Non-airline professional flying

[Gotta_Hope]

Non airline flying jobs???

This is my first post and I am looking for some info on flying other than for professional passenger airlines. It is incredibly difficult to find any kind of info for these kind of jobs as all careers sites lean towards only Airline Pilot positions. I've always wanted to work in an airline but the various threads that tell how difficult it can be to get one of these coveted jobs have put that dream to the back of my mind, as more of the ultimate, long term aim than it was before.

So, I'm looking for info (any kind would be appreciated) on those kind of jobs at home in the UK or abroad, primarily as a paying way to get a good number of hours notched up. I don't have any licences at this time but I can't see any problems in getting them. I presume, going by common sense, I will need a CPL for a paid flying job. So just a few (hopefully quick) questions:

1.What jobs are there for commercially licensed pilots other than the obvious, e.g. instructors

2. What do they involve? What are benefits/downsides?

3. Do many of these kinds of jobs need certain amounts of flying hours?

Any answers to these questions would be greatly appreciated, as would links to sites with help with articles more varied than Airline Pilot, Airline Pilot, Airline Pilot, Airline Pilot, BA pilot


Thanks a lot to those who can help people like me with a - hopefully - more realistic approach to eventually perhaps becoming the Airline Captain I dream of being

[UltraSonic]

Well, i have to say you have the right attitude
Start small and grow as you go.

You are right about the CPL/IR, you'll need it.

There are many jobs outthere other then airline jobs. Some examples: foto shoots, runway ILS calibration, small package delivery, medical flights, and so on and so on....
As for where to get them i would try a few small local airports, once you have your CPL in your pocket visit them from time to time, know what's the "word on the street" if you know what i mean.
Most of these jobs do not require a high amount of flight hours, most pilots use these jobs to do time building.

I hope this helps.

[Maude Charlee]

Try http://www.pilotjobsnetwork.com/tcontactlist.html as a good place to start.

[learboys]

non airline

Hi there

Just to give you an idea there are alot of different types of flying.
Charter operations-Small executive and corporate jets
Bush pilots- flying folks to lodges, islands(island hopping taxi services).
Flying for freight companies like DHL with smaller aircraft, Grand vans.
Flying for aid, Red Cross and United Nations.

I've been around small aircraft(cesna 402, barons, senneca's, kingair 200, 1900 series) and smaller Jets (lear 24-25, hs 125 series) and Helicopters(bell series)
It's been a whole lot of fun, I dont think I would even consider going to the airlines. The places I've been and people, its a way of life, never a dull moment.

I have taken time off and currently doing my ATPL so I can go Captain a small jet aircraft some day. You have to have an ATPL as jet aircraft are classed above 5700kg.
I personally feel the airlines are a rip off, as young pilots have to pay large amounts of money to get rated and the salary are low, you have to wait a long time for promotion and a long time before you start earning a good salary. Not saying you shouldn't try for the airlines.

Please note alot of pilots flying for Charter companies do move over to the airlines from time to time. The airlines require Pilots with hours they fetch them from the Charter industry, so don't give up your dream.

Bottom line is just start enjoy your flying, dont worry about the hours or ratings they will come, who knows where you will be in 10 years from now.

Good luck

[Gotta_Hope]

Thanks these have been great help, really appreciate it, but what is the average time scale and price range for getting a PPL and a CPL? I know it varies according to ability, school etc., but what about, for example, someone training full time passing the majority of exams first time?

Some more answers to my first question (top of page) would still be very welcome, thanks.

[wings87]

Not only airline job is a flying job!!

Totally agree with learboys.
Done most of my flying flight instruction + air taxi between caribbean islands and other places, great experience!!Now 35 decided to come back and just finished my licence conversion. Hope i will get a job soon in that same category in the Uk, if anyone ready to help please feel free to contact me.
Good luck everyone and remenber that not only airline job is a flying job!!

[WX Man]

Aerial survey

Advantages: basically 6 months on, 6 months off. The 6 months off is the advantage.

Disadvantages: not many hours (300 a year if you're lucky), difficult to find full time job that pays through the winter and long days during summer. Oh and the money's sh*te compared to airlines (but more than instructing).

Certainly not a career job- and that's coming from me who is probably one of people most likely to be cut out for this as a career. But give me a decent paying airline job any day.

[potatowings]

Some posts here are obviously from disgruntled people.

Looking at it realistically you need to think outside the shiny tube. Speaking as someone with experience working my way through the system into the right hand seat of an aircraft I decided I wanted to fly over 5 years ago, I can tell you it is possible.

If you would like some tips then either e-mail or PM me.

[stefair]

potatowings - Why PM or e-mail? Why not posting it here so we can all benefit from it!?

[MrHorgy]

In slightly the same vane as the above...

How the job market for Freighter pilots? Do they take many low houred guys? Wouldn't mind working for UPS of ChanEx if the opportunity arose...

Horgy

[badgerpuppy]

Dudes,

If I had been offered a job on an airliner having graduated from the OATS long couurse in late 2001 I think I would have taken it and not looked back. As it was, those jobs at that time were just not around and I was forced to go and get myself an instructor's rating.

From being a 1000hr flying instructor / instrument instructor / multi engine instructor, I became a seneca driver flying public transport last minute freight and pax. This was all over europe, day, night, crap wx.

At 1300hrs, I had command of a BE20 Super King Air, single pilot with the same company again flying all over europe and doing some really interesting stuff.

At 1800hrs, I had command of a multicrew light jet zipping about at 40,000 feet doing the med, FL100 positioning from airport to airport empty, flying just enough, but not too much to get bored of it! Best of all I get paid on a par with or if not better than my contempararies who work for the likes of easy or ryan.

Flying Corporate is actually what I had in mind when I signed on to this ridiculous fiasco of an industry. The nightstops in wonderful hotels, the company credit card, hanging about in beach bars, not six sectors per day to alicante or some other hideous destination taking people who frankly give me a rash to places they can't pronounce for 42 quid.

Most of the guys I know at airlines are bored silly with this. In three years I have been to 1250 odd airports across europe and actually have been able to get out of the airport for a few days and look around.

Believe me, it's not for everyone and you can pick holes in any job you get offered but really,this is fantastic, and lets face it they are your hosties and your company ink, not mine.

tata.

[buzzc152]

WX man, there are jobs around for survey pilots that pay a decent full time salary, give plenty of good multi flying and all the usual benefits. Granted, they're not easy to come by but the do exist ('cause I've got one)....... just need to get out and visit the right companies.

[angelorange]

Want to really hone those flying skills try: www.flightprecision.co.uk

[Davidils20l]

No luck searching the web, so checking with you all out there.
Wondering if there were any air taxi, charter flight companies running from spain. Turbo would be great, but right now even C402 or Navajo would please my desires.

Also are there any regional turbo operators, apart from Nostrum operating in Spain.

Alot of these small fields are expanding, e.g. Malaga, Granada, Seville. Must be work there somewhere!

Thanks

[Fokkerdriver]

DenimAir is looking for pilots

[Girl Fly-day]

Hello

Please could anyone help me with the following?

I'm on the verge of deciding whether to go for my commercial licence and am trying to get a feel for job prospects - the area I haven't explored yet is that of the lower paid jobs such as aerial photography flights, research flights, tourist flights etc? This might be a good route in to build experience before applying to airlines. Does anyone know of a directory of such companies, or can anyone offer some useful tips please?

Thanks!

[Addy]

Denim Air have just told me on the phone that at the moment there is no recruitment going on

[badgerpuppy]

dudes,

sometimes there are jobs, sometimes not ( on jets i mean), usually there are jobs on something somewhere, if you have a licence and no particular ties also having done the right thing and planned to pay for an intructor's rating straight out of school, you have no excuse for being out of work. When i graduated very shortly after 9/11 thats what everyone with half a brain did, and i and my mates have not been out work for a single day since. There is som much more to this industry than getting a licence and then flying a bloody airbus up and down europe until we are retired. Granted, that's what most of us end up doing in the end but it's such a painful and competetive move to make with 200 hours. If you do this and get a licence, the answer is that you will get work if you really really want it, the nice thing about our industry is that it's so easy to just keep going, a year instructing, a year air taxi, a year single pilot turboprop, a year light jets, right hand seat big jets, command big jets. Simple really.

[Girl Fly-day]

Hi

Thanks for that, it's really good to hear. Not much said around about these other 'smaller' jobs but I am so willing to do anything to get on the ladder. For me, it's about the fun of flying, not necessarily flying passengers up and down. Don't care what it is, where I fly etc

Do you know where i can start finding out more? Any useful recruitment agencies, air taxi directories, etc?

Many thanks!

[mach2moose]

Try www.pilotjobsnetwork.com and look under small operators.

Good luck