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War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original

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War in Australia (any Oz Politics): the Original

Old 16th Nov 2013, 05:34
  #9381 (permalink)  
 
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OK, I'll accept that this one is so old it has whiskers on it, but with a few minor amendments, I think very few would disagree that it could definitely be said to apply to Australian politics, perhaps particularly the last six years.

A female CNN journalist heard about a very old Jewish man who had been going to the Western Wall to pray, twice a day, every day, for a long, long time.

So she went to check it out. She went to the Western Wall and there he was, walking slowly up to the holy site.

She watched him pray and after about 45 minutes, when he turned to leave, using a cane and moving very slowly, she approached him for an interview.

"Pardon me, sir, I'm Rebecca Smith from CNN. What's your name?

"Morris Feinberg," he replied.

"Sir, how long have you been coming to the Western Wall and praying?"

"For about 60 years."

"60 years! That's amazing! What do you pray for?"

"I pray for peace between the Christians, Jews and the Muslims."

"I pray for all the wars and all the hatred to stop."

"I pray for all our children to grow up safely as responsible adults and to love their fellow man."

"I pray that politicians tell us the truth and put the interests of the people ahead of their own interests."

"How do you feel after doing this for 60 years?"

"Like I'm talking to a f----g brick wall."
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Old 16th Nov 2013, 05:56
  #9382 (permalink)  
 
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Hedley Thomas' article in today's 'Australian' about JEG's attempts to muzzle the press while she was PM is causing quite a bit of comment online. Some of the comments on Michael Smith's site are quite long. This one stood out to me.

Kymbo said...
The AWU Reform Association "slush fund" and the role of Slater and Gordon, the young and naive solicitor, the AWU, Thiess Constructions and many others is intriguing and worthy of a proper investigation to determine the extent if any of criminality, corruption or complicity.
Circumstantial evidence presented on this blog and by Hedley Thomas in the Australian indicates that there may have been serious misappropriation of funds and a cover up of monumental proportions.
Let's hope that justice is done.

With all the justified focus on the slush fund, the conveyancing, the missing files and the exit interview, one thing has really worried me.

If Julia Gillard did something wrong and if the AWU, Slater and Gordon and many of her colleagues new that she did that wrong, aren't we entitled to think that the AWU had her over a barrel because of that knowledge and wouldn't any changes to Fair Work and her Industrial relations policy be assumed to be not just because of Union pressure but also because of her compromised position. The AWU could essentially demand what they wanted.

Of course the corollary is that if they knew that she did wrong, then she could also demand their support and if they didn't support her she could bring the Union to its knees. The knifing of Kevin Rudd, fits this conspiracy theory. If this is the case it would be a monumental blow to our democracy and set Australia back 20 years.

If there is guilt, then surely we would have to then assume that the whole 3 years of her Government (and perhaps her period as Deputy PM) may have been substantially compromised.

Under these circumstances one wonders if any Fair Work or Industrial relations legislation introduced during her term, should not be made null and void. I certainly think that Tony Abbott could call a double dissolution of Parliament to reverse the Fair Work Legislation if guilt is proven.

To round this off and assuming only guilt and complicity (both reasonable expectations) then our media will have failed us all. They could no longer claim the honored status as" the third estate". An impartial media would have assumed the same possibility as outlined above and given the enormous gravity of that situation, pressured the Prime Minister to stand down pending an investigation.

Let's hope she did nothing wrong, because it makes me sick that our Country may have been compromised to this extent.
The most important thing you'll read today. Hedley Thomas on our most important freedom. - Michael Smith News
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Old 16th Nov 2013, 09:08
  #9383 (permalink)  
 
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On the subject of muzzling the press....does anyone know what the situation is with the boats?? I posted a while back, to a deafening silence, the Michael Smith guy often quoted here as giving a running commentary on all of it as it unfolded.....is unheard of now??? Who was / is he?

But now we have Scott Morrison, selectively releasing information only as he sees fit, and an ever compliant MSM accepting this....any difficult questions being batted away with a 'Can't comment for operational reasons'.....I can understand that......but by highlighting every detail possible whilst in opposition, effectively Scott was committing a treasonous act whilst in opposition.....don't hold your breath expecting the complaint MSM to ever properly question him!
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Old 16th Nov 2013, 23:11
  #9384 (permalink)  
 
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An interesting spin from Peter Van Olsenen on who is really to blame for labor's current woes - and it isn't Gillard and nor is it Rudd!

Peter van Onselen writes:-
SHORTEN SHARP END FOR RUDD


KEVIN Rudd's decision to retire from politics is an opportunity to reflect on who is really to blame for Labor's problems in government: Rudd or Julia Gillard. What about neither? The man who thumbed his nose at history, good graces and everything that makes governments build momentum soon after being elected was Bill Shorten. For it was he who orchestrated the removal of Rudd in the first place, before deciding to correct his mistake and put him back in the top job at five minutes to midnight. I do not doubt Rudd was a difficult PM, even downright awful to work with (or for). He may even have lost the 2010 election, who knows. Frankly it would have been better for Labor's brand given the last three years if it had. Whatever Rudd's character flaws the root of Labor's failure came from knifing a first-term PM. Everything else might have been fixable. Rudd might have left the parliament but Shorten remains, as leader no less. And in my view he was (and is) the real problem.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 00:50
  #9385 (permalink)  
 
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Andrew Bolt dropped a rather pointed hint on his show this morning that Rudd's electorate may not be the last Labor ex-minister's electorate to be facing a by-election in the near future.

It will be interesting to see if he's simply flying a kite or whether he's privy to some inside information.

A number of names spring to mind, Wayne Swan being at the top of the list - although recent rumours, if true, put Bill Shorten somewhat implausibly in the mix as well.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 01:45
  #9386 (permalink)  
7x7
 
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Here's the latest offering in the "you couldn't make this up" list...

Aboriginality as a Profession ? Quadrant Online

Aboriginality as a Profession

"In Kulgera, I heard the view expressed that Aboriginal elders effectively fulfill the same role as judges in mainstream courts, and therefore should be paid at the same rate as magistrates"

In my dealings with Aboriginal people, doing drilling clearances and the like, I increasingly find that a new meme is taking hold. There is an alternative, parallel agenda moving in the opposite direction to the one advocated as a solution to resolving Indigenous disadvantage, viz. real employment. Aboriginal people are increasingly being “taught” that they are not required to work, not required to integrate, and have no need for a formal education.

For example, Aborigines tell me, that just being Indigenous person is a full time job:

“I do traditional fishing three days a week!”


and, since it is specialist work which non-Indigenous people cannot do, they should be remunerated as professionals. I have even heard suggestions that different levels of initiation should be equated with defined remuneration levels (rather like public servants – Aborigine, Grade 1; Aborigine, Grade 2; etc.) It appears that the good intentions of the new Pearson/Mundine strategy are already being undermined.

In Kulgera, I heard the view expressed that Aboriginal elders effectively fulfill the same role as judges in mainstream courts, and therefore should be paid at the same rate as judges (with a car, no less). There is some traditional support for this in the payment of Tjaurilja meat, traditionally food paid to elders in payment for performing sacred ceremonies and the like.

PART I OF THIS THREE-PART SERIES CAN BE FOUND HERE

I have heard women say that when they teach their children to speak their Indigenous language, they should receive a wage at the same scale as a specialist language teacher in the non-Indigenous community. After all, they are specialist language teachers so why should they not be paid to teach their children these specialist languages? I’m not sure that this process is not already underway. It is only a small step away from the publicly-funded, make-work projects that seem to proliferate in the communities.

“The eight Anangu women from the Anangu Pitjantjatjara Yankunytjatjara Lands received their qualifications yesterday, and can now teach in classrooms in South Australia’s remote northwestern communities. …

“We want to help them be strong in Pitjantjatjara with reading and writing,” she said. “English is a second language and they are losing Pitjantjatjara. We want to see Anangu teachers take over the classes, it is very important for cultural classes as well.

Just to complete the picture Martin adds:

“Census data reveals that 40 per cent of children in Anangu schools do not speak English well, or at all, despite it being the primary teaching language.”

It remains to be seen how promoting Pitjantjatjara as a first language when 40% of students “do not speak English well, or at all” will enable students to find work other than, say, as Pitjantjatjara teachers. Or perhaps as rangers

“The girls laugh and tell us that the job of the (indigenous) rangers’ is driving around Wangupeni in their four-wheeled drives whenever they have fuel. … I know that the literacy and numeracy skills of Charlotte’s and Margaret’s uniformed Ranger brothers, cousins and uncles are as limited as theirs. They cannot perform any tasks necessitating measurement, spraying noxious weeds with chemicals, or controlling feral animals.”

This new meme is being driven primarily by “progressive” attitudes which constantly re-enforce the importance of Indigenous culture, the importance of customary law, and that, because of dispossession by Europeans, they are “owed” reparations. Writing in Quadrant in 2008, Patrick McCauley identified the white bureaucracy as the main source of this reinforcement, the very same white bureaucracy expected to implement Pearson’s changes.

“The Aboriginal leaders are painfully consumed in an uneducated anger fed by misinformation and ideological groupspeak, reinforced by the vast majority of public servants and teachers who are allowed into the community.”

McCauley cites examples from Wadeye; the one below illustrative of how the bureaucracy reinforces the sense of Indigenous self-worth, even at the expense of the educative function of the schools:

“She [the most influential teacher at the school] informs me that English is not the first language of this country, and we have no right to expect these (Indigenous) kids to speak English at school.”

How all this is to fit with the Pearson/Mundine agenda has not been addressed.

On top of this, I am aware of accusations against at least one community said to be using its “gated” status to deny access by labour-hire companies in order to prevent young men leaving. Even so, increasingly, it appears to me Indigenous men and women who are capable and willing to work have already left the communities, and it is those advocating “entitlement” who remain behind. Those, like Stephen Hagan or my Indigenous co-worker, who try to juggle the two — work and community life — have a very hard time of it.

The urban elites advocating the Pearson/Mundine agenda for remote communities are talking at cross purposes. This is exemplified by the 2012, Australia Day, race riot in Canberra, and the somewhat shocked response on display amongst the Indigenous urban leadership to this raw militancy. This militancy also is reflected in the remote communities as the growing sense of “passive revolution”, referred to by McCauley, suggesting that there is little inclination to take part in the new agenda of individual responsibility now being proposed. The urban leadership group believe they own the debate, but there is an undercurrent among the remote communities that is heading a different direction and over which the urban elites have no control.

Effectively, significant numbers, especially in the remote communities, want “sit down money” to become a permanent professional career option, paid for out of the public purse.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 02:02
  #9387 (permalink)  
 
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That would be about right.

They are surrounded by food (fish, animals, plants), they have vehicles to travel but don't seem to spend a huge amount of time hunting and gathering or passing the information of how to onto the children.

One person I know, an excellent hunter / gatherer, is the focus of people's attention when it comes to wanting to go out bush. But the situation never changes, they don't seem to go out by themselves much, always wanting her to go with them.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 03:27
  #9388 (permalink)  
 
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On the subject of muzzling the press....does anyone know what the situation is with the boats?? I posted a while back, to a deafening silence, the Michael Smith guy often quoted here as giving a running commentary on all of it as it unfolded.....is unheard of now??? Who was / is he?

But now we have Scott Morrison, selectively releasing information only as he sees fit, and an ever compliant MSM accepting this....any difficult questions being batted away with a 'Can't comment for operational reasons'.....I can understand that......but by highlighting every detail possible whilst in opposition, effectively Scott was committing a treasonous act whilst in opposition.....don't hold your breath expecting the complaint MSM to ever properly question him!
Big difference between muzzling the media (as a recent PM was attempting to do in order to cover their tracks) and not spoon-feeding them. And yes, the details of how the government is dealing with ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS is operational information.
As for 'an ever compliant MSM', you must be referring to compliance with whatever drivel the Liarbour Pardee is doling out this week. However having said that I will concede that this weekend's Australian certainly sunk the boot into Dullard and KRudd. Deservedly so, I might add.
I for one will keeping a keen ear to the ground to see what progress the Victorian police make with a certain case between now and end of the year. Will we see a recent PM take a sudden and open-ended overseas holiday perhaps?
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 03:37
  #9389 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Captain Sand Dune View Post
Big difference between muzzling the media (as a recent PM was attempting to do in order to cover their tracks) and not spoon-feeding them. And yes, the details of how the government is dealing with ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS is operational information.
If you want to draw that bow you might as well say the government isn't obliged to tell us anything.

Nothing wrong with that, I suppose. People seem satisifed in North Korea.

I for one would like to know the reality of whether the government's policies are working and its promises being kept.

By the way, there is difference between not spoon feeding the media and refusing to divulge any information whatsoever. As in, when journalists make active attempts to access the information they need through Freedom of Information (something which you might conclude, reading only the comments in this thread, doesn't happen often enough), their requests are ignored and/or rejected without grounds.

Being "compliant" with this attitude from a government that purports to be transparent is not the behaviour I would expect from any rational person.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 03:50
  #9390 (permalink)  
 
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The media uses FOI requests because they can't or don't build the relationships
with the people (Gov't) that they used to. It's a "I'll scratch your back, you scratch mine" situation and they do get good inside info and can publish it when they want if they have good r'ships. Just look at Laurie Oakes.

They just don't have the skills to do it anymore.

The MSM are a bunch of wankers that just regurgitate anything anyway.
The term "investigative" journalism is long gone.

So they don't deserve it.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 04:52
  #9391 (permalink)  
 
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Well it says a lot then that even Laurie Oakes has little to report on the government's progress so far. He said himself that the government is being too tight-lipped in their business, so which is it?
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 04:55
  #9392 (permalink)  
 
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My work calendar popped up a reminder last week, '100 days', 'twas sumpin' about boats having been stopped by then, 100 days since election perhaps....instead we're getting avoidance by saying 'Operational information', well sure it is, I understand that, but in opposition the member for Cook couldn't help but scream out to the country shoppers 'come on down!' loud enough. Just sayin'
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 08:02
  #9393 (permalink)  
 
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As for 'an ever compliant MSM', you must be referring to compliance with whatever drivel the Liarbour Pardee is doling out this week.
I suspect that Fliegs and I read the same Murdoch paper that's based in Brisbane. It has been rampantly pro-LNP federally since the federal election was first speculated about, and rampantly state pro-LNP when it comes to supporting lots of new 'because the AG says, and you Look Funny' laws that have many lawyers and judges (even those of whom are card-carrying members of the LNP) concerned.

I agree that Gillard/Roxon tried to muzzle the media and I think hindsight will show that to be one of their most fundamental errors. However, in recent times (and it used to be Labor biassed if anything ) IMO Brisbane's Courier Mail has become nothing more than a mouthpiece and fanzine for the LNP state government.

They recently ran a picture on page 2 of Premier Newman standing next to Rupert Murdoch. I was tempted to re-post it on Facebook with the caption 'owner of the Courier Mail, pictured next to Rupert Murdoch.' Of course your own local Murdoch rag may be very different, but even several conservative SE Qlders I know are getting sick of the Courier's recent rampant bias and sychophantic reporting.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 17:53
  #9394 (permalink)  
 
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Fair nuff then. Being a Mexican I haven't read the Queensland papers for some time. The contrast between this weekend's Australian (reasonably balanced )and Age (somewhere left of Pravda) were quite remarkable.
Have heard the Harley dealerships are doing it tough up there though!
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 20:13
  #9395 (permalink)  
 
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I've heard that about the Age. Brisbane's problem is that it only has one major daily newspaper, so the competition is zero.
Have heard the Harley dealerships are doing it tough up there though!
True, but perveyors of Utes and Jap bikes are doing extremely well . It's beyond Newman's understanding, but apparently bikies are capable of using different forms of transport when required.

Meanwhile every respectable, Harely owning Easy Rider aspirant (in between meetings and golf of course ) is getting pulled over every hundred metres. Apparently it's achieving something...
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 23:23
  #9396 (permalink)  
 
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Worrals .... you should take the trouble to read the Age for a few weeks. All this talk, not by yourself but by others on this blog, about Murdoch pales into insignificance with what passes as news in that chip wrapper. Not that Murdoch's rags are much better, of course, but then they don't pretend to be.
I buy it each Sunday for the T.V. guide mainly but the letters page is a hoot. For some reason the majority of correspondents appear to live in the Eastern suburbs and their views are most definitely 'inner city left'.Abbott is evil, Liberals are evil, dams are evil, roads are evil, coal is evil, electricity is evil. You get the message ?
However ,given their addresses, most have a tram, or a train, running on electricity provided by a coal fired power station, placed very conveniently at the end of their street so they can all get off to their, probably tax payer funded sinecures, at some university or other where they can preach their mantras to the next generation of "thinkers".
Meanwhile the rest of us who have to work for a living and used to vote Labour have now decided to give another mob a chance. This may upset the luvvies out there but hey that's the system. It's called democracy.
And before anyone says that 'bogans' from the West don't write to the Age, well here's one who has, on numerous occasions, and I've never had an opinion published.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 23:38
  #9397 (permalink)  
 
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From the Australian

DEPUTY Opposition leader Tanya Plibersek has urged a full investigation into rape allegations against a senior Labor figure dating back 30 years. -
Looks like she's gunning for early promotion.
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Old 17th Nov 2013, 23:58
  #9398 (permalink)  
 
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I buy it each Sunday for the T.V. guide mainly but the letters page is a hoot. For some reason the majority of correspondents appear to live in the Eastern suburbs and their views are most definitely 'inner city left'.Abbott is evil, Liberals are evil, dams are evil, roads are evil, coal is evil, electricity is evil. You get the message ?
We should get those letter writers together in a room with the Courier Mail's regular letter writers, most of whom are firm advocates of jailing people without bothering with a trial, public floggings, taking fluoride out of the water supply and so on . It would be hilarious; we could sell tickets and do a live feed online .
Looks like she's gunning for early promotion.
There's not much else she can say though.
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Old 18th Nov 2013, 00:06
  #9399 (permalink)  
 
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Maybe Labor shouldn't have made such an issue of Abbott "punching a wall"

Am surprised she said that if it isn't in the MSM.
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Old 18th Nov 2013, 00:38
  #9400 (permalink)  
 
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Has the identity of the senior Labor leader Tanya wants investigated been confirmed anywhere apart from in online chat rooms?
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