1000 hour pilot...now what?!?!?
 

I am 31 yrs. old, with:
FAA CPL / Multi / Inst
1000 TT
340 Multi
278 Turbine
263 PIC turbine
840 total PIC
478 night
777 cross country
150 glass cockpit
BE1900 type rating
6 years of aerospace science studies at Oklahoma State University
8 year USAF veteran (F-16 crew chief)..................
.........and I can't get a job.
I'm looking for gigs over seas ( MENA, Asia, etc.)
Any ideas??????

I wouldn't ever suggest paying for line training to anybody, especially an American since it doesn't go over too well in the states. Where all have you applied? You are also a couple hundred short for part 135. Where did you get the B1900 experience? Great Lakes? Gulfstream?

In asia, the only thing they are interested in your CV would be your 280ish PIC multi and 1000 hours total..which is basically nothing.
Now build up this 1900 time in a 135 carrier to get another 200 hrs total then you may have a shot at some PIC turbine.
Do that for a year then go for jets,private or 135 where you can get jet PIC rather quicker.
Now within 2/3 years,you will have jet PIC and all of a sudden your university and crew chief position will help you secure an fo job or if lucky a DEC in mid size jets with prospects of maybe managerial position.

You are in the right path but your total time is hurting you.
Enjoy the 1900.i luuved it.:O

BE1900 PIC program
 

It was Alpine Air in Montana

do you have a gc?

Not sure what a gc is?

As mentioned above, you are still low time. That doesn't mean that all jobs are off the table, but until you get a few thousand more hours on big turbine aircraft, mostly low timer jobs are open. And then there is always Susi Airin Indonesia hehe

Yep, I even tried applying to Susi Air...twice actually. No word back. I'd really just want to fly their Avanti.

So you did P2F already? Dang
And how did you log PIC on a part 135 op without meeting 135 PIC requirements? Did you log under "sole manipulator of the controls"? If so, that could cause some issue in the future. Although technically PIC, many employers only count PIC as the guy who signed for the aircraft. I would keep that in mind.

He was in the USAF. He most likely is a US Citizen or has a green card. That's not the issue here.

Firstly, the FAA has signed a "special clause" approval letter for Alpine Air for those who do the FO/PIC program. And, yes, it falls under the sole manipulator of the controls clause. It works...lots of guys have got a good jump in the airlines that way. Especially because the 1900 requires a type rating. Also, I am a born and bred US Citizen...no green card required. The other thing is the company does a fair amount of empty legs, so I was able to have the SIC required restriction removed from my license. In that case, my type rating is now single pilot (even though at the moment I can't use it as such unless I purchase my own 1900 :ok:). I didn't pay for SIC time, I paid for PIC twin turbine time to make up for some lost time while deploying to Iraq and such. Looking at some of those commuting contract type operators that fly in "austere locations". Sounds promising according to a couple Director of OPS I've spoke to. I'm just looking for further outward perspective on my position.

Lots of part 135 ops have the same FAA exemption for their OpSpecs. Anyhow, have you tried the US Regionals? Have you tried Silver Airways? They operate the B1900, and if you had your ATP, you could be a street captain there. What about Dynamic Aviation? Who else have you checked out?

So you still did P2F and now you try to justify it. Not to be a jerk, but you´re not the only one to "lose time" overseas on Uncle Sam's time. At one point, I counted up orders and I had spent more time TDY than at home station. But if you really feel that what you did was best for you, then I guess I can´t fault you for looking out for numero uno.

zondaracer...thanks for that! Sounds like at least someone sees things the way I do. I wouldn't have changed my service time for anything, I just have some catch up to do. I in NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM want to do the regionals!! I've had interview invites by Siler Wings, Great Lakes, and ExpressJet. ExpressJet is my "last resort" option (in reality). I've applied to such commuting "secret squirrel" operators such as AAR, Inc., Aero Contractors, Flight Works, Phoenix Air Group, Talon Air, Avenge, Inc., Dynamic, and Rampart Aviation. I've had some pretty promising feed back thus far, however, the process is pretty slow. Anyway, what about yourself?

I married a European and moved abroad and got work as an instructor. I don't want to do anything related to a security clearance as I felt four years doing intel was enough for me. I will fly anything though as long as I enjoy it and it pays the bills and keeping all options open.

Well, any more ideas anyone?!?!?! I met with some other D.O.s today....I tell you...this industry moves the goal post everyday it seems. It seems like between the HR imbeciles, the insurance snakes, and the regulatory @#*holes (that are nothing more than counterintuitive and counterproductive nitwits), new categories of 'experience' or prerequisites pop up over night!! I don't want to pay for any more training (already topped $175,000) or go do the regional thing in the US. It appears those are my only choices. Thing is, I'm certainly willing to relocate ANYWHERE!!

With your TT, most foreign operators would give preference to local SICs and you are nowhere near enough to be selected as an ex-pat DEC. I'm US-based, but probably the regionals are your best opportunity. I'm guessing, but the Afghan US deals are going to wind down; you don't have enough TT for most corporates. The P2F thing might work, but your PIC time will be questioned in the future, I guarantee it. Nobody gives a 700 hour pilot with 14 hours of turbine time, the keys. What you feel is "moving the goalposts" might be a polite no.

Sorry, but that's an experienced view.

GF

There are guys having a lot fun flying Caravan in Indonesia at Susi Air. From my unexperienced point of view, this is the only one alternative to the regionals in America except some aerial work, instructing and skydiving.

$175,000??? Holy cow, how did you end up spending that much?? Didn´t you use GI Bill for part of it?

"zondaracer"....I was finished with most of my training by the time I enlisted, plus GI Bill and kicker didn't cover the ever increasing price of Part 141 flight training, and US Gov't. wouldn't loan more than what was required to pay for classes. Then, the trip back to the US for the 250+ PIC turbine program included airfare in a couple of stops in the US, the type rating, the hour rate, hotel, and rental car. That whole 3.5 month stint cost $48,000. It sucks, I know, but I've worked virtually every facet of aviation (maintenance, marketing, line service, cargo, etc.) and I've wanted the pilot gig since I was knee high to a grasshopper!
As far as questioning my PIC turbine time...bring it on. I've have all of the FAA signed and stamped documents to support the operation. Alpine has pumped out dozens and dozens of folks who logged this time in that manner, and have never had it cause an issue. A lot of FAA and company lawyers were involved in this, and they furnish all who go through the program with a signed and notarized copy.
As far as Susi Air...I've applied twice, and now I think perhaps I need to make a phone call to check the status. According to their website, they are currently hiring pilots. The D.O. at Dynamic, Rampart, and Aero Contractors have indicated to me that I am being "strongly considered, and in a very small pool". Not sure if it will yield anything, just trying to explore any and all options. Like I said, ExpressJet and or Colgan (in need a Dash 8 type for another prospective job in the middle east) would be last ditch efforts.
Fortunately, the Afghan and other such hardship areas will likely (at least for the next foreseeable decade) not dwindle too much. From what I've gathered, even though our "force posture" or status might change, our presense and influence will not. We might send the bulk of the combat force home, but SOC, SF, specialists, "advisors", and such will remain in place for stability, training, and response.

And, I really must admit; flying into Missoula, MT at night in heavy "warm" snow, putting on 3-4 inches of ice, down the ILS, no AP, and to the min's., all while riding turbulence that causes you to piss blood when you land...is beyond a doubt one of the best recurring experiences in all of my short aviation tenure.

oh...sorry...one more thing to add before I get some more replies (hopefully...thanks to all who have);
Whom or what is some P2F options really hurting? As far as I can tell, if the aircraft is substantial enough (BE1900 v. PA34) and the operation only is ticketed for single pilot, the only person that it takes from is the one paying for it. It helps small 135 operstors, and keeps guys on track. It is not like [for example] the fact that I paid for my own BE1900 type and 250+ hours PIC in the airplane drove down the pay or benefits for ANYONE else in the industry. I'm not saying all P2F schemes are good, it is just that flight instruction is not for everyone or always the best answer. I personally would not trade those hard 250 hours on the line with the 1900 for 250 hours instructing PPL or CPL students. Being a CFI is wonderful for those who take pleasure in it, or learn from it. God knows I love to teach as well (taught arabs how to work on their brand new F-16s for two years), but being a CFI is all people on PPRuNe seem to advocate to build time properly.

Who might you suggest suffered by me paying to sit and fly a 1900 for a single pilot outfit? All while the rostered captain sat next to me and took an earned break.

First,"rostered captain" says it all, really. No Chief Pilot worth his salt would accept that as turbine PIC time, if he knew the background. I've done enough interviewing, in the hiring side of the table, to be sure of that.

Second, paying to act as a crewmember, performing work, is signal enough to employers that the market pay is too high as it is. While you are not denying someone employment, you are cheapening the "product", that is, pilots.

GF

Saying I'm wrong to try and navigate this rotting business as best I can is easy to say for someone who had it a lot easier and with less "hurdles" along the way (certainly less bull$#!*). I, too, know plenty of "'ol dogs" who don't envy me trying to make it from the bottom in this day in age in professional flying. I refuse to believe that my time and money was not well spent. How can I be signaling to anyone that the pay is too high? How is it any different than me flying the airplane with simply another rated crew member? I learned a lot and did a fair amount of hard flying over those couple months. How could it be better to buzz around smashing bugs in local practice areas for 250 hours training people? I mean that with the utmost respect to the CFI profession. But, tell me truthfully, if a CFI at any level could honestly EARN an extra surplus of $35,000 or so, that he / she would not spend it to log QUALITY time and experience on a high performance twin turboprop airplane weighing more than 12,500lbs. to further their career or better their chances to move on to the next step.....REALLY?!?!? As long as the program incorporates good training methods / practices, and your not sitting in an otherwise 'paid' seat? Pilot in Command is Pilot in Command...it all depends on the person. I've flown with guys with 6,000hrs PIC turbine who are as brain dead as a 300hr student pilot. It should be all about quality not just quantity. Along with all of the over exposed problems with aviation today, I believe the one factor that is left untouched is the failure of the testing / evaluation / standards. It's gone from 100 micron to 10 micron filters.

Considering that, not only will you (and many others, it's not personal) work for free, you will pay to fly is a pretty strong signal.

Proclaiming that others, of whom you have no knowledge, had it easier than you is presumptuous, at the least. In forty years of flying, I have buried friends, been thru bankruptcies, been thru wars, struck and lost a career. I had it easy compared to many, many pilots on this and other websites.

It is not easy, it never was, never will be. There are no shortcuts. I know a guy who had 5,000 hours of Cherokee CFI time before he got a job as co-pilot on a B99. The Seventies were hard, made the present look like a cakewalk--RJ jobs by the thousand.

That's all and good luck

GF

With all due respect, I realize the kind of painfully long and less than ideal jobs that those before me have had to suffer through, make my situation seem like a holiday. I'm mearly trying to address some inconsistencies that I've been made aware of as of late. Though I am young and still laking a great deal of wisdom, I do appreciate the nature of this industry and the sacrifices it demands. I am, in every way, ready and willing for my opportunity to make those sacrifices. It just seems that "the powers that be" have become unbelievably dissalutioned over the last decade or so. "galaxy flyer"...you obviously realize that times have changed. I, without a doubt, understand the difference in ideology that you and I have expressed. I don't think your necessarily wrong, just different in your outlook. The end result is the same (I hope). I missed a number of years of flying to serve Uncle Sam, and my life just does not suit being a CFI. So, I either had to throw in the towel or pay someone to boost me toward one of the "RJ jobs by the thousands". If I can circumnavigate even that route, why wouldn't I?

On a lighter note...thanks a ton to everyone whom has chimed in; keep the advice, ideas, and of course the constructive criticism coming! All the best!

In the US, Silver Airlines and Great Lakes are hiring, as are several Regionals and, with an ATP Written you should be close to interviewable. If you need more TT, try pipeline patrol, banners, etc. There is nothing disreputable about CFI time. There are few other avenues unless you are damned lucky and walk into a corporate job that falls over you. I know a guy who interned out of ERAU, graduated into a G IV, but lightning can strike, too.

Outside the US, Maun and one other tourist areas in Africa are possibility. Check the Maun thread in African Aviation forum. You probably know your way around Afghanistan better than anyone here. Decent time, if you get on. Question being, what ar your chances with a US domestic when you return. There are probably 7,000 RJ pilots just waiting to get on and they will primo! Loads if 121 time, ATP, and might have a flow agreement with mainline company. Wide open hiring is five years away.

GF

From another thread in this forum
 

Try Falcon Express Cargo Airlines in Dubai, you need 500TT and 300 Multi and 1900 rating for a chance

Your profile lists you in Dubai so maybe you can go knock on the door.

I have tried.....no comment

Your best experience was pissing blood when you landed.....blimey.....

It's hard out there in any area for any experience. I'm UK based and have been a 757 capt until the company went bust in Nov.To get another jet command it would be ME/China/Japan, but what do you do if your wife doesn't want to move ?

Got 2000h on corporate jet, TT 2400. I will be jobless in a few months. I'm already applying for 1 year, every single day. And so far not 1 single result. I'm really considering to change my career although i'm heading the 40'ies.
So i advice you strongly to have a plan B. I've never done that and i regret that. 1000h is still nothing, sorry to say.
Good luck anyway.

1000 hours? Enough to fly a Cessna 172/206.


$175,000 to get where you are at? You must have done something wrong somewhere.


It seems to me that you have made some wrong decisions, and after burning such a huge amount of money to arrive nowhere shows that until now you have really been not successful, so at that point you should refrain from judging the instructor path "smashing bugs in local practice area", or refrain from commenting on 6000 hours PIC turbine who are brain dead.
It seems to me you are the one in the bad position right now, not the flight instructor you are not, not the turboprop captain you are not.

It is very possible you'll get your chance with some regionals, but being hired by a regional with $175,000 of spending is nothing to be proud of.
I'd rather be a flight instructor smashing bugs in the practice area with a basic CPL and instructor rating.


A couple of months in a P2F scam that's only an introduction of flight I am afraid to say.

What you must understand is that some individuals lives take them in different directions. After going to one of the premier flight schools in the US (which by the time I left was more expensive per quater than Harvard!), the market changed and slowed considerably. So, I went to university to finish my bachelor's degree. Again, the flying was very hard to fund, even working full time. Once the military came in play, I had missed months of flying and had to play catch up. To add fuel to the fire, the accreditation situation changed and I had to "repeat" 48 credit hours worth of classes from the "premier flight school". After my last deployment, I was hired than almost immediately laid-off from a King Air gig. That is when I decided to go work for Lockheed training foreign nationals on how to maintain thier new F-16s. I would have done the instructor thing (GLADLY), except it would have required more money! I know people whom have graduated from the straight four year program at Embry Riddle with more student loan debt than that. Lastly, it is sad that the US does not have such "national" cadet programs like some pacific, middle eastern, and european operators.
Plus, I'm sure you and everyone else that have read and or contributed to this thread are aware of the hundreds of fellas that have barely made a monetary sacrifice and slid right in to a right seat A320/B737NG job at 350 hours TT.
So, I must hold my ground, and ask that before you judge or condemn me for my chosen avenue, perhaps you can take a moment to realize that I've shown perseverance and a willingness to do what it takes. The end result and quality is all that really matters. As far as I can tell, I may not have always done things the most efficient way, but I don't regret sticking with it. So if there is any one whom is wrong, sir, it is you about me. I'm just looking for some professional guidance and perhaps some opportunities to consider.
Thank you

Good lord, you in debt for 175K? I don't know what I could tell you. Right now its as bad a pilot job market as I have ever seen and I been around since the mid 1970's, Wiggins Airways is looking for a Beech 99 Capt. For a Maine Base. 33K to start, but you are short a good 1000 hours for them. I know guys that are in debt for 80 to 90 k and were flying for some regional or another making 19 k a year. No money now and it was no money 30 years ago too. But guys stand in line for it. You sure got your self into a financial mess if that amount is all loans. heck you would be in dire straights if you are on the hook for a third of that.

danbpilot:

alright I see, I thought you were looking down the instructor career path.

It's hard to believe that with your profile, your background and your 1000 hours you won't find anything. Try the jobs on single piston engines aswell, after all with 1000 hours TT you are still at the very beginning of your career. I believe you could have done the exact same thing (1000 hours and looking for a job) with slightly less $$$. Good luck.


Yes but it concerns mainly the instructors with some experience, or the experienced turbine/jet captains. With your profile in Asia it is very unlikely, but who knows...

Thanks for the advice sir. I've emailed over 160 cover letters and resumes over the last 6 months. You name the corner of earth and type of operation...I've knocked on the door (metaphorically in most cases). Just making follow up calls and sayin' my prayers. Anyone know what the "real world" minimums are with companies like Dynamic Aviation, AAR, Inc., Phoenix Air, Rampart Aviation, etc.? I know what the websites say, but what are they actually hiring F.O.s at?
Thanks to All

There are minimums and then there is competitive. Competitive at Dynamic is closer to 4000TT with prior military flying experience, or 6000TT with experience flying their types.

I worked along side a govt contractor operating a king air, and I asked what ther pilot group looked like... They had 13 pilots, 11 were prior military pilots with at least 2000 hours when hired. One was a prior special ops guy who got his civilian ratings. The last guy had no military experience but had several type ratings including 747 and over 15000TT when hired. You might just have to bite the bullet and go to a regional to build up some time before those goal posts move to 1500TT.

Remember, lots of the guys going to these jobs are prior military pilots, how have flown in the AOR doing similar type missions, over 2000TT, and include guys who have already done ISR, special warfare, etc... I met one guy trying to get hired at Airscan and he was a pilot in the 160th SOAR, just to give you an idea.

Well, that's 213 applications / cover letters / resumes in the outbox or floating through the world wide web....now it's just the follow-up and wait game. Oh, and for those whom might care...as of 4 days ago, Falcon Express Air Cargo in Dubai is not hiring.

forget sending out resumes......knocking on doors is the only way, keep trying and dont give up! good tip, find out where the Chief Pilot goes for a beer!!I joined Falcon in early 2004, i first knocked on the door in 2001!when i was at Falcon some guys waited over 6 months in Dubai, and kept knocking on the door.While your waiting go and fix the the UAE F16's to keep the cash coming in.