Teamsters shreading Polar quality of life contract
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Teamsters shreading Polar quality of life contract
Rumour has it that Teamsters local pres. Joe Muckle just inked off on a TA to hand over 4 extra work days a month to management. Now poor ole Atlas management really needed those concessions, after all they have only been reporting record profits, quarter over quarter, year over year. Come on now, please, someone tell me it aint true.
Pilot groups looking for representation? No need to look any further, just come on over to the Teamsters, Bourne and his cronies with have you bent over screaming like little piggies in no time.
Pilot groups looking for representation? No need to look any further, just come on over to the Teamsters, Bourne and his cronies with have you bent over screaming like little piggies in no time.
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I worked for two different companies that had pilot representation with the Teamsters (in both cases, they were voted in just after I departed for greener pastures), and in each case....the company folded within five years.
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" with have you " ?
I am with; have you?
are you with 'have you'?
Do you have an education?
Squealing like a pig? Does that mean happy squeals?
Screaming like little piggies? You have knowledge with little piggies?
Is that the education you have?
So many questions, like,
Are you a Teamster? and if so, have you contacted a steward or representative regarding this rumor?
Are you even a union member?
Where have you heard the rumor from?
How do you 'shread' a contract?
How could you believe something so preposterous and then pontificate as if it were gospel?
Inquiring minds, with educations, would like to know.
I am with; have you?
are you with 'have you'?
Do you have an education?
Squealing like a pig? Does that mean happy squeals?
Screaming like little piggies? You have knowledge with little piggies?
Is that the education you have?
So many questions, like,
Are you a Teamster? and if so, have you contacted a steward or representative regarding this rumor?
Are you even a union member?
Where have you heard the rumor from?
How do you 'shread' a contract?
How could you believe something so preposterous and then pontificate as if it were gospel?
Inquiring minds, with educations, would like to know.
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So Squealer...what you are saying...if my basic math is correct...that after almost 4 years under the stellar contract your guys got for you in '05...what was that? 10% for 18 months?...and all the obfuscation since then...what looks like close to a 40% pay raise and profit sharing is unacceptable?
Maybe you should have your guys really negotiate instead of obfuscate. Really worked out well, huh?
One of these days, management and indeed the entire industry will cave in and accept your leaderships superior logic and negotiating skills....
...yeah.
Maybe you should have your guys really negotiate instead of obfuscate. Really worked out well, huh?
One of these days, management and indeed the entire industry will cave in and accept your leaderships superior logic and negotiating skills....
...yeah.
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411A...care to share which two and under what circumstances?
And maybe how it relates to this case?
Using your logic, since I know guys who were at Braniff, PanAm, Eastern and TWA; all of whom folded, ALPA must REALLY be bad!
And maybe how it relates to this case?
Using your logic, since I know guys who were at Braniff, PanAm, Eastern and TWA; all of whom folded, ALPA must REALLY be bad!
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...what looks like close to a 40% pay raise and profit sharing is unacceptable?
Really????????? Guess I just must have missed where and when they inked that one. Maybe we just ought to give um 30 days a month for an unspecified rate and profit sharing.
Really????????? Guess I just must have missed where and when they inked that one. Maybe we just ought to give um 30 days a month for an unspecified rate and profit sharing.
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all of whom folded, ALPA must REALLY be bad!
A sad story, make no mistake.
ALPA=ALPO...a well known previous dog food brand.
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Rumour has it that Teamsters local pres. Joe Muckle just inked off on a TA to hand over 4 extra work days a month to management.
I can see that "Here we go again" with the Alas Polar bashing thing.
I'll just sit back and watch the fireworks commence!
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Since when does a Union Local president unilaterally ink a deal with management on any contract issue? If there is a TA, it will be voted on by the membership, and then it will pass or it will fail.
Something tells me the "squealer" has very little experience in a union, or maybe none at all.
Something tells me the "squealer" has very little experience in a union, or maybe none at all.
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Actually in this case the membership will not get to ratify the TA. It is the negotiation of a single contract between two pilot groups and the company. Any remaining open sections will be decided by an arbitrator. At this point I would just as soon let the arbitrator start making decisions for us. Can't do worse than our current reps.
Last edited by Miami Freight; 18th Aug 2010 at 13:03.
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Miami Freight
Actually in this case the membership will not get to ratify the TA. It the negotiation of a single contract between to pilot groups and the company. Any remaining open sections will be decided by an arbitrator. At this point I would just as soon let the arbitrator start making decisions for us. Can't do worse than our current reps.
Actually in this case the membership will not get to ratify the TA. It the negotiation of a single contract between to pilot groups and the company. Any remaining open sections will be decided by an arbitrator. At this point I would just as soon let the arbitrator start making decisions for us. Can't do worse than our current reps.
Sometimes it scares me to death after reading some of the posts that they let these guys in an aircraft at all other than as a passenger.
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Miami Freight
Thank you for the constructive criticism. I should have proof read my post more thoroughly.
I think what you meant to say is "Did you pass 8th grade English?"
Thank you for the constructive criticism. I should have proof read my post more thoroughly.
I think what you meant to say is "Did you pass 8th grade English?"
Did you proof read it at all?
What a
FR8
Last edited by Fr8Dog; 18th Aug 2010 at 20:30.
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Most duty rigs stop while you are in your domicile .For the Atlas home and gateway based crew members this is great. However after one or two overnights for the Polar Crew members in their ANC , CVG or LAX domicile , the duty rig is useless. They will work 20 days for a 65 hour guarantee. This is a pig with lipstick
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411A is right...Unions do not hire pilots, regardless of how much the loyal ALPO cool-aid drinkers push the issue...
I was there when DAL took over some of the fleet of EAL B-727's and ALPO promised jobs...Only Mgmt Pilots need apply...DAL didn't even have the courtesy to change the tail numbers...
And as ALPO stated, everyone who "holds the line" in 1989 would have "priority" hiring at UAL...
What airline would hire a bunch of s..t stirrers?
It"s all down to the individual...do what you think is right...think for yourself and keep your job or drink the cool-aid and go down with the ship...
Alos, as an aside...speaking of ALPO, the issue at ALPO re: EAL was not contract or anything along that line...The IAM struck, and ALPO and the Teamsters (F/A's) both directed their members to honor that line...
Just think back to 1989 and recall what was the dominant carrier in ATL...when you remember it was EAL, try to remember who was ALPO's President...(hint: A DAL Captain with initials of H.D)
Last bit of info...who is the head of the FAA (Capt. R. Blabber?) and what was he doing in 1989???
Glad he finally got his...but how did it happen???...at he expense of the pilot group he used to be a part of is my guess...
I was there when DAL took over some of the fleet of EAL B-727's and ALPO promised jobs...Only Mgmt Pilots need apply...DAL didn't even have the courtesy to change the tail numbers...
And as ALPO stated, everyone who "holds the line" in 1989 would have "priority" hiring at UAL...
What airline would hire a bunch of s..t stirrers?
It"s all down to the individual...do what you think is right...think for yourself and keep your job or drink the cool-aid and go down with the ship...
Alos, as an aside...speaking of ALPO, the issue at ALPO re: EAL was not contract or anything along that line...The IAM struck, and ALPO and the Teamsters (F/A's) both directed their members to honor that line...
Just think back to 1989 and recall what was the dominant carrier in ATL...when you remember it was EAL, try to remember who was ALPO's President...(hint: A DAL Captain with initials of H.D)
Last bit of info...who is the head of the FAA (Capt. R. Blabber?) and what was he doing in 1989???
Glad he finally got his...but how did it happen???...at he expense of the pilot group he used to be a part of is my guess...
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Another asswipe ALPO discrimination snafu involved just-retired age-60 senior pilots, who were offered jobs only as new hire copilots at the bottom of the seniority list after age-65 mandatory retirement had kicked in. [Delta] Go figure.
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I can't help but feel that this "Rumor" began, and has since been fueled, by "fear". Fear of the unknown. Fear of what may happen. These ARE trying times, as we have to trust our elected officials to do their best, in our interests. ( much scepticism ). Do you have any alternatives?. Communication of what they are trying to get, or will be satisfied in getting, is impossible. The negotiators are a "blend" of both subsidiaries, are they not?. I was led to believe so. Don't let the "fear" of what may happen override your living day by day. You obviously can't control what's going on, so let it go.
There will be a time when the ball is back in our court.
There will be a time when the ball is back in our court.
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I can't help but feel that this "Rumor" began, and has since been fueled, by "fear".
Fear? Fear my stinking hiney. It's more like the thought of sitting around on "de facto reserve" in some gin joint hotel in some whacked out crazy ass country for 4 extra days a month because scheduling can't get their act together. With the lines we're running they ought to be able to put together 65 hour lines in 12 days let alone 16 days. And now their asking for 20, and our own union says, "sure by all means", without even having a pay scale set. Yes sir mister boss man, we know your making record profits and taking home fine bonuses while the crews live on a sub industry standard contract. Just what else can we give up, so you boys can go have a good laugh at the country club about how you stuck it to labor this time. Jesus a** Christ
Fear? Fear my stinking hiney. It's more like the thought of sitting around on "de facto reserve" in some gin joint hotel in some whacked out crazy ass country for 4 extra days a month because scheduling can't get their act together. With the lines we're running they ought to be able to put together 65 hour lines in 12 days let alone 16 days. And now their asking for 20, and our own union says, "sure by all means", without even having a pay scale set. Yes sir mister boss man, we know your making record profits and taking home fine bonuses while the crews live on a sub industry standard contract. Just what else can we give up, so you boys can go have a good laugh at the country club about how you stuck it to labor this time. Jesus a** Christ
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Miami Freight has is about as wrong as Squealer. If an agreement is reached, it will go out for membership vote. That's why Polar has been dogging it. They know a majority vote would put a contract in place and they are still believing Bahamas and Boobin. That worked out really good...
Fact is, two of the three parties have been trying to get a deal for years. One has poured enough sand in the gear case to choke a JT-8. And now that they see none of the grand get rich quick schemes are gonna bear fruit and they are throwing everything at the wall.
What I want to know is that if negotiations are kept under wraps and the parties were admonished to do so at the last meeting; how did the supposed deal and info about the TA leak out before the meeting concluded that day? Only two people left the room with their cellphones in warp overdrive. The company and Atlas sat at the table from what I hear.
Polar...news flash...you can't win the integrity battle when you can't be trusted to honor your word.
Anyone with a wit's backround on negotiations knows that a TA's section can also be used as a bargaining chip for other things before the whole deal is TA'd. But nooooooooo...Polar knows better.
Like I said before; look at that stellar deal from '05. Courtesy of an MEC chairman who wet his pants and CAVED IN 36 HOURS into the 30 day cooling off. And when he'd shown his cards and proven he was in no position to bargain, he went back and asked for more!
Bit of history. He cost the Polar crews over $5 grand each (7 for Captains) in signing bonuses, Profit Sharing and and additional 5% pay increase. What is it they say in the Guiness commercial?
BRILLIANT!!!!!!!!!!!
Another sad fact. Polar pilots want the airline to be sold. Since your stunt in '05? Nobody wants you. They tried. No one wanted a group of people who demonstrated that they could not play well with anyone and felt the world owed them something. And then turned around and screwed the very people who made it possible to keep your jobs. Because the company was perfectly willing to sit out your strike and let you vaporize. Why? Because your empty scheduled service cost more money than parking the planes. Yep. They MADE MONEY by parking the planes and not having to buy fuel to fly the planes around.
Yet more crack planning by your MEC.
Nothing’s changed. The reputation and attitude precede you.
BH and now BK seem to have no problem flushing you down the drain. After all, there’s a pilot shortage. No one’s available, right? You’ll bring them TO THIER KNEES.
Sound familiar?
BH said he had no problem with 250-300 job losses; “acceptable collateral damage” he called it for him to never wear an Atlas uniform. Wonder how those guys feel.
Apparently BK has no problem either. He seems to forget what the arbitrator said when he crammed the Scope arbitration down BH and Boobin’s throat. That the company has the right to run its business in a manner they see fit.
And Squealer..."substandard industry contract?" After what YOUR guys negotiated in '05, you're whining about "substandard?" And then they refused to negotiate in '06, '07 and '08 when the economy was still strong?
But that's OK. The majors are begging you to come aboard to tell them how they've been doing it wrong also