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Drink Driving - Zero Limit

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Drink Driving - Zero Limit

Old 7th Dec 2014, 19:10
  #61 (permalink)  
 
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Think of the block who has been to a party the night before and gets picked up because a light bulb packs it in and he is just over 50 mg.

Three years ban, £400 fine.

Serve the basteward right!

Can't drive so loses his job. Doesn't live near a bus route so is now unemployed.

Serve the basteward right!

He now goes on jobseekers allowance, can't pay the rent so gets housing benefit. In a couple of weeks he has recuperated the £400 and is now set up for three years.

Government now plus £400 and a nice warm feeling but minus £45,000 in benefits.
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 19:38
  #62 (permalink)  
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Tough call indeed Fareast, as tough as the parent's who have to live with the anguish of the loss of a child to the same drink driver who was just over the limit? I think the worth of the new law is in its simplicity - you drink - you should not be driving.

Tom
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 19:39
  #63 (permalink)  
 
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Government now plus £400 and a nice warm feeling but minus £45,000 in benefits.
Nobody said law enforcement comes cheap
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 20:14
  #64 (permalink)  
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What do you find so hard to understand about the fact that food slows down the rate of alcohol absorption into the body so therefore it will take longer before you reach and pass the prescribed limit for dring driving?
If it takes longer, you may be able to drink whilst eating and drive home whilst being below the limit


What do I find so hard to understand ?

The pious and weak excuses offered in support of the indefensible perhaps ?

The "ever so slightly flawed logic" that is proposed as being rational in that, if you have a meal, then, it's fine to drink as well because...you're eating.

That in 2014, there are still those with the intellectual capacity of a granite block who feel they are capable of defying the normal metabolic processes of mere mortals, get into a mass of machinery weighing say 900kgs....travel at varying speeds with varying road conditions and varying driving skills of other road users, whilst having had alcohol with their meal.

It really is dead easy to understand.....go out for a meal, have a drink, enjoy yourself...just don't drive thereafter.

Walk, take a taxi. take public transport, get a sober driver...just don't drink and then feel you are safe to drive...because you are not.

Difficult to comprehend it would seem.....
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 20:38
  #65 (permalink)  
 
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Can't drive so loses his job. Doesn't live near a bus route so is now unemployed.
I remember working in the Netherlands some years ago and discussing this, I seem to recall that if you lost your driving licence for a misdemeanour, you were still able to ride a very low powered scooter or moped in order to get to work, seems like a very sensible idea, and prevents the situation described by FE.
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 20:48
  #66 (permalink)  
 
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In Belgium and I think France and Italy, they have small cars which can be driven without a licence, I think they have a 50cc motor and are officially called a 'quadricycle'.

Having seen them on the roads, I think they are rather dangerous to the user, since they are very slow and flimsy, but if one were to hit a pedestrian or cyclist, the latter would come off worst. They also cause frustration to other road users.

I find it absurd that someone who has lost their licence after a drinking (or other) offence should be allowed to drive a powered vehicle on the public road, but then it is France and Belgium ........
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 21:17
  #67 (permalink)  
 
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I guess that another question is: Could you pass the license test with 1,2 maybe 3 drinks in you? If you could, then you're no worse than a newly qualified driver.

After an excellent landing etc...
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 21:57
  #68 (permalink)  
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That in 2014, there are still those with the intellectual capacity of a granite block who feel they are capable of defying the normal metabolic processes of mere mortals, get into a mass of machinery weighing say 900kgs....travel at varying speeds with varying road conditions and varying driving skills of other road users, whilst having had alcohol with their meal.
The link that you provided earlier was where I found the information that states alcohol is absorbed into the body slower if it is taken along with food, so it does in fact alter the normal metabolic process.
FACT: Eating a meal while drinking alcohol does slow down your body's absorption of alcohol, but it does not prevent it. You will only get drunk slower.

It really is dead easy to understand.....go out for a meal, have a drink, enjoy yourself...just don't drive thereafter.
I don't see anything wrong with having a meal and a drink then driving providing that the alcohol is in moderation and the driver isn't close to or above the legal limit.
In fact, in my very first post on this thread I stated that I was in favour of the limit being lowered.

Be truthful now KnC.
Do you act as arrogant and rude to people who have a different opinion to you if you are having a face to face discussion or only when hiding behind the safety of a computer screen as you seem incapable of writing a single post without insulting at least one person.
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 22:35
  #69 (permalink)  
 
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You have to put a figure on the "limit"as it is easier to control.
No 2 people are the same when it comes to alcohol for various reasons.
Empty stomach,tired etc have an effect on everyone.
If you drink lots each day,then give it up for a few months,when drinking again you find the "jelly legs" set in long before they used to.
In the younger days a friend was paraletic and had an argument with a tree on the way home.Was only .11,yet another mate who looked completely sober blew .18.
Maybe the American sobriety test is the way to go.If you get effected by alcohol easily you want pass.
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 23:15
  #70 (permalink)  
 
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I find it absurd that someone who has lost their licence after a drinking (or other) offence should be allowed to drive a powered vehicle on the public road, but then it is France and Belgium ........

.....and in certain of the United States, provided that the driving is only for the purposes of travelling to and from work. Known as "Limited Driving Privileges" in North Carolina as an example, and permitted only under very stringent conditions, it certainly gets round the major issue of consequential job losses that we experience in the UK.

Additionally, and using NC as an example again, there are variable permissible blood alcohol concentration according to factors such as offenders being aged under 21, commercial drives et al.

Jack
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 23:24
  #71 (permalink)  
 
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All a zero limit does is criminalize many people who are causing no harm to anyone, and bring the law further into disrepute. It's prohibition by the back door.

I originally supported MADD on this side of the pond - when the focus really was getting drunk drivers off the road. However I stopped when it became apparent that their end game was in fact prohibition.


I don't think any sane person is in favor of people driving while significantly impaired - be it by alcohol, drugs, or extreme lack of sleep. The vast majority of drunk driving fatalities are either young people (at least in this country not even old enough to legally drink), or repeat offenders that are several times the legal limit. Let's focus on getting those people off the road.
When we start criminalizing people for stopping to have a pint with your mates after work, everyone loses.
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 23:25
  #72 (permalink)  

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.....and in certain of the United States, provided that the driving is only for the purposes of travelling to and from work. Known as "Limited Driving Privileges" in North Carolina as an example, and permitted only under very stringent conditions, it certainly gets round the major issue of consequential job losses that we experience in the UK.
I think that in some states that travel exemption is expanded to driving to church* on Sundays as well. Also, there is a breathalyzer connected to the ignition of the car and the car will not start if any alcohol is detected on the driverís breath.

* No communion wine for them.
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Old 7th Dec 2014, 23:42
  #73 (permalink)  
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For which the driver pays. And it's a bloody expensive device. So I'm told.


Well, I went to the yacht club lunchtime and mindful of this thread reduced to one pint of cider in 3 hours. The trouble is, bar talk is encoded in a very strange way and needs alcohol to awaken the decoding sections of the brain. I fear one pint leaves the incoming conversation sounding like utter bo-lox.
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Old 8th Dec 2014, 05:22
  #74 (permalink)  
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419...

About that link you quoted....the one that, in your opinion justifies drinking and driving...if you are eating.....try reading it again and you may note the bit you omitted...."The only safe way to drive is being sober ".

Be truthful now KnC.
Do you act as arrogant and rude to people who have a different opinion to you if you are having a face to face discussion or only when hiding behind the safety of a computer screen as you seem incapable of writing a single post without insulting at least one person


Well, how can I put this in response to your sanctimonious question, or rather the start of the question.

I've never been tolerant of " fools and idiots" ( those advocating drinking and driving for example meet both criteria ) , those who have a perception of themselves as being somehow "important ", those who feel they have a right to impose their self perceived "authority" without fear of being contradicted....and those who are basically pretentious pillocks, accustomed to getting their own way and being fawned over by others. Invariably, but nor exclusively, they have right wing philosophies....strangely enough.

Normal people however, are fine.

If it's any consolation to you, I will be sending myself a new Christmas card this year....the last one is over 20 years old and needs replacing.
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Old 8th Dec 2014, 07:38
  #75 (permalink)  
 
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I guess that another question is: Could you pass the license test with 1,2 maybe 3 drinks in you? If you could, then you're no worse than a newly qualified driver.
the actual question, or problem is - you never know how the drinks work on you on that specific occasion (tired, food/no food, things like that). Therefore, if you have a glass of wine, you know that it's a risk. If the limit is not zero, it's not a risk.
And I'm not a pious person to never have risked. Still, it has to be zero.
Although drugs may be a more serious issue already. Harder to find out, too.


P.S if something happens, you'd certainly wish you were zero.
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Old 8th Dec 2014, 07:59
  #76 (permalink)  
 
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I think Probes makes a very valid point there, and certainly one of my reasons for 'no bottle before throttle' is that if I were involved in an accident and breathalysed, there could be no accusations of alcohol being a factor.

Some years ago I was stopped in a routine road-block near CPT, late at night, and asked to get out of the car. I stepped out and being naturally clumsy, tripped on the metal barrier conveniently placed by the traffic cop, who clearly wasn't a Mensa member, next to the car. I grabbed the door to steady myself and this to him was 'proof' that I was drunk. I let him make the accusation and was then arrested and taken for a blood test which proved ......... zero.

The compensation I claimed from them for wrongful arrest was enough for a few good bottles of Stellenbosch's finest!
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Old 8th Dec 2014, 08:38
  #77 (permalink)  
 
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Oh the ignominity, or summat.

I actually agree with KnC......

It's hardly rocket science is it?
Going out, take an extra tenner for the cab home.

Live too far, then go with friends.

Have no friends? Either stay home and drink or take money for a cab.

I really do not want to meet you, pissed up behind the wheel.
Neither does anyone else.
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Old 8th Dec 2014, 09:12
  #78 (permalink)  
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I really do not want to meet you, pissed up behind the wheel.
Neither does anyone else.
Well seeing as the maximum I drink with a meal and then drive is 1 pint, you never will meet me "pissed up behind the wheel"
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Old 8th Dec 2014, 09:20
  #79 (permalink)  
 
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Oh the ignominity, or summat.

I actually agree with KnC......
I haven't read KnC's 'views' on this topic but if he supports no drinking then I too am in agreement with him.

This will no doubt cause him to change his view so that he can launch one of his childish and envious tirades against me, and he will probably trawl through my postings of the last 15 years and find somewhere where I said I'd driven home after a Tia Maria coffee or a half of shandy, thus proving I'm a liar, hypocrite, UKIP supporter, frog basher, EU hater and right wing fascist (all of which is true!)
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Old 8th Dec 2014, 10:18
  #80 (permalink)  
 
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I'm just waiting for Ayatolla Sturgeon to ban smoking; anywhere.
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