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War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original

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War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original

Old 20th Aug 2015, 12:49
  #18421 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Back too the hot bits again
Posts: 78
The plot thickens,
Captain Calamity appointed Ms Jacksons husband into Fair Work Australia back when he was a minister in Howards reign.
Wont even mention the blinding reference for Father Nestor the priest struck off the vatican clergy list for child abuse.
Is there a pattern forming here?
Ethel the Aardvark is offline  
Old 20th Aug 2015, 13:42
  #18422 (permalink)  
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Derbyshire, England.
Posts: 4,055
If there were a prize to be awarded for gathering together a bunch of unrelated threads and trying to make a story out of it then Ethyl must surely take the prize, yes? Ah, sorry, forgot, there are already several hundred second rate journos out there who spend their entire life trying to do just that.
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Old 20th Aug 2015, 13:49
  #18423 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: All over the Planet
Posts: 776
Para,

Surely 'the sum of the parts' has some meaning? I think it's more than fair to say that Abbott has been responsible (?) for a number of what could be rightly described as 'curious' or even 'dumb' decisions. Quite a few have delivered outcomes that reflect very poorly on his judgement for which the Australian people must now pay.
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Old 20th Aug 2015, 14:32
  #18424 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Back too the hot bits again
Posts: 78
Come on Belly, you are not following the party line, you are only supposed to say " the cabinet is in spiffing shape and even if Sen Abetz suggests that they are all a bunch of gutless wonders i do not agree"
Ethel the Aardvark is offline  
Old 20th Aug 2015, 14:38
  #18425 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Posts: 2,975
With Ethel's last post, I am completely lost now.
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Old 20th Aug 2015, 20:46
  #18426 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: ...
Posts: 21
SOPS, you've uncovered Ethel's reason for being here - to throw red herrings into any debate even mildly critical of Shorten or Labor in the hope that respondents will go off on a tangent and onto something - anything - but the subject in hand.

And all too often, it works.
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Old 20th Aug 2015, 22:54
  #18427 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 2,179
"Attacking Dyson Heydon is an attempt to change the subject which Labor and the union movement are desperate to do. What has already been dug up and placed before the public is astonishing..."

The left judges others by the standards it sets for itself | Catallaxy Files










.
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 04:03
  #18428 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Schofields
Posts: 61
I'm not disagreeing with you. As far as I'm concerned trade unions should be far dirtier a word than they are. People think of unions and they still think of the Eureka Stockade and standing up for workers unfairly dismissed - instead of extortion and corruption and other things you normally associate with your local mafia

All I'm saying is that if you're a rusted on, you'll selectively ignore or dismiss or somehow rationalise evidence that contradicts your views. In the case of of rusted on Laborites, that means not paying attention to the TURC "because it's a witch hunt against people who want better conditions and they are targeting the few bad eggs that exist in every large group of people to make unions look bad"
Chuboy - these comments seem out of place with your previous opinions and political leanings. Has your account been hijacked?
PinkusDickus is offline  
Old 21st Aug 2015, 05:06
  #18429 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: BNE, Australia
Posts: 275
Not at all. I don't recall at time whenever I have posted vocally in support of unions?

I can see how you might consider me to be a Labor voter because I don't sympathise with the socially conservative views that are typically expressed here. But frankly I am not a fan of the union influence in Labor. Sometimes the stuff you hear of the backstage manipulation by the union puppeteers leaves you aghast thinking "why isn't that illegal" until you remember that the Labor party is the frequently in government and they make the rules. Throw in a bit of propoganda about standing up for the little guy and it all leaves a bit of a bitter taste in one's mouth.

I suppose you could say I would fit in with the Labor Left, e.g. Rudd and Alabanese. But honestly I am also not so comfortable with many of the business/economics policy philosophies Labor have. I prefer the LNP in that respect, but then that means also tacitly accepting the archaic views of the "LNP right", e.g. Abetz, Abbott, Pyne. Not something I am comfortable with either. Do I want to be affiliated with the union mafiose in Labor or the comically-right-wing "grumpy old white men" of the Liberal party?

As for the Greens, much the same. While I align with many of their social philosophies (such as drug legalisation, SSM), at the same time I also have to consider their downright ridiculous energy policy and overall anti-development bias (though it has gotten better since the 80s). Also the socialist/anti-capitalist policies are not particularly to my taste, and generally as someone who works in the resource industry it's hard to reconcile the cognitive dissonance in agreeing with the Greens on any point

On balance, I don't think I really fit neatly into any of the three major parties. I used to think Malcolm Turnbull would be my favourite politician because he was a pragmatic, business-oriented person while still maintaining a social conscience. But as Communications Minister, in the face of mountains of data to make a rational decision to get a mismanaged project back on track, he went ahead and sold out the country with a second rate NBN that will leave us all worse off in the end - so I can't even truthfully say I like him.

As for how I'll vote at the next election, well at this rate it will probably involve a handful of darts and a roulette wheel
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 05:19
  #18430 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Darwin, NT, Australia
Posts: 731
On balance, I don't think I really fit neatly into any of the three major parties
Not at all a bad place to be.
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 05:42
  #18431 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀
Posts: 1,960
And herein lies the issue in Australian politics in this day and age. When you approach the polling booth and have to make a decision, what do you do when they are all as bad as each other?

Most here will tick the same box that they always have, and probably their fathers before them. I'm too independant of mind to fall for that stupidity. Tony Abbott is as far from Menzies as Bill Shorten is from Whitlam. 'History' has no place in deciding government, too many things have changed at party level.
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 06:51
  #18432 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Back too the hot bits again
Posts: 78
if the polls in the Perth by election continue at a 10% swing away from the libs then we wont have to worry about captain chaos anymore!!
Ethel the Aardvark is offline  
Old 21st Aug 2015, 07:13
  #18433 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Australia
Posts: 543
chuboy, as hard as you may find it to believe, I sympathise with much of what you say. I sometimes think Christopher Pyne is a Labor Party secret weapon, for I'm sure the Libs lose a truck full of swinging voters every time he appears on camera. In one prissy, overly pompous package, he is everything I hate about the silver spoon 'born to rule' segment of the Liberal Party.

One comment in your post brought me up short. Your comment about the Greens energy policy and attitude to development where you say
(though it has gotten better since the 80s).
Has it? What were they espousing in the 80s, mandatory loin cloths and everyone living strictly in caves and absolutely no camp fires?
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 07:57
  #18434 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
Posts: 395
Not at all. I don't recall at time whenever I have posted vocally in support of unions?

I can see how you might consider me to be a Labor voter because I don't sympathise with the socially conservative views that are typically expressed here. But frankly I am not a fan of the union influence in Labor. Sometimes the stuff you hear of the backstage manipulation by the union puppeteers leaves you aghast thinking "why isn't that illegal" until you remember that the Labor party is the frequently in government and they make the rules. Throw in a bit of propoganda about standing up for the little guy and it all leaves a bit of a bitter taste in one's mouth.

I suppose you could say I would fit in with the Labor Left, e.g. Rudd and Alabanese. But honestly I am also not so comfortable with many of the business/economics policy philosophies Labor have. I prefer the LNP in that respect, but then that means also tacitly accepting the archaic views of the "LNP right", e.g. Abetz, Abbott, Pyne. Not something I am comfortable with either. Do I want to be affiliated with the union mafiose in Labor or the comically-right-wing "grumpy old white men" of the Liberal party?

As for the Greens, much the same. While I align with many of their social philosophies (such as drug legalisation, SSM), at the same time I also have to consider their downright ridiculous energy policy and overall anti-development bias (though it has gotten better since the 80s). Also the socialist/anti-capitalist policies are not particularly to my taste, and generally as someone who works in the resource industry it's hard to reconcile the cognitive dissonance in agreeing with the Greens on any point

On balance, I don't think I really fit neatly into any of the three major parties. I used to think Malcolm Turnbull would be my favourite politician because he was a pragmatic, business-oriented person while still maintaining a social conscience. But as Communications Minister, in the face of mountains of data to make a rational decision to get a mismanaged project back on track, he went ahead and sold out the country with a second rate NBN that will leave us all worse off in the end - so I can't even truthfully say I like him.

As for how I'll vote at the next election, well at this rate it will probably involve a handful of darts and a roulette wheel
Pinkus simply asked had your account been hijacked.........
Ovation is offline  
Old 21st Aug 2015, 08:38
  #18435 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Sunny side up
Posts: 1,207
I suppose you could say I would fit in with the Labor Left, e.g. Rudd and Alabanese.
Point of order (because I am a geek ); Rudd was not Left, he was unaffiliated.
I sometimes think Christopher Pyne is a Labor Party secret weapon, for I'm sure the Libs lose a truck full of swinging voters every time he appears on camera. In one prissy, overly pompous package, he is everything I hate about the silver spoon 'born to rule' segment of the Liberal Party.
Got him in one!
Chuboy; true swinging voter. I was one of those for years...but I think I'm older than you are. At least you're thinking about the issues and policies. If more people thought about politics and voted rationally after considering each side's proposal, we'd have better politicians and fewer spin-meisters feeding crap to the electorate.

Too many smart people are throwing their hands in the air and declaring 'they all suck' (which all too often is 100% correct) without considering that their collective apathy is a big part of the problem, and leads to even worse politicians and political parties. If it comes up in conversation and you tell the average person that you're interested in politics, you get a similar reaction to telling them you've found (or never lost ) God. Most of the time they start edging away and changing the subject...

Last edited by Worrals in the wilds; 21st Aug 2015 at 09:21.
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 09:38
  #18436 (permalink)  
short flights long nights
 
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Even I agree about Pyne, and that is saying something! I think thre Libs should ban him from any media platform what-so-ever.
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 10:01
  #18437 (permalink)  
410
 
Join Date: Dec 1998
Posts: 137
Am I then only one horrified that the guvvimet looks like plunging our RAAF F18 aircrew deeper into the ISIS morass? Just once, I'd like to see them reply to the Yanks "Not this time. We don't consider that to be in our national interest.")
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 12:49
  #18438 (permalink)  
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Derbyshire, England.
Posts: 4,055
I think you would be wrong 410. ISIS is everyone's problem, there is no abdication, terrorism now has international tentacles so it's geographical centre is really irrelevant.
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Old 21st Aug 2015, 13:02
  #18439 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Back too the hot bits again
Posts: 78
I wonder if all the american hardware that ISIS are using was loaned or gifted.
Did al-Assad invite Australia to bomb Syria by any chance?
Ethel the Aardvark is offline  
Old 21st Aug 2015, 22:53
  #18440 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Location: Australia
Posts: 543
Parabellum, if
ISIS is everyone's problem,
, why is our government doing everything it can to keep their recruits here in Australia - free to roam the streets (and doubtless claim Centrelink payments) - and not locking them up for the duration of this "war" we're told we're fighting?

If we'd fought WW2 in the same way we're "fighting" this current war (that we're all assured is very, VERY serious), the Japanese would have shipped their troops in by cruise ship and our social services would have been at Circular Quay handing them meal vouchers, a living allowance and motel room keys for the duration of their stay.
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