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They will have it in for you if you keep ignoring what they tell you and keep posting the same thing!
The crux of your post was should you get into debt for CTC to the tune of 70k and try to get get a job and if not get a job instructing (another 7k) which wouldn't even cover the repayments on your loan.
Reading the threads on this forum and the wannabee forum should give you a resounding NO.
The crux of your post was should you get into debt for CTC to the tune of 70k and try to get get a job and if not get a job instructing (another 7k) which wouldn't even cover the repayments on your loan.
Reading the threads on this forum and the wannabee forum should give you a resounding NO.
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Very breifly put but it was more than that. I've already been through and through these forums so i didnt see the harm in posting some of my questions which i could not find. It just really annoyed me, im trying to find out more but then the posts just get deleted. Very angry!
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Mcgoo is right!
This forum has a wealth of experience and many established pilots who are very willing to help someone get their foot on the first rung of the ladder.
However they do get hacked off with the same questions being repeated time after time when the subjects have been covered / answered numerous times.
I have PMed you and tried to put you on the rigth path but you don't seem to listen!
HWB
This forum has a wealth of experience and many established pilots who are very willing to help someone get their foot on the first rung of the ladder.
However they do get hacked off with the same questions being repeated time after time when the subjects have been covered / answered numerous times.
I have PMed you and tried to put you on the rigth path but you don't seem to listen!
HWB
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My personal advice.
A copy/paste from another thread:
If you so wish you can do your PPL to get a feeling.
Don' t spend money you don' t earn if you don' t want to feed the banks.
A copy/paste from another thread:
No, at least not for now.
If you want to get in risk-free, I' d advise you to buy ATPL books and start reading. They are easy to read, even for beginners.
The modular practical training can be done in less than 6 months if you start in the spring. The ATPL theory is the one that takes most time to clear, so if you prepare that in advance, you are ready to bounce in anytime you judge it is worth jumping in. This is relative to everyone but for me it would be when airlines would be desperate to hire on acceptable T&C' s.
If you work another job now, you can easily save 30K over the next 2 years and cover over 60% of your modular training' s cost. You won' t miss a thing in the meanwhile, except maybe the expensive license renewals and alot of frustration from the negative or lack of response from the operators.
After work, grab your ATPL' s and read. Read all the books at least 50 times and go for a 100 on all subjects. You won' t get a 100 because many questions are very tricky, but you won' t be far off.
If you can, find a job in aviation. I' d avoid check-in or jobs like that, go for more operational aircraft-related jobs.
Don' t tell your potential employers that you want to become a pilot, tell them that you are very interested in aviation and that you would work for them for another 30 years. They hate wannabe pilots because they didn' t work for longer than 3 years in the past (though they tend to stick around longer now, guess why).
If you do find such a job you will realise that all this no-airline-jobs talk is real. You will meet many frozen ATPL' s there (many lie their way in or know somebody on the inside, because otherwise they are not in demand for the above mentionned reason), and you will more than ever enjoy your debtless situation.
My personal experience (pm me if you want details)
To reiterate my advice:
We' re all in the same boat (though I' m already considering other careers, if I do get the right opportunities) and we should all help eachother.
Good luck.
If you want to get in risk-free, I' d advise you to buy ATPL books and start reading. They are easy to read, even for beginners.
The modular practical training can be done in less than 6 months if you start in the spring. The ATPL theory is the one that takes most time to clear, so if you prepare that in advance, you are ready to bounce in anytime you judge it is worth jumping in. This is relative to everyone but for me it would be when airlines would be desperate to hire on acceptable T&C' s.
If you work another job now, you can easily save 30K over the next 2 years and cover over 60% of your modular training' s cost. You won' t miss a thing in the meanwhile, except maybe the expensive license renewals and alot of frustration from the negative or lack of response from the operators.
After work, grab your ATPL' s and read. Read all the books at least 50 times and go for a 100 on all subjects. You won' t get a 100 because many questions are very tricky, but you won' t be far off.
If you can, find a job in aviation. I' d avoid check-in or jobs like that, go for more operational aircraft-related jobs.
Don' t tell your potential employers that you want to become a pilot, tell them that you are very interested in aviation and that you would work for them for another 30 years. They hate wannabe pilots because they didn' t work for longer than 3 years in the past (though they tend to stick around longer now, guess why).
If you do find such a job you will realise that all this no-airline-jobs talk is real. You will meet many frozen ATPL' s there (many lie their way in or know somebody on the inside, because otherwise they are not in demand for the above mentionned reason), and you will more than ever enjoy your debtless situation.
My personal experience (pm me if you want details)
To reiterate my advice:
- Work another aviation related job (I repeat, don' t tell them at the job interview that you want to become a pilot), in the meanwhile study the ATPL books.
- Save at least 30K on a savings account (it is such a pleasure to see the balance go up and up) over the next 2 years, rely on mom and dad for that.
- If and when the airlines start hiring again, still hold your breath, don't jump in too soon. Remember, there' s alot of people in the same pool, and they' re all at least as good as you are.
- When you see more than 50% of airlines hiring first officers, jump in immediately, pass your theory exams that you have prepared and do your practical training full time in less than 6 months, using money from your savings.
We' re all in the same boat (though I' m already considering other careers, if I do get the right opportunities) and we should all help eachother.
Good luck.
Don' t spend money you don' t earn if you don' t want to feed the banks.
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I might as well post some of my reply to one of his other threads. Maybe it will help another wannabe with similar questions in the future:
If I can explain where I went wrong, perhaps it will help. Who knows. I left school at 16 with the intention of "getting" a place on a BA sponsorship. Of course, as a naive 16 year old that all made sense. My plan was to get a job, study at night school to get A levels and then apply for sponsorship. If I was unsuccessful I would save what I earned and pay for it myself. Well I got some A-levels as planned. First problem was that the grades were rubbish. This is perhaps excusable given that the night school consisted of condensing a 2 year full time course to one year, one night a week (not to mention the rather disenfranchised tutor) Anyway, by the time this had been done I was 18/19 and BA had stopped the scheme (forever
). No problem, I thought, I'll just save the money up. Which I did for a while. Birthdays and Christmas bought me the odd half hour of C152 time here and there but it was hard going when earning the princely sum of £3.40 an hour. So crap in fact that I didn't have to pay tax. Now, here's where I went wrong. I frittered the money away. First a car, then a holiday. Oops, best start again. Oh then I had to bail a friend out who got in over their head with a loan shark. Start again. Anyway, long story short[er] I never actually got anywhere, nor saved anything. If you go down this road, I'd have a separate account, possibly in your parents' names, to save your hard-earned to via standing order, so there's no temptation or easy access to the money.
Although I ended up staying in the same company I first worked for as, eventually, IT manager, I still hadn't broken the cycle of earn-and-spend that those days got me into. In fact, when I was made redundant 2 years ago I had rather too much debt. Don't do that, whatever you do. It's so much easier to get into that mess that to get out.
I admit I'm pretty stupid because it took me 10 years to figure out that I had several conflicting things going on. I was naturally blessed with IT skills yet I don't particularly enjoy that line of work any more - grass is always greener, huh! I wanted to be an airline pilot because of some childish fantasy that didn't die out when I became an adult but I did actually really really enjoy flying. In that case it's quite simple. Do whatever it takes to fly. Not just aim for some BoeingBus jet and refuse anything "lesser" but fly whatever, anything with wings will do. If at some point in the future one can be paid to do it, that's a bonus.
If I'm as insane about flying as I believe I am, it really doesn't matter what it is I'm flying. Once I separated the airline pilot image from the enjoyment I get from flying I was a lot more relaxed about where I am headed in life.
You'll get many opinions, but bear in mind that only you can answer this.
I think the one thing most sane people can agree on is that now is not the time to start training, with the exception of getting a PPL and enjoying the bit that is supposed to be attracting you to the job.
Well I failed spectacularly so if nothing else you can see what I did wrong and avoid it.
I'm currently waiting for my first flight in a glider and can't wait. I've read two of Derek Piggott's books twice already in the last two weeks. The thought of being able to actually finally fly, regularly, is exhilarating. Best of all it's so cheap that even I will be able to afford to do it, without living beyond my means.
If I can explain where I went wrong, perhaps it will help. Who knows. I left school at 16 with the intention of "getting" a place on a BA sponsorship. Of course, as a naive 16 year old that all made sense. My plan was to get a job, study at night school to get A levels and then apply for sponsorship. If I was unsuccessful I would save what I earned and pay for it myself. Well I got some A-levels as planned. First problem was that the grades were rubbish. This is perhaps excusable given that the night school consisted of condensing a 2 year full time course to one year, one night a week (not to mention the rather disenfranchised tutor) Anyway, by the time this had been done I was 18/19 and BA had stopped the scheme (forever
). No problem, I thought, I'll just save the money up. Which I did for a while. Birthdays and Christmas bought me the odd half hour of C152 time here and there but it was hard going when earning the princely sum of £3.40 an hour. So crap in fact that I didn't have to pay tax. Now, here's where I went wrong. I frittered the money away. First a car, then a holiday. Oops, best start again. Oh then I had to bail a friend out who got in over their head with a loan shark. Start again. Anyway, long story short[er] I never actually got anywhere, nor saved anything. If you go down this road, I'd have a separate account, possibly in your parents' names, to save your hard-earned to via standing order, so there's no temptation or easy access to the money. Although I ended up staying in the same company I first worked for as, eventually, IT manager, I still hadn't broken the cycle of earn-and-spend that those days got me into. In fact, when I was made redundant 2 years ago I had rather too much debt. Don't do that, whatever you do. It's so much easier to get into that mess that to get out.
Do i follow a different career path with a decent wage and wait for the industry to recover, by then i could have enough to pay for my CPL and other ratings without going into debt.
If I'm as insane about flying as I believe I am, it really doesn't matter what it is I'm flying. Once I separated the airline pilot image from the enjoyment I get from flying I was a lot more relaxed about where I am headed in life.
My dream is to become a pilot and some people follow your dream, but is a dream really worth financial ruin and potentially ruining my life because of huge debts.
I think the one thing most sane people can agree on is that now is not the time to start training, with the exception of getting a PPL and enjoying the bit that is supposed to be attracting you to the job.
I would also like to hear peoples stories on their route to becoming a pilot, if you failed or not. Im not afraid of being told straight, infact thats what i want to hear.
I'm currently waiting for my first flight in a glider and can't wait. I've read two of Derek Piggott's books twice already in the last two weeks. The thought of being able to actually finally fly, regularly, is exhilarating. Best of all it's so cheap that even I will be able to afford to do it, without living beyond my means.
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Thanks to those who have added their own 'hard learned' experiences and I hope these will be a lesson to those about to embark on the same course of action.
Now is NOT a good time to start training because there are no jobs out there for low hour pilots. Major airlines are making experienced pilots redundant and they will be taken on over the heads of the recently qualified - like it or not!
As I think there is sufficient to answer the original post here and elsewhere in the forum I am closing this thread
HWB
Now is NOT a good time to start training because there are no jobs out there for low hour pilots. Major airlines are making experienced pilots redundant and they will be taken on over the heads of the recently qualified - like it or not!
As I think there is sufficient to answer the original post here and elsewhere in the forum I am closing this thread
HWB
