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Meanwhile .. back in the Good 'ol NK ....

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Meanwhile .. back in the Good 'ol NK ....

Old 15th May 2018, 22:32
  #2261 (permalink)  
 
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Grandstanding.
NK is in a very hard place at the moment and stuck in between a few other hard places.
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Old 16th May 2018, 05:43
  #2262 (permalink)  
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North Korea threatens to cancel Trump summit - BBC News
"We shed light on the quality of Bolton already in the past, and we do not hide our feeling of repugnance towards him," said Kim Kye-gwan.


No wonder....
he suggested North Korea could follow a Libyan model of nuclear disarmament, a model many analysts say will have alarmed the North considering the fate of the Libyan leadership.
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Old 16th May 2018, 06:37
  #2263 (permalink)  
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NK will never give up their nukes. I've got a feeling that in this age of 'knee jerk' diplomacy that there won't be a summit in Singapore after all.
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Old 16th May 2018, 07:43
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I think Bolton does scare them. He has made no secret of wishing for regime change in NK as well as Iran and there is no indication that he is bluffing. He has stated somewhat recently that he wishes the talks to be completed so that things can move along. What this means is not that hard to decipher.

I would think that the Kim family can draw some solace from the rumblings that the U.S. will end up striking Iran. It sure seems they wish to but who knows? Speculation is not worth much but I can see why it is believable. No way Trump would go after two targets...right?
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Old 16th May 2018, 08:14
  #2265 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by TWT View Post
NK will never give up their nukes. I've got a feeling that in this age of 'knee jerk' diplomacy that there won't be a summit in Singapore after all.
Aside from the Libya reference, which clearly illustrates Trump's negotiating "team" has their heads up their asses, after witnessing Trump's unceremonious shredding of our agreement with Iran, Mr. Kim would have to be a real rube, a mark, an easy target (as they say down at the mobile home estates sales office, shady used car or the Trump Tower Executive Sales Suite) to agree to give up his nuclear program - particularly for this gang of bozos.

He will no doubt play along, but I would be willing to bet a dollar to a donut that nothing concrete comes out of this charade, and if there is something offered, what little concrete does manage to fall out, will be the irradiated structure of an already knackered test site Kim is willing to "give up" along with some empty promises.
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Old 16th May 2018, 09:09
  #2266 (permalink)  
 
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Having Trump come to visit him not so far from his home is a great coup for the FatWun.
It's an achievement in itself and he doesn't need to make concessions.
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Old 16th May 2018, 09:48
  #2267 (permalink)  
 
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There are likely some dazed eyes in Foggy Bottom, if anyone's left down there. Meanwhile, the White House executive toilet should have a cliff notes version (15 words max) alongside the funny papers and the presidential tweeter:
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Old 16th May 2018, 10:58
  #2268 (permalink)  
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Ho hum, it's on, it's off, I'm not sure which one is the mad hatter here, either they are both off their rockers, or Trump is playing Le Fat Wun at his own unpredictable, incomprehensible game, making pacifying noises while upping his anti in the background. Just when the Fat Wun thought he was running the show, it appears that Trump is dealing off the bottom of the pack.



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Old 16th May 2018, 11:53
  #2269 (permalink)  
 
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Either way the world is on the sidelines watching this one. Who wouldn't wish to see a peaceful ratcheting down of tensions on the peninsula?

They are really zeroing in on Bolton. Odd that the fawning cup-bearers to Trump tout that "the left" (whatever that is) wishes to see Trump fail but that it is his NSA who spouts off about regime change and moving things along to the next step. If that is not wishing for failure I don't know what is.

I am surprised though that Kim is not laying low until he gets the photo op with Trump. It is clear that Trump is ready to throw the Japanese and others under the bus by not pressing for a restriction on mid-range rocketry so why not get him to go cap in hand to Singapore? Kim has everything to gain and almost nothing to lose.

Plus we know that since Pompeo did not realize that Kim is the last name the briefing books must be thin on content--no surprise there after the chopping that has been done at State. I doubt there is even anyone on the country desk any longer. Bolton, Pompeo, and Trump can handle matters so who needs SMEs or staff?
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Old 16th May 2018, 13:01
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Who on Earth coined the idiotic phrase "Libya model"? We can hardly blame Kim -or any political leader -for not signing up to a deal based on a model of blood-soaked anarchy whose former leader was speared to death in the street!
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Old 16th May 2018, 15:36
  #2271 (permalink)  
 
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At the end of the day I cannot see the NK leader and the high ranking military agreeing to any compromise. Just imagine if all the workers got a whiff of the REAL outside world and discovered that they had been taken for a ride over the last 70 years. The US think that all they need to do is go in and "help modernise" NK, they should know that Turkeys do not vote for Christmas.
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Old 16th May 2018, 16:40
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Just imagine if all the workers got a whiff of the REAL outside world and discovered that they had been taken for a ride over the last 70 years
when one is getting laid after a very long abstinence you don't think about recriminations for not getting any earlier.
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Old 16th May 2018, 16:56
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Originally Posted by denachtenmai View Post
Just imagine if all the workers got a whiff of the REAL outside world and discovered that they had been taken for a ride over the last 70 years.
From what I've heard, those living in NK do have some knowledge of the outside world. Although only around 25% of the population has electricity, those that live close enough to the border with SK do get to illicitly see and hear SK TV and radio and even connect to SK phone networks, using smuggled phones and SIM cards, I believe. There was also a lot of cross border commuting for a time at the Kaesong Industrial Complex, until it was shut down by NK, which must have led to a fair bit of chat about the different way of life in each country.

I'm pretty sure control in NK is as much by the massive influence of the military as it is by ignorance. NK has a population of around 25M people, with a total military personnel strength of around 4.8M men and 5.2M women. With that proportion of the population in the military, I would think that's the primary way of ensuring no one steps out of line.
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Old 16th May 2018, 17:57
  #2274 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by VP959 View Post
NK has a population of around 25M people, with a total military personnel strength of around 4.8M men and 5.2M women. With that proportion of the population in the military, I would think that's the primary way of ensuring no one steps out of line.
40% of the population in the military . . .
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Old 16th May 2018, 18:23
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If they were really serious about this whole farce, tomorrow morning we would see half the total military personnel strength of around 10m people out there clearing the estimated
3 Million landmines and blowing up a few thousand tank traps on the border with the S. Koreans and Americans helping,
all with big smiles on their faces.
More of a goodwill gesture than changing some clocks.
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Old 16th May 2018, 19:41
  #2276 (permalink)  
 
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@G-CPTN Not sure if you are familiar with the theoretical model of "the warfare state" but NK is one of the better examples of it. Knew a PHD who did an interesting study of how the theoretical model, which bound permanent revolution (Marx) with a warfare state (Stalin) had a damaging impact on the Soviet Union (to include their rejecting the offer of the Marshall Plan).

I agree with meadowrun: clearing the minefields would be a huge sign of peace breaking out.

Last edited by Lonewolf_50; 16th May 2018 at 20:03.
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Old 16th May 2018, 20:29
  #2277 (permalink)  
 
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I'm pretty sure control in NK is as much by the massive influence of the military as it is by ignorance
Exactly, as I said, turkeys etc.
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Old 16th May 2018, 22:34
  #2278 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by ShotOne View Post
Who on Earth coined the idiotic phrase "Libya model"? We can hardly blame Kim -or any political leader -for not signing up to a deal based on a model of blood-soaked anarchy whose former leader was speared to death in the street!

Agreed, I was dumbfounded that someone would reference Libya.
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Old 16th May 2018, 22:49
  #2279 (permalink)  
 
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I think Bolton knew exactly what he was doing when he invoked Libya. I think he also knew that it would fire a rather powerful torpedo into the proceedings. If his intent is to derail any progress he seems to be taking the right steps. I have thoughts of a loose cannon rolling around the deck.
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Old 17th May 2018, 14:00
  #2280 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Uncle Fred View Post
I think Bolton knew exactly what he was doing when he invoked Libya. I think he also knew that it would fire a rather powerful torpedo into the proceedings. If his intent is to derail any progress he seems to be taking the right steps. I have thoughts of a loose cannon rolling around the deck.
Let's be cynical for a moment: Trump hires Bolton knowing that the guy is an in-fighter/operator. Bolton tosses a few rocks in the pond that raises the stakes, and then the meeting goes south, and Trump can say "hey, it wasn't me who backed out" when the summit dies, stillborn ... not putting it past him.
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