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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

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US Politics Hamsterwheel v2.0

Old 20th May 2020, 23:02
  #22001 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Middle America
Age: 81
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There is going to be a celebration at the White House shortly, celebrating Trump being designated "Morbidly Obese" by his doctor. Trump at that time will be inducted into the Morbidly Obese Club, an honor not everybody qualifies for. Some happy current Morbidly Obese Club members, sure to cheer Trump up, that will participate in the celebration include:




Everyone deserves a hero to look up to and Trump is their hero! Vote!
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Old 20th May 2020, 23:24
  #22002 (permalink)  
 
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Boudreaux Bob;10787817
All of you that accuse Trump of running up the National Debt....why do you not say the same ab out Obama who was President when that Debt DOUBLED during his two Terms in Office.

Why do you see Trump as the big spender and not Obama?
Because Trump inherited an economy that was very sound after the previous recession. Obama inherited a economy, as President, which was dangerously weak. Obama did what any leader would do in a recession, spend your way out of it. The economy was strengthening under Obama and the deficit was decreasing, not rising. But, Trump in 3 1/2 years on the job with one of the best US economies with the lowest unemployment rate in the US during peace time, accumulated a deficit spending amount equal to half of Obama's spending in 8 Years. So we will see what happens in the next 4 years, fingers crossed that Trump isn't pushing the buttons or it will be probably be a record deficit spending for 8 years. If you have access to the WSJ, there is a chart that displays this fact, issued by the US Treasury Department.
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Old 20th May 2020, 23:31
  #22003 (permalink)  
 
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I say this as a so-called Trumpist now, but the biggest failure of the Trump term was in his inability to eliminate deficit government spending. The Congress was complicit in this failure.

Now that ship has sailed. Turbine claimed that Obama had no choice but to go deficit because of "unique circumstances". Trump will claim the same now, and even Turbine knows it is true. But we can be sure that if Biden ever gets around to campaigning he will batter Trump with that.

Meanwhile, Nancy P is trying to get all the Democrat spending policies enacted now, knowing that the chances after November are slim to none.
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Old 21st May 2020, 03:19
  #22004 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Holly Beach, Louisiana
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Originally Posted by Turbine D View Post
Because Trump inherited an economy that was very sound after the previous recession. Obama inherited a economy, as President, which was dangerously weak. Obama did what any leader would do in a recession, spend your way out of it. The economy was strengthening under Obama and the deficit was decreasing, not rising. But, Trump in 3 1/2 years on the job with one of the best US economies with the lowest unemployment rate in the US during peace time, accumulated a deficit spending amount equal to half of Obama's spending in 8 Years. So we will see what happens in the next 4 years, fingers crossed that Trump isn't pushing the buttons or it will be probably be a record deficit spending for 8 years. If you have access to the WSJ, there is a chart that displays this fact, issued by the US Treasury Department.
You are fixated on Trump v. Obama as if they can snap their fingers and magically spend any amount of money in any way they wish..... and you adamantly refuse to accept the Congressional role in how the US Federal Budget/Spending occurs.

No matter how many times you are reminded of that role...you keep on coming back to Trump bashing him for "his" spending as you put it and giving Obama a pass on what would be "his" by your fatally flawed concept...when BOTH had to deal with Congress on every bit of the Federal Spending that took place during their respective Term(s) in Office.

Just what is it you do not get about that?

A Village Idiot can get his arms around the concept....why are you not able to so?

Please do explain!
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Old 21st May 2020, 15:17
  #22005 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Boudreaux Bob View Post
You are fixated on Trump v. Obama as if they can snap their fingers and magically spend any amount of money in any way they wish..... and you adamantly refuse to accept the Congressional role in how the US Federal Budget/Spending occurs.

No matter how many times you are reminded of that role...you keep on coming back to Trump bashing him for "his" spending as you put it and giving Obama a pass on what would be "his" by your fatally flawed concept...when BOTH had to deal with Congress on every bit of the Federal Spending that took place during their respective Term(s) in Office.

Just what is it you do not get about that?

A Village Idiot can get his arms around the concept....why are you not able to so?

Please do explain!
Bobby B, The national debt is reported based on the President in office at the time not the Congresses that happen to be in place during a President's term in office. Congresses change every two years. The current Congress is the 116th Congress. If you were to subscribe to any major financial newspaper such as the Wall Street Journal you might get the gist of how the national debt is reported and attributed to. Of course Congress plays a role in the direction the national debt is going, either up or down, The President develops a budget and forwards it to Congress for approval. If he doesn't like what Congress approved, he can veto it and the process starts over. I never implied otherwise. It just isn't the way it's reported. So who is the village idiot when it comes to the reporting concept?

Just to help you with the reporting concept:
https://www.investopedia.com/ask/ans...t-deficits.asp
https://www.thirdway.org/memo/what-y...-national-debt

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Old 21st May 2020, 15:34
  #22006 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
I say this as a so-called Trumpist now, but the biggest failure of the Trump term was in his inability to eliminate deficit government spending. The Congress was complicit in this failure.

Now that ship has sailed. Turbine claimed that Obama had no choice but to go deficit because of "unique circumstances". Trump will claim the same now, and even Turbine knows it is true. But we can be sure that if Biden ever gets around to campaigning he will batter Trump with that.

Meanwhile, Nancy P is trying to get all the Democrat spending policies enacted now, knowing that the chances after November are slim to none.
obgraham, I agree with you on this.

The one thing I aways have said is running a presidential campaign on the economy of the country is a bad idea which Trump is now experiencing. So what is Trump going to run on? It can't be the economy, it can't be his administration management of the COVID-19 pandemic in the US, it can't be his position on absentee voting, it can't be his position on trade and tariff wars and it can't be his position on immigration. So what can it be?
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Old 21st May 2020, 16:12
  #22007 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
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So what can it be?
Why Obamagate of course......

It was a huge mistake to enact the tax cuts that Trump did, just as it was a huge mistake by Bush II to throw away a chance to reduce debt after Clinton actually ran a surplus. And Republicans claim they are the party of fiscal responsibility.
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Old 21st May 2020, 18:17
  #22008 (permalink)  
 
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Perhaps this set of graphics will point out the effect of a Republican or Democrat controlled House of Representatives plays in the fiscal policy of the Federal Government.

When the Congress is held by a single party....and the White House by a different one....that also is a dynamic of its own.

Single party control of the White House and Congress by either party is never a good thing.

But Turbine will still describe it as being Obama v. Trump or Clinton v. Bush.....discounting who controlled what in Congress during the Presidents Administration.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divide..._United_States
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Old 21st May 2020, 18:33
  #22009 (permalink)  
 
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Dear Leader, the gift that keeps on giving. He has the best words and the best brain.......

“And you know when you say ‘per capita,’ there’s many per capitas,” the president said. “It’s like, per capita relative to what? But you can look at just about any category and we’re really at the top, meaning positive, on a per capita basis too.”
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Old 21st May 2020, 18:42
  #22010 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2006
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Originally Posted by Winemaker View Post
Dear Leader, the gift that keeps on giving. He has the best words and the best brain.......
Per capita the USoA has the dumbest president in the world. One or two runners up, but they're way behind. And this the country I used to love. Sad.
Per
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Old 21st May 2020, 18:59
  #22011 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
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I can figure out what he's getting at but still......

“I tested very positively in another sense,” Trump told reporters. “So this morning, I tested positively toward negative, right? So, no, I tested perfectly this morning, meaning I tested negative. But that’s a way of saying it — positively toward the negative.”
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Old 21st May 2020, 19:49
  #22012 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Boudreaux Bob View Post
Perhaps this set of graphics will point out the effect of a Republican or Democrat controlled House of Representatives plays in the fiscal policy of the Federal Government.

When the Congress is held by a single party....and the White House by a different one....that also is a dynamic of its own.

Single party control of the White House and Congress by either party is never a good thing.

But Turbine will still describe it as being Obama v. Trump or Clinton v. Bush.....discounting who controlled what in Congress during the Presidents Administration.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Divide..._United_States
Bob, Sorry you are confused as to how the National debt is reported by the US Treasury Department and major financial sources. But, that is what I use. It is much simpler than the Wikipedia tables which you apparently are promoting.

No matter how you cut it, Trump is currently the leader of this country and as such, is responsible or should be responsible for what occurs on his watch. He has made it clear, he is responsible for nothing except if it is good and furthers his quest for a second term.

He's not on speaking terms with the US Speaker of The House of Representatives, he is currently at war with two States over the use of absentee voting in elections because of fraud which is very rare. He doesn't understand the role a US President plays either domestically or internationally. He is a destructive source on the world stage, not a constructive source. He doesn't understand the role of the free press in the United States, he views it as an enemy. He admires dictators and disses world leaders that do posses values that he doesn't. He is planning to withdraw from the Open Skies Treaty. He blames his intelligence briefings for his minimizing the COVID-19 pandemic response.

I am not a Trump fan, never have been never will be. I saw first hand how he operated in his NYC business role as a commercial real estate building developer, he was a better playboy than a developer. You are wasting your time to convince me that Trump has any attributes that are worthy of admiration, he displays none. His moral character is corrupt to the core and has been that way dating back to the 1970s. It is getting worse in many respects with his nasty tweets and personal attacks that accomplish nothing but creating greater political divisions in this country. It has reached the point where I believe nothing that comes out of this White House...



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Old 21st May 2020, 23:14
  #22013 (permalink)  
 
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Certainly not trying to lever you away from your hatred of all things Trump.

Just trying to remind you there exists a Congress.

Your favorite current Speaker of the House who just penned a 3.5 Trillion Socialist Spending List of a Bill....which had zero input from Mr. Trump....would seem to add to that National Debt.

Are you going to call that Trump's Debt if Pelosi were to get her way?

There is the proof of what I have been telling you for the past half dozen posts or so and you continue to refuse to admit.



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Old 21st May 2020, 23:16
  #22014 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
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He is now threatening to withhold federal funds from States allowing voting by mail.
Apart from the fact that mail voting is not against the law and has been practised in several States does this sound like:
a quid pro quo ? ("I want you to do us a favour, though")
or blackmailing?
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Old 22nd May 2020, 00:32
  #22015 (permalink)  
 
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Brakes, I don't know if you have ever spent much time in the US. It says here "Germany". At any rate, you fail to understand that this is a common US political tactic. The States are supposed to be primary in passing laws -- that is what the Constitution provides for.
But for decades, the Federal Government has bypassed this by threatening to withhold funds if a state doesn't do what some politicians or bureaucrats think they should. Best case to come to min easily: the National 55mph speed limit back in Nixonian days. "No federal road money for you unless you pass this". So Montana dutifully did, and their cops dutifully ignored it when writing tickets. So it is an old technique of "making them an offer they can't refuse".

The media, of course, will try to make this all about Trump the Dictator, again.

States are empowered to arrange the elections themselves. On this issue, Trump should butt out.
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Old 22nd May 2020, 04:03
  #22016 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by obgraham View Post
Brakes, I don't know if you have ever spent much time in the US. It says here "Germany". At any rate, you fail to understand that this is a common US political tactic. The States are supposed to be primary in passing laws -- that is what the Constitution provides for.
But for decades, the Federal Government has bypassed this by threatening to withhold funds if a state doesn't do what some politicians or bureaucrats think they should. Best case to come to min easily: the National 55mph speed limit back in Nixonian days. "No federal road money for you unless you pass this". So Montana dutifully did, and their cops dutifully ignored it when writing tickets. So it is an old technique of "making them an offer they can't refuse".

The media, of course, will try to make this all about Trump the Dictator, again.

States are empowered to arrange the elections themselves. On this issue, Trump should butt out.
I agree, especially because I live and vote in Washington State which has had vote by mail only for almost ten years. It works, it works well, there have been no issues of fraud, signatures are checked for each ballot and compared to the recorded signature of the voter, there is plenty of time to think about the candidates and issues, and you can actually change your vote if you request to early enough. The ballot is postage paid, there is no standing in lines for hours at a voting station in the rain, what's not to like?

We had 50% participation, the highest in the nation, for our presidential primary. To commit fraud someone would first have to get a ballot that was mailed to someone's home, fill it out, then forge their signature decently enough to match the signature on record. This just isn't going to happen. The entire county should adopt this system of voting; there are no machines that mysteriously change your vote, and you can check online to see whether your vote was received. Pretty good system; much better than the debacle we saw recently in Wisconsin where most of the precinct voting locations were closed and people stood for hours to use one of the five open sites; there had been over 100 originally slated to open. You don't have to leave work to vote, you can just mail in your secure ballot.
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Old 22nd May 2020, 05:46
  #22017 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
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Why doesn't the United States vote on the weekends when more citizens who wish to vote are free from work? Or is it not really a problem and the way it is works best?
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Old 22nd May 2020, 06:27
  #22018 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2017
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Originally Posted by Uncle Fred View Post
Why doesn't the United States vote on the weekends when more citizens who wish to vote are free from work? Or is it not really a problem and the way it is works best?
Because that would be too rational. There have been voting problems forever here and it never seems to get better; is that a bug or a feature? I suspect it's a feature. Vote by mail would solve these problems but it would also mean everyone has a chance to vote....... Look to the states, like Washington and Oregon, which have vote by mail. No lines, no weather issues, yada, yada, yada. Too rational. One of my brothers says that voting should be hard to do, as that proves some sort of moral imperative about the voter. You have kids at home and just got back from work and you have to stand in line for three hours so if you vote you are somehow showing... what?
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Old 22nd May 2020, 07:41
  #22019 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
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I actually agree with my neighbor the Winemaker. Our mail-in or drop-in ballot system seems to work okay.

But I'm not under his illusion that voter fraud is so difficult.

You get your invitation to vote either on request, or via driver license registration. Of course, a DL does not require citizenship. And nobody actually checks your citizenship. You just sign a statement that you are. I lived in Washington State for several decades as a greencard holder, and received voter registration forms many times. I believe Winemaker has a similar history to me, and likely cannot disagree. The process is nothing like the Enumerators that Parliamentary systems such as Canada use to generate a voter list.

And then there is nothing to stop a nefarious type from grabbing all his family's ballots and filling them in. Likewise visiting a senior care facility and "assisting" with the ballot process. It's not at all difficult to produce an acceptable signature. Mine is never the same, and has never been challenged.

And finally, they always seem to have a barrel or two of "suddenly located uncounted ballots", which somehow only surface when the race is very close, and almost always in favor of the U-No-Hu party. Odd, that.

I like the mail-in voting. But it is not immune to rigging.
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Old 22nd May 2020, 07:51
  #22020 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Kelowna Wine Country
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Some of the states don't just want to allow mail in voting without cause but they want to allow the admittance of harvested votes.

Vote harvesting is where the filled in voting papers are collected by a third party (usually and agent of one of the parties) and delivered to the counting station. Sometimes in USA politics it is difficult to work out what the actual agenda is!
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