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Queensland

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Queensland

Old 14th Jan 2011, 07:45
  #141 (permalink)  
 
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Ka-Boom...

What to say..

"...What wasn’t mentioned was the fact that for more than a week prior to this large release, only 170,000 ML/day was being released as the storage capacity was allowed to rise to 191% from two weeks of heavy rains...

...We need a full inquiry into why this dam managed by SEQ Water, and others managed by Sunwater, were managed in a way that actually produced the kind of flood it was designed to prevent..."

Brisbane?s Man-made Flood Peak? « JoNova


"...Senior engineering and hydrological sources, not authorised to comment on the record, told The Australian that investigations need to be conducted into the operations of Wivenhoe Dam, which had been forced to release massive volumes of water to reduce the risk of a catastrophic collapse.
They said there needed to be a thorough questioning of whether the decision to store as much water as possible leading into the wet season, and the subsequent sudden release of water, had contributed to flooding in Brisbane, and whether flooding could instead have been minimised..."

Brisbane flood peak passes, inquiry calls start | The Australian






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Last edited by Flying Binghi; 14th Jan 2011 at 08:38.
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 08:48
  #142 (permalink)  
1DC
 
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We are coming to Oz in February and i notice one of the threads mentions that Woolworth's are matching donations dollar for dollar.I was going to make a donation to the Red Cross from the UK but if the big companies are matching dollar for dollar i will wait until we arrive.
Anyone know if i can donate through Woolworths or others from Melbourne??
Hard times for you folks up there and i wish you all the best, at least you have the Aussie spirit and that counts for a lot..
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 08:58
  #143 (permalink)  
 
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Most major businesses are accepting donations, such as Coles, Woolies and all the major banks. I imagine they will be doing so for some time. Otherwise you can donate online to the Premier's Relief Fund at Donate to the flood relief appeal : Queensland Government or through the Red Cross. Thanks for the thought!
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 09:04
  #144 (permalink)  
 
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Woolies are matching dollar for dollar until next Thursday; Coles has donated a million dollars. Both are accepting donations in store.
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 09:09
  #145 (permalink)  
 
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@flying bhinghi. I'm not sure where the article you quoted gets it's info, but following the day by day levels theses are some of the facts: in the 3 weeks before last Friday the level was managed between 100 and 125% with the level on Friday at 9 am almost exactly 100%. 3 days later on Monday morning the level was 170% (100% = approx half the design capacity including flood storage) due to higher than forecast rains.

Monday afternoon Toowoomba was flooded, Monday the Bremer river catchment also received more than forecast rain. We were at Lake/Dam Moogerah that weekend observing the outflow. So to did Somerset Dam that flows into Wivenhoe. The Wivenhoe outflow was dramatically increased on Tuesday night to balance inflows but had to take consideration of the Bremer flows which were by then inevitably going to flood Ipswich, and tides for the week.

That was when the warnings started that Brissie would flood. Expert management kept the flood to the low level that it was. The hydrologist estimates were that without Wivenhoe and the management of the water flows the flood peak woul have been closer to 7 meters and not the 4.5 we had.

I'm posting from my iPad but can source the info for you later if you like.
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 09:39
  #146 (permalink)  
 
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I'm not sure where the article you quoted gets it's info
Interesting times ahead methinks...


Here's the Bolt overview - How prepared was the Wivenhoe dam for this flood? | Herald Sun Andrew Bolt Blog



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Old 14th Jan 2011, 09:46
  #147 (permalink)  
 
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The two questions that are being asked from the armchairs (some of them rather sodden armchairs) are...

1. Was keeping the dam at the nominal 100% wise, knowing that further heavy rain was likely, or would it have been better to drop to 75% or lower, given that a wet summer is almost assured and the drinking supply will be replenished? and

2. Were the Wivenhoe scientists allowed to act of their own volition in managing the level of the dam, or was there political interference for PR reasons? Only a month ago when they started staged releases, the TV media were full of Bozo On The Street opinions from the Q Street Mall with warbs whining about how they were 'wasting our drinking water' by staging releases. I guess all those bozos are now silent, but it's no secret that all governments are sensitive about bad PR and have been known to pressure the experts who make operational decisions whether in Parks, Emergency Services or dam management (two from personal experience ).
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 10:10
  #148 (permalink)  

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If you want to talk about political aspects of the disaster, do so on the Cane Toad Wheel.

Not here.
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 11:37
  #149 (permalink)  
 
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The management of the water level in the dam is mandated - when it goes over 100% 'full' the release is managed. What isn't mandated is the amount of rain that fell in the catchment area area between Friday and Monday. They could try and legislate for this, I guess, but I also guess mother nature has her own rules. I heartily agree with keeping the politics out of this thread.

For info, this is the rainfall map from Bureau Of Meteorology for the week ended 11 Jan. The whole of the Brisbane/SEQld catchment area received over 300mm of rain in this week, with substantial portions receiving over 400mm. What this doesn't show is the day-by-day falls, which were bunched towards the end of the week - Sat, Sun, Mon & Tues.

With this amount of rain over such a large area on already sodden ground there was going to be a flood. If you like you can google the area that this covered and calculate the water, and the flow into the run-off areas, but you can only come to one conclusion - there was going to be a flood. The only questions were exactly when, and could it be managed anywhere near the '74 levels. The fact it was managed almost 3 meters below the non-Wivenhoe estimate is a fantastic outcome:
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 11:41
  #150 (permalink)  
 
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Best keep JB Mods happy and take your post to the politics thread david1300, as thats what the flood is looking to be about - ill-informed political pressure.




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Old 14th Jan 2011, 11:43
  #151 (permalink)  
 
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BTW - I don't think I made it clear - the water mangement is not a political toy (and I am NOT a labor supporter - if I could blame the Qld govt in any way I would be over in the Hamster Wheel thread)

And here is a news report from Tuesday 11th. Note that some areas received 300mm in the previous 24 hours (ie - Monday10th), with widespread areas receiving 100mm and 200mm. As we say here, if someone believes the flood was added to by the Dam Management "tell them they're dreamin'"
Extreme rainfall for Southeast Queensland | news.com.au
Weather News


Extreme rainfall for Southeast Queensland

Micaela Weber
Tuesday January 11, 2011 12:13 EDT

Moist easterly winds, feeding into an upper level low and coastal trough over the east coast of Queensland, have been again causing heavy rainfall and storms in the last 24 hours.

The monsoon trough, which is dipping far south, is providing an increased moisture airflow towards eastern Australia. La Nina also enhances the moisture content in the atmosphere and is one of the reasons for the above average rainfall.

Yesterday, falls up to 300mm were recorded in only 24 hours around the Southeast.

A severe weather warning was issued for the Wide Bay and Burnett, Maranoa and Warrego, the Darling Downs and Granite Belt districts.

Rain slightly eased over flooded areas but again widespread 100 to 150mm fell in only 24 hours. Some parts even recorded falls up to 200mm overnight.

Toowoomba Airport recorded another 123mm, bringing their monthly total to 375mm, five times their monthly average. Maleny was only one of many other stations which recorded 133mm to 9am, bringing their total to 611mm, 335mm above their average.

The coastal trough is slightly weakening but unfortunately, further heavy showers and storms are expected today across the southeast with falls up to 100mm possible.

- Weatherzone

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Old 14th Jan 2011, 11:44
  #152 (permalink)  
 
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Looks like Brisbane may be in for an even bigger flood -

" The aboriginals have a tradition that once upon a time a flood rose so high that it broke over the banks of the Brisbane River, near the site of the Grey Street Bridge and flowed down through the old reservoir site and down over the site of the present Town Hall, thence flowing into Creek Street, which was an old tributary of the river. This would constitute the flood of history."

Pg 288, The Floods of the Brisbane River, Inigo Jones, July 28,1931.

http://espace.library.uq.edu.au/eser...35_2_6_288.pdf





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Old 14th Jan 2011, 11:48
  #153 (permalink)  
 
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Mods & all - If my posts do seem to have a 'political' content, this is unintentional, and happily move them to the Hamster Wheel thread. The intention is to try and give an understanding of the enormity of the issues facing the non-political decision makers. That level of rainfall is unprecedented, specially bearing in mind the already sodden soil, and I am very, very grateful to those making the decisions that they minimised the impact.

Now, back to my appreciation of some of the moments that have lightened my heart during this tough time - see next post.
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 11:59
  #154 (permalink)  
 
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A smart fox using his cunning to survive in the flood:

Fox outwits floods with tyre ride

Every creature tries to survive:


And some people say that the frog and the snake are forgetting their differences and working together in times of crises (just like the average Queenslander), others say the snake packed his lunch before he headed to the evacuation centre:
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 12:26
  #155 (permalink)  
 
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Creek street carried the old Wheat Creek, which flowed from the tower mill down to the river. It was culverted in the late 1800s to prevent cholera, one of Brisbane's first storm water drains. The 'old resovoir' is presumably the Roma Street (New street) wetlands which always had brackish water in them. This was the original water supply for the Brisbane colony and presumably the indigenous residents before that.
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 13:09
  #156 (permalink)  
 
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Mods & all - If my posts do seem to have a 'political' content, this is unintentional, and happily move them to the Hamster Wheel thread. The intention is to try and give an understanding of the enormity of the issues facing the non-political decision makers. That level of rainfall is unprecedented, specially bearing in mind the already sodden soil, and I am very, very grateful to those making the decisions that they minimised the impact.
"...That level of rainfall is unprecedented..."

That is incorrect david1300. A simple perusal of the BOM site offers a bit of history - Known Floods in the Brisbane & Bremer River Basin, including the Cities of Brisbane and Ipswich


"...The intention is to try and give an understanding of the enormity of the issues facing the non-political decision makers..."

IMO, SEQW did the best they could with what they were 'allowed' to do by the stakeholders. The government, and opposition, has probably done the best they could with the advice they received. Looking at what is coming out in the blogs and newspapers it is looking to me as though we can ultimately blame the incompetent advice the government has received.







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Old 14th Jan 2011, 14:47
  #157 (permalink)  
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I'm very interested in how our fellow non-human creatures also survived the great flooding. Thanks to david1300 for those pictures.

The original caption for this image from the BBC was "West of Brisbane, the city of Ipswich was swamped by floodwaters in a situation described as "total chaos". Here, a city resident is seen rescuing a kangaroo.":


Alternative caption: "Here, a city resident is seen with a kangaroo. Yep, he's coming home for supper. Our barbie's still dry, all Lobb St. residents are welcome...!"
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 16:25
  #158 (permalink)  
 
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Did the Brekkie Creek Hotel survive?

GF
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 16:51
  #159 (permalink)  
 
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I thought Roos were bigger than that.
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Old 14th Jan 2011, 17:36
  #160 (permalink)  

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They are.
It's either a young roo or a wallaby.
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