The fact of the matter remains, the world is closed, everyone is grounded and companies are struggling. If you are prepared to risk 30K now to join a contractor hold pool then that's up to you. Best case: you get some hours in 2022 as a contractor for one of the RYR companies. Worst case: you spend 30K and are back to square one but with far fewer hours than your qualified counter parts when it comes to the next real job.

But let's not lose perspective. Most of you invested 80K+ to enter an industry with the promise of lucrative salaries and professional accreditation... this path won't even allow you to get a mortgage let alone support a family. You will be undervalued and overlooked. In comparison I work for an airline that pays me a modest salary plus allowances, pays for my medicals, loss of licence and health insurance, contributes to my pension, provides free food whilst on duty, gives me allowances to eat during night stops, pays for my uniform, parking and security passes, I benefit from staff travel and other discounts but most of all I have union representatives that work hard to protect my working rights.

I appreciate the majority of you considering this currently are fairly young and inexperienced but you need to start helping yourselves! Your parents money will eventually run dry and you'll soon have to support yourselves. You need to start asking: What are Ryanair offering me and how am I going to survive!?

sunji

I get you, and I respect that. I have friends who are in the same situation as you and I understand that it is tough. It’s the “at least the job is there” situation, they will use that for the foreseeable future, the idea that they offer job security.

However, at what cost? There’s zero mental health support and I have met many who left their business battered emotionally, because of how they were treated. I met many captains who hated the job but couldn’t leave, FO’s who lost their passion because the joy was taken away from them. Every day It was a matter of asking around the whatsapp group to see if you were going to fly with someone decent or not etc, rushed 25mins turnarounds so no “traveling” whatsoever, watching the cabin crew come and go as they couldn’t cope...

The attrition rates were always high for a reason, they can keep recruiting for a reason, because it is not for everyone and those that stay end up miserable. Those who leave, most of the time won’t regret their decision.
What people don’t say about this outfit, is that if it was that good, people wouldn’t leave and there wouldn’t be such a large cadet recruitment campaigns year round. It heavily outweighs their expansion, always did.
What I say to you, I say to my friends who are in the same situation, you WILL find a job eventually and you won’t look back!

sunji

Well in this case you should speak to 50+ pilots who complete 737 TR at EMA in January 2020 and being made redundant from Buzz 3 months later

Spot on !!!

Exactly, this! They were actually forced on to Buzz contracts and made redundant. With all due respect but vacancies with just a 737 TR with no hours was already basically (not fully) useless before COVID let alone now. There's a reason the people accepted on the Ryanair mentored programs APS MCC programs are much lower than pre COVID.

I only talked about Lauda but as you can see Sunji, it is the same in other areas in the RYR group. How can you be so sure that 99% will get the job after the TR when they just dismissed the previous courses and they have given no news since then... As previously said, it is the hard truth buth still the truth : the world is closed.

Its all the same, friends applied to Ryanair got offered Lauda interview instead, I do not know what Sunji smokes but I need some of it

As a pilot, you don't just sit on your hands and hope that nothing bad happens. Instead, you plan proactively for what can go wrong and how to keep yourself out of the woods if it does. Hence, I advise any applicant to thoroughly consider three possible scenarios:

Optimistic: job in early 2022. That's what everyone hopes for as it would result in a timeline that's not too far off an ordinary RYR application.

Middle-ground: job towards mid-2022. Here things start getting a little bit precarious as you'll need to live on something for up to 9-12 months after the course AND keep your skills and knowledge sharp without the benefit of flying. May someone more knowledgeable than me shed a light on whether use of the fixed-base simulators becomes free only after you've signed the service agreement for the job or before that? Because you'll definitely need a brush-up after a couple of months out of the sim and without flying.

Pessimistic: no job into and beyond mid-2022. Double whammy, this one. On top of the concerns from the middle-ground scenario, you've also got a type rating to revalidate now. And, as you'll likely need at least one FFS training session to get up to speed before going for the check (second FFS session), it's going to cost you an arm and a leg.

So, you may go into it hoping for scenario 1. We all hope for the best - everyone is fed up to their back teeth with this pandemic and everyone wants it over ASAP. But, in case things don't turn out quite rosy, always have scenarios 2 and 3 at the back of your mind - and plan and budget accordingly. Without having a sound backup plan for those cases, steer clear until you do.

This is sound advice and reasoning.

Any commitment of funds right now is a huge gamble.

Ask yourself if you had £30k in your pocket, what probability % would you be confident in placing a bet?

Right now I’d say there is maybe a 30-50% chance that 2022 will go how Ryanair think it will.

Willing to put it all on the line for at best a 50% chance? Personally, I wouldn’t.

That all allusive lure of a job is far too tempting for some but sometimes you need to put the dream on hold and let some sound reasoning and reality take hold.

Most people on this forum urging caution are either those who have made the mistake or seen it happen over and over again.

Unfortunately the usual suspects social media posts are now filling up with ‘congrats to ex student for being offered a job’

Almost always the same naive 20 something person who doesn’t understand the value and potentially hard work that went in to earning that money and just wants their dream fulfilled.

I must say, it pains me to read all of this hatred and (mostly) lies towards ryr.

yes they have their problems however yes they also have MANY good things that come with being employed with them. Don't worry if you're offered contractor as well, there's many bonuses to this - the pay and the tax to name a couple.

Also look at the fact no pilot was forced redundancy and also now hiring, the job security is immense.
The hatred for the TR programme tends to stem from one thing predominantly - jealousy. Since cadets are going to be flying on the line this year and be the first in europe to get a job. Look 5K or 30K Its the cadets decision if they pay. Of course they are aware of the risks involved, nothing guaranteed in this industry as we know. The reality is they will be line training up until early next year with few flights and ready for a big 2022 as ryr not fans of line training in busy summer periods hence the choice not to start the recruitment process in jan 2022. . More airlines are going to suffer this year and RYR are waiting to pounce. We all know 2021 isnt looking too pleasant but this is the truth.

As for people talking about buzz, thats the warsaw aviaiton situation which they are in a hold pool to return to buzz on a phased roll out as it recovers.

Really don’t know where to start with this...

What lies? What gives you the right to invalidate other’s experiences, let’s say, mine? Did you fly out of the same bases etc?
Do you even fly or are you sat at Swords office?
Sit down mate.

HotelAlpha1;

I don't think the subject here is "do you like RYR or not", I think most of us would be very happy to fly with them (or at least I would be). We just want to emphasize this is a type rating programme, not a cadet scheme. They're is no guarantee you'll get something with RYR at the end of the program. The only guarantee is that you'll spend at least 30K and get type rated on the 737. The rest is a gamble.

Given the uncertainty and tough situation in the industry right now, I don't think it's sound to say "cadets are going to be flying on the line this year and be the first in europe to get a job".

If they really need pilots why they don't take from the hold pool? At the end of the day this is the purpose of hold pool's existence.

Ok so all those "employed" pilots are sitting at home not flying and not going anywhere. Then where does the notion come from there is a need for new pilots, even in 2022/2023?

If you just want to do a 737 TR then go for it. But if you expect that you will receive a return on your investment then use the money to retrain or to start a business.

I give up... no wonder Ryanair do what they do!

HotelAlpha1

You are not a Ryanair pilot are you? If you were, you’d know most of what has been discussed in this page at least it’s truth. Don’t call others liars or invalidate their experiences specially if you never touched a jet in your life. We are here to help and advise the best as possible, you don’t have to accept the advice tho.

I am new on this thread, so any input on how to prepare for the cut-e online assessment is very welcome! Many thanks!

Get the prep package on LatestPilotJobs or AirlinePrep. I am sure their content is actual and applies to RYR selection process. Cut-E tests are just a bunch of easy aptitude tests. For your ATPL revise your ground school notes. Video interview, if there is any, serves to prove you can speak English.

Good luck with it and whatever happens next.

I just asked a person I know who was at RYR as a Capt when CoVID hit. Im not sure which base he is at, but he's not flown since March 2020.

He says training new hires this year is absolutely out of the question unless a miracle happens.

Hi,

Does anyone has done the online preassesment? I have some friends who have already received the invitation but Im still wondering if in the ATPL questions there are questions with annexes (performance tables, m&b, etc) with 10 minutes I consider it quite impossible to be completed if they are not exclusively theoretical abcd questions.

Just theory.

Hi Everyone,

I’ve just finished my ATPL(A) course and I’ve been wondering if you guys could help me to sort out a solution for my dilemma.
I have the basic MCC demanded by EASA, with 15h in a B737NG FNPTII.

Do you guys think is really worth it to spend 6/7k on an APS MCC Ryanair Programme, 3/4k on a Standard APS MCC, just update my MCC with a JOC or if it would be smarter to save that money and take some SIM sessions on a B737NG FNPTII some days before the assessment in Dublin?

My IFR SIM training was also done in a B737NG FNPTII, having 55h logged on that, until this day.

Just wondering if they at Ryanair really take into account the type of MCC training the applicants have, or if they care more about things like theoretical exams average (and attempts), during their selection process.

thanks in advance!

Just update your MCC with a JOC, and use that as a refresher. You would be looking at only a few hours in the sim.

Anyone with a standard MCC can apply for the self sponsored type rating program. Obviously there is no need at all to do an APS MCC as long as you are able to pay for the type rating course.

hsilva7

Hell no. Don't even think about it. It didn't worth it before, let alone now. Ryanair just like all airlines worldwide won't be hiring low timers any time soon. Don't get your hopes up. Use this devastating period on your benefit to improve your cv, find another job, whatever you think it's required.

First, hell no also Normal APS MCC is also in the 6/7k region. Just add the JOC part so you can apply to other airlines too. You're looking to spend another 40k if you go your way.. There's also people who got called with just a normal MCC/JOC so don't stress this outfit isnt the only one out there (Well it is now but not for long..)

Listen, there's people on facebook bragging they got hired by Ryanair while they only got onto the type rating course, so no work contract no nothing or proper outlook on 2021 or 22. I guess this says enough about the average IQ there. If you're willing to spend a further 40k after you already spend a huge load on your CPL course with a further 40k you need to get checked honestly.. Unless you are gaining north of 4k a month at the moment thats a different story...

Sad but true story. What's more, now someone will almost certainly shout out that you say so because "you're jealous" or "you don't like RYR"...

As much as I sympathise with everyone hoping for a quick return of cadet recruitment, for now any projections are a gamble. Facts and figures are facts and figures, whether people like them or not. Whether or not there will be a summer 2022 expansion - we'll find out in summer 2022 if we're still this side of the grass by then.

The situation is very unstable, if vaccine is successful, the prediction will be true and high probabilities to get hired, if the vaccine is not successful, 30k debt with the bank with no employment. Many things to consider... But still an opportunity.

hsilva7

It's a personal choice at the end of the day, with the correct studying at preparation there's no doubt you could excel at an assessment without a ryanair aps however one of the main benefits of the ryanair aps is that it's designed to make that bridge between MCC and TR smaller and it does it well.

Congratulations to All who have received TR offers, some great news in these otherwise dark times.

Don't come back complaining in 12-18 months time when you are still sitting around waiting for RYR to hire you.

firstly, Thank you guys.

So would it be more wise to invest such money on a Instructor Rating VFR, and try to find a school which can provide also some internship and job possibilities?

Make sure you find a school that hires their instructor graduates.

Thought I may add my twopence. Not worth a lot I know.
My view is that if sone one is so determined to becoming a pilot and will persevere no matter, then the Ryan Air path appears to have the potential to be be fruitful.
Ryan Air appears to be the most likely to survive and prosper through this terrible period of aviation we are in.

Heard today from various sources that Buzz are running MAX online training and getting SIMs sorted.

No flies on O'Leary and his mob.

Many won't be happy with Ryan's overall effect on our industry but you do have to admire his total ruthlessness. We could do with some of this to rub off on our politicians. No such luck, as they are voted in. Mores the pity.

I have submitted my application on the 11th of January to the Type Rating Programme of AFA Academy.
the thing is, I haven’t received any automatic e-mail confirming that they received my application successfully and would be analyzed, as many people received.
should I worry about it, or is it been happening to you guys, lately, too.

thanks

Boys and girls,

Many of my RYR friends - the ones actually employed - haven’t flown since March / April, both ranks. My lauda mates are driving delivery vans back In the U.K. after finishing their line training in Spain and having to uproot their lives again. My buzz mates were made redundant. Travel is worse now than it was in 2020. If you’re from the UK you can’t currently travel into the EU nevermind work there. The vaccination plan has hit a roadblock. There’s a surplus of crew and zero demand for travel. You will probably have to cover your own LPC. This isn’t going to miraculously change overnight. It will take years.

But none of this matters because you refuse to listen to sound advice.

I hope your parents know the full story and you’re not just fobbing them off with pure bs.

This may give some of you an idea how bad the industry is. Just came back from upset recovery training and whilst there I spoke to a guy in the lunch room who just got let go from Emirates. He had been there 10 years. He is doing a biz jet rating cause he was hired as an FO by a company in Africa someplace. He said he feels lucky he has a job. Dozens of his friends who were let go from Emirates with no hope of anything better than driving a fork lift or delivery van.

You guys really should give money to RYR though as there is nobody else better qualified.

hsilva7

​​​​​HI,

I applied by those dates too and got no confirmation mail, but I received de email for the online preassesment. Make sure that in "my applications" section of ryanair careers webpage there is the application.

2021 Pilot Survey

Those with extremely rose tinted glasses on can do themselves a favour and look at what the state of the industry is from current pilot views, then ask yourself what’s the real chance of you flying this year ?

Also for those doing type ratings in March how long after you’ve paid your £30k, done the course and sat around waiting to be called while seeing countless others doing the course will you start to question your decision ?

no thank you!
 

Hi all!

I have received the invitation for the assessment too, I will do the assessment just because it can be a learning and practice experience.

But no way I’m doing a type rating with no guarantees of a contract at this moment in time, where regulation keep changing and there are so many uncertainties.

Also I don’t like how they are playing with people’s emotions and dreams.

no thank you!

They wont read that. They are too busy updating their social media profiles...