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UK politics - Hamsterwheel

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UK politics - Hamsterwheel

Old 10th Oct 2015, 08:30
  #6281 (permalink)  
Ecce Homo! Loquitur...
 
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Rod Liddle: Spittle is the only thing Labour has left The Spectator
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Old 10th Oct 2015, 08:50
  #6282 (permalink)  
 
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Liddle is always good for a chuckle and I think this rather illustrates the point quite well. I note the way Trossie jumped upon my half joking post about my failure to attend the birth of my son.

Now he has clearly accepted the late 20th century touchy feely agenda that has led from fathers being at the birth, through to banners strung across the road wishing Tracy or Darren a happy 40th and roadside shrines to dead erstwhile drivers of Honda Civic R's (Known in the trade as a "Tree Magnet")


So I accept that my failure to join in with the accepted ooolng and arring at the maternal bedside may rub him up the wrong way. I suspect however that his post was specked with typed spittle more because of his perception of me as a "Leftie". Rather undermines the theory that only the left hates people with different, albeit in my case mildly so, opinions.
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Old 10th Oct 2015, 09:45
  #6283 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Krystal n chips View Post
and to think, this lot were running the country at the time.
Let's think, Dodgy Dossier, David Kelly, 'Money is all gone' memo and to think Liabour were running the country at the time
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 08:11
  #6284 (permalink)  
 
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Effluent Man, Apologies if I hurt your feelings there, but you must admit that you left yourself wide open on that one!! It seemed too good a 'wind-up' opportunity to miss! You have admitted to 'left' leanings in the past but I was referring more to those on the extreme left trying to have a go at someone who was more occupied with the birth of his child. 'Typed spittle'? No, chuckles of delight as I typed that! (An interesting question: If the 26-year-old in question was to take part in a Civil War re-enactment, would he be a Cavalier or a Roundhead?)

Originally Posted by Krystal n chips
...and to think, this lot were running the country at the time.
Just think about the lot that were running the country before that and the mess that they made. Then there's the lot that were running the country after that and the mess that they made. Common theme? Labour. We never need to see them running (ruining?) the country again! But the Tom & Jerry team of Watson and Corbyn seem to be ensuring quite happily that they never ever have any chance of getting to run the country again.
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 15:47
  #6285 (permalink)  
 
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Trossie, I'm not a hurt feelings sort of person as Reggie Perrin's effete Son-in-Law might have said. I just don't do sentimental stuff, that probably puts me on some sort of scale, most likely the "Don't give a **** one". I was rather touched though that Andy S thought that I was a reasonable sort of fellow for a leftie.

I really don't buy into this Labour squandering money idea. My dad always used to say things like "Poor Mr.Wilson has to sort out the mess Reggie Maudling has left". If there is a valid economic argument for any of this I would say Maggie spent the oil money on unemployment benefit. I think we are still suffering for the over reliance on service industries. Maybe we could all make a living selling one another 5 cups of coffee. That's an interesting economic model.
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 20:08
  #6286 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post

I really don't buy into this Labour squandering money idea.
So you don't recall the infamous 'The money is all gone' memo?
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 20:43
  #6287 (permalink)  
 
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And your point is? Of course the money had all gone, Dave's banker pals had drained the coffers dry and moved the proceeds to various tropical tax havens leaving the option of letting the banks go bust (My favoured option) or bailing them out. The note did indeed say that the money was all gone not "We've spent all the money".
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 20:54
  #6288 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
And your point is? Of course the money had all gone, Dave's banker pals had drained the coffers dry and moved the proceeds to various tropical tax havens leaving the option of letting the banks go bust (My favoured option) or bailing them out. The note did indeed say that the money was all gone not "We've spent all the money".
I recommend Ppruners bookmark that post.

If anyone ever asks you the meaning of "deluded", you can always send them the link!
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 22:09
  #6289 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
The note did indeed say that the money was all gone not "We've spent all the money".
Ah, right, so who spent it
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 22:28
  #6290 (permalink)  
 
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It wasn't spent. Until the banking crisis everything was fine. The Conservatives in opposition supported spending at those levels and even wanted bank regulation relaxing.

The Tories have gone in for shouting loud and long their version of events and the gullible and those whose purpose it fits have swallowed it.
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 22:34
  #6291 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Effluent Man View Post
It wasn't spent.
So the memo was a lie, have you really thought this line of argument through
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 22:35
  #6292 (permalink)  
 
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EF:

Apart from mortgaging schools and the NHS and then there is underfunded wars Air tanker plus pay as your die (dine) through the vast over-expansion of PFI.

That was to keep the expenditure off them Treasury books.

The financial crisis was started in the USA at the behesy of the Clinton Administration by pushing Freddie Mac and Fanny Mae into making poor quality loan decisions about mortgages.
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 23:23
  #6293 (permalink)  
 
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Meanwhile England is failing and on whose watch? Your present government, in England at least, is making such an outstanding success- not. Talk about blind obedience. Start getting critical guys instead of playing silly party politic point scoring. If I were you I wouldn't be making schoolboy giggles about some stupid letter saying the money ran out - I'd be buying private health insurance:

NHS deficits hit 'massive' 930m - BBC News


Only 3 months in and NHS England has a 930 million deficit. Many an ex pat has commented on here about the woeful state of England, and this current government, remind me it's Conservative isn't it, is doing precious little to address the decline. But hey ho, at least the football team will play in France next year
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Old 11th Oct 2015, 23:37
  #6294 (permalink)  
 
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Only 3 months in and NHS England has a 930 million deficit. Many an ex pat has commented on here about the woeful state of England, and this current government, remind me it's Conservative isn't it, is doing precious little to address the decline. But hey ho, at least the football team will play in France next year
NHS deficit down to two things:

!) PFI, brought in by Major's government vastly and stupidly expanded by Brown to keep the spending off the treasury books. Now the NHS is tied into 30 year contracts. My old hospital 2 years ago had a 20 million deficit and a 1.1 BILLION pound PFI contract on a new build wing over 30 years. Only way to fund that was by PFI signed off like many trusts under New Labour. PFI was under Brown the only way to get money to improve the NHS.

Healthcare costs rise per annum due to increasingly ageing population and developments in care. Platelets a blood component last year were costing 500 for two bags which equals one dose, blood 150 per bag of packed red cells. Use 30 to 40 bags one some body and I have the cost mounts quickly.

2) Management, recent CQC reports highlight good to excellent care but severely criticise managers, who don't manage, will not make derisions and who bully and harass staff until they leave and go and work for agencies for a far better work life balance.

The NHS is a wonderful system in particular when having been to other countries even in Europe and seen their healthcare standards and systems. At the moment in Greece if you are a foreign national and require a blood transfusion when injured your not getting one.

The NHS has been granted the money requested by Simon Stevens the head of NHS England some 10 BILLION pounds.
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Old 12th Oct 2015, 00:40
  #6295 (permalink)  
 
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Well there you go, I suppose it makes for a warm and comfortable feeling that all is well when you compare yourself to Greece.:ugh Can't blame it on those nasty Labour folk anymore - that excuse is now worn out. This is happening now, and remind me on whose watch, ah that will be the Conservatives. NHS England is failing and its happening in slo mo guys. And the Conservatives are quite relaxed about that.
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Old 12th Oct 2015, 07:49
  #6296 (permalink)  
 
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Many an ex pat has commented on here about the woeful state of England...
Not an unusual ex pat type of comment. They are remembering what it was when they left. And they left because then it was in a woeful state (usually due to a mess left by Labour). This is nothing new. I've known ex pats who left in the early '80s still thinking of Britain as it was in the late '70s and not recognising the vast leaps that there have been since then. Ex pats are not a good source of info. Except for one bit of info that you can deduce from their winges: look at when they left, most left when things had been left in a shambles by a Labour government!

And they can bleat on as much as they like, but do any of those ex pats enjoy a health system as good as the NHS? And by that I mean balancing cost to the user against service provided. That's an NHS that is being supported more by the Tories than by the previous lot. The previous lot were too relaxed about the NHS, just relying on their mantra about 'look how good we are' rather than actually doing good. But, it's a lot more accessible to the ordinary man-in-the-street than any private health insurance funded systems elsewhere.
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Old 12th Oct 2015, 09:07
  #6297 (permalink)  
 
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Your present government, in England at least, is making such an outstanding success- not.
Must have been an ex-pat for a long time, its been a few centuries since there has been an English government
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Old 12th Oct 2015, 09:22
  #6298 (permalink)  
 
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Can't blame it on those nasty Labour folk anymore
Oh, did those nasty Labour folk pay off all the PFI debt out of party funds on leaving office then?

If not, one sure as hell can blame it on the nasty Labour folk. Until the last PFI contract ends.
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Old 12th Oct 2015, 09:31
  #6299 (permalink)  
 
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If Mexico is so great, why did Jeremy Corbyns wife come to England?

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Old 12th Oct 2015, 10:07
  #6300 (permalink)  
 
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The elephant in the room on NHS deficits is the fact that demand already far exceeds the money available and is escalating exponentially.

No one will say it but continued free at the point of delivery healthcare is unaffordable in this country. With a rapidly growing, and ageing, population along with an "anything goes" view of the scope of areas the NHS is expected to cater for there is no chance of the NHS books being balanced.

No political party has an answer for this because they are all unwilling to state the facts, which are that elements of healthcare will have to be paid for at the point of use.

We need a debate about what these should be rather than the current "re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic" approach.
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