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MOH Recipients question

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MOH Recipients question

Old 30th Oct 2014, 19:16
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MOH Recipients question

Watching an episode of NCIS last night and there was a supposed Medal Of Honor recipient on it but as 3 Marines turned up to take him to jail the MOH was shown. Immediate salute rendered.

In addition he commented on that he got free flights everywhere

Would the salute be normal from Service personnel on meeting a MOH recipient ?

I say recipient because I now know you don't win MOH, you are awarded it.
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 19:35
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racedo:

ALL service members in uniform should render a salute to a MOH awardee. Although there is no military regulation requiring the action, it is customary in all service branches to do so.
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 19:44
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Thanks, it was the immediate rendering that was a surpise, NCIS is fiction but they do try and get their procedures correct i believe.

Just reading the Wiki page and guess something in the water in Pueblo, Colorado.

William J. Crawford - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 19:57
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Yup, 4 MoH awardees from Pueblo. I know Pueblo fairly well, as well as Colorado Springs. from my time stationed there with the US Army's 4th Infantry Division.

Must be that rarefied air from altitude!
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 20:05
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Days gone by.

I wrote this in another pilot's website.


Just sitting here, a bit bored I started thinking about the old days of airline travel, back when it was civilized.

Back in the day when one could smoke cigarettes on the airlines I was going to Washington DC, can't really remember the carrier now, I think it was American. For that matter, I can't remember why I was going to Washington either. Anyway, I was sitting back in the smoking section, the aircraft was about half full, a very common occurrence back then and there was an elderly gentleman sitting across the aisle from me. After the 'No Smoking' sign was turned off (yes young people, things like this happened back then) I lighted a cigarette and starred reading a book, then I smelled a cigar, oops. I look at the elderly gentleman across from me and saw he had just lit a cigar. Not wanting to see him get into trouble, I told him that he may get into trouble, as only cigarette smoking was allowed. He replied that he had seen and experienced a lot of trouble in his life and was not overly concerned about smoking a cigar.

Well, okay I thought, up to him. Sure enough, here comes a stewardess, that's what they were called back then, an older stewardess, that hasn't changed much today I've noticed.

"Sir, you cannot smoke a cigar on this airplane."

"Really, I'm in the smoking section."

"It says right here on this safety instructions card, that only cigarettes are allowed to be smoked. See, right here, 'NO CIGARS!', so put it out."

"Sorry, my eyes are not all that good anymore, can't read anything that small."

"I shall inform the CAPITAN of this, HE will be quite upset if he has to come back here and make you comply with instructions" Off she storms toward the front if the aircraft.

As usual, even back then I seldom missed an opportunity to keep me bleedin' mouth shut, that hasn't changed much either. "Sir, you might consider putting out that cigar, they'll make a terrible fuss."

He looked back at me, took a puff off of his cigar, blew the smoke up toward the ceiling of the cabin and said, "Well thank you for being concerned for me. But you know, I don't have much longer to live and I have been invited to Washington D.C. by the President of this here country of the United States of America. Going to visit the President in the White House, he's having a little get together for some of us that won a medal back in the war." Then he chuckled and continued, "That would be the Second World War, not the first, missed that one."

"Medal?"

He reached over to the seat next to him, opened up a briefcase, pulled out a thin dark blue box, opened it and showed what was inside. I don't think I had ever seen the actual Medal of Honor before. "Sir, I've never seen the Medal of Honor this close before." With that, without saying a word he handed me the box the Medal was in. It was heavier than I thought it would be and I swear to God I felt some kind of warmth emitting from the Medal.

"I really didn't deserve it, a lot of guys deserved it a lot more than I did, but President Roosevelt himself put this around my neck while I was in Walter Reed Hospital getting put back together again." As I handed the box back I saw the Captain coming down the aisle toward us. 'Oh crap' I thought, 'here it comes.'

The captain was in full uniform, hat and all. He was an old guy as well, course I was in my twenties, everybody looked old, but looking back I'm sure this captain was close to 60, had the wrinkles on his face and the gray hair to prove it. As he approached us I started to say something, but I got the 'look', the look senior captains give to young idiot pilots, I had this look given to me before, more than once, I kept my mouth shut. The old guy put closed the medal box and put it on top of the briefcase in the seat next to him.

"Sir, I'm going to ask you to put that cigar out, just once." This guy didn't fool around. My new older friend looked up at the captain and said, "I'd like to have a couple more puffs, if you don't mind?" I had a very strong impression from the captain that he would most certainly would mind. The captain started to speak again when he noticed the closed thin blue box in the briefcase. "Is that what I think it is?"

Again, I missed an excellent chance to keep my mouth shut. "Yes Captain, it is the Medal of Honor". Again with 'look', I'll never learn.

The elderly gentleman in the seat across from me looked at me and smiled, then he looked back up at the Capitan, reached over, got the box, opened it and handed it to the Captain. Then he reached back into the briefcase and pulled out a folder, "Here's the commendation if you'd care to read it Captain?"

The Captain handed back the medal, took the folder, opened it and read it. As he read it he would look at the guy every once in a while, then he handed it back to him and said, "Is it still Lieutenant sir?"

"No, no I made it to full chicken before I retired believe or not." He replied with a chuckle.

"Well Colonel sir, I'll tell you what, you go right ahead and smoke that cigar. If anybody gives you any grief over it, like that old battle ax stewardess who is my wife, tell them to come talk to me." with that, the Captain wiped his eyes and went back forward. Shortly later the 'old battle ax wife' came back, as friendly as possible and offered him a seat in first class. He looked at me and I said, "Hell sir, go for it."

"I think I will, nice meeting you young man," and off he went, trailing cigar smoke.

I never got to read that letter, wish I had.

Last edited by con-pilot; 31st Oct 2014 at 18:51.
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 20:48
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Con,
Great story, people like that are few and far between.
Waiting to be corrected, but I believe VC holders are accorded the same.
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 21:23
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CathayBrat;

VC holders are accorded the same honour, be they from British Australian or New Zealand forces.
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 21:36
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I believe the VC can be awarded to any nationality whereas the CMH is restricted to American Nationals,there was however one exception,the CMH was awarded to our Unknown Warrior and the VC was awarded to the American equivalent?
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Old 30th Oct 2014, 21:47
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Just reading the Wiki page and guess something in the water in Pueblo, Colorado.
I grew up around there - and it does have quite the military history. It's very 'blue collar' - there is a steel mill there and for a long time it was the primary employer in the area (as in ~10,000 employees in a community of ~100,000 people). The mill is still there but a small shadow of it's former self (and employment ).

Not only four MOH recipients, but if you recall the movie 'Patton' - a scene during the Battle of the Bulge - Patton asks a padre to write a prayer for good weather. In real life, that padre was from Pueblo - my dad knew him. When the movie first came out, the local TV station interviewed the real padre - he didn't care for how he was portrayed in the movie, thought he acted disrespectful by talking back to the general.
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 11:05
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ALL service members in uniform should render a salute to a MOH awardee. Although there is no military regulation requiring the action, it is customary in all service branches to do so.
As air pig stated this is also true for holders of the Victoria Cross. Just like the MOH, this is a custom and there is no regulation covering the practice. Mr Draper is correct - a well-known example of a foreign national receiving the VC is Corporal Schiess of the Natal Native Contingent who was a Swiss national and won his at Rorke's drift in 1879.

Great story Con-Pilot. I've never seen an MOH, it's a very pretty medal. Handled a few VCs, but never in the presence of the recipient, which is something entirely different.
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 11:30
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I believe there are only three men who have been awarded the VC twice.are there any double MOH recipients?
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 11:39
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Tony, Wiki has 19 double recipients listed.
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 11:49
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Wow.



P.S why was it ok to smoke cigarettes and not cigars?
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 12:05
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Probes-I think it was because of the smell. They are much stronger than cigarettes
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 12:16
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I love the smell of a Cigar,or a Pipe for that matter,sadly I always found they smelled better than they tasted.
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 12:30
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I'd agree with Mr.D (cigars and pipes smell better) - though not an expert on either. But thanks, Limeygal, anyway .
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 13:13
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Was never a ciggy fan at all, but smoked a pipe until 1985. Generally meerschaum pipes, but also a Hardcastle briar, and a Peterson. The Balkan Sobranie No. 759 Smoking Mixture was the baccy of choice. It's no longer produced, but tins are still appearing on fleabay at terrifying prices, and some tobacconists are producing blends close to #759.

I have my great-grandfather's pipe with which he was presented after returning from the Boer war. Regimental crest engraved in the briar, with his name and his years of service. I think it may also be a Hardcastle.

If you stuck a pipe, a tin of #759 and a box of matches in front of you, I'd light up immediately.
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 14:52
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con:

There must be a lot of dust particles in the air today because after reading your splendid story my eyes have been watering. I'm sure the old guy who was the subject of your story has gone on now but I shall endeavor to render a virtual salute in his memory.
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 18:45
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I've been reading up on the MOH today with regard to double awards. I haven't been able to discover whether these men were given a second medal, or was there some form of second award bar, such as that which the three double award recipients of the Victoria Cross received. Does anyone know the answer to that one?

I have however discovered that the recipients of the MOH do not have to be US citizens, but they do have to be serving in the US armed forces at the time of the action.
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Old 31st Oct 2014, 18:50
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In the history of the United States Armed forces the MoH has been awarded twice to 19 men.
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