how Cohen and Trump are going to come away from this one without some serious wounds.

Where once it merely was that some shadowy Delaware corporation, Essential Consulting LLC, had paid the fragrant, or perhaps merely smelly, Stormy Daniels $130,000, that quickly unraveled to become that Trump's main mouthpiece, Michael Cohen, had paid her. From that promising beginning it has now become Trump himself who is suing her for $20 million-plus, though for what and on what basis is still unclear. At least we can forget that charming fantasy that the money paid had nothing to do with Trump, that this was between Cohen and Daniels.

If someone were to threaten to sue me for $130 thousand I would be deterred. $20 million, or $20 billion, though? That's fantasy money. When you go that far then money loses its deterrent effect. You can only bury me six feet deep.

Stormy's interview with the widely-watched program "60 Minutes" is due to air next Sunday. (No need to guess what program Trump will be watching then. We may see a flat-screen TV fly out a White House bedroom window to land in the Rose Garden, next Sunday.)

Gee, Donald, I guess this is what you get when you pick fights with almost all of "the media."
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Old 20th Mar 2018, 10:44
  #12880 (permalink)  
 
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I can hear Bill Maher now, "How's that grab ya, Donnie?"

RE: the Kaiser's 'Murrican cousin: I sincerely hope the time away has been therapeutic.
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