Chapter 4 Nighttime operational restrictions

[747FOCAL]

I am curious if there is any concern from you freight types over non Chapter 4 Noise certified aircraft not being able to operate at night after jan 1, 2006???

Somebody like FedEx that has multiple nightly flights into the most sensative airports in the EU and none of the Boeing aircraft are projected to be Chapter 4 certified by 2006.

[anguspm]

As I understand it no date has yet been set although I do know that AI are looking into this in preparation of an expected ruling.

I think we'll see a situation similar to that which accompanied the introduction of previous limits. ie: grandfather rights, specific exemptions etc etc..

I know we have an Ac that cannot fly CDG (which enforces nightime stage 4 already) as prior to conversion it only every operated on the N-reg. The other five identical Ac we operate can do the flights due to grandfather rights.

I think this will only become a major problem if the number of airports requiring stg4 compliant Ac continues to grow..... or if the numerous "get out of jail free cards" are removed. I think you only have to look at the way things went with the 727 to see how things will happen.....

[Boss Raptor]

All detailed in EU legislation - to which I have provided precis and links in previous thread;

http://pprune.org/forums/showthread.php?threadid=136700

[747FOCAL]

Not to flame you or anything Boss, but I happen to be in a unique position to get word of upcoming rule changes. The short of the answer is that after January 2006, it will be near impossible to get night flight rights for any aircraft that does not carry a Stage 4/Chapter 4 noise appendix even if it is Stage 3 -25 dB like the MD90. It seems they are going to put the stigma on being at the latest amendments and not the absolute certified noise levels. This came straight from from the biggest names in EU noise certification when they visited last time.

[Boss Raptor]

Then they have to change the EU Legislation yet again and I have not personally seen any EU discussion documents on this or intent to do so - not a quick process - unless under the major airport ruling they are going to implement individual bans which are limited to airports of certain size or above as detailed in the current legislation

[anguspm]

Again Boss: not wanting to flame: but having recently been involved with AI on a three month noise measurement programme even they did not know when the limits or how they would be applied would start.

[747FOCAL]

Boss,

It was specifically stated that the approach of giving preferential treatment to Non Chapter 4 aircraft would not violate the balanced approach. In other words, technically they won't be saying you can't operate here, they will be saying there is no more room as the Chapter 4 aircraft have taken all the slots.

If you want to see how much power the EU legislation has just look at France. They have implemented all kinds of bans that are in direct violation of the balanced approach. Other will soon follow.

[Boss Raptor]

Yes u have a good point, yes this could/can happen and yes France and following EU rules are not on one and the same frequency - however without wishing to be pedantic the rules do not indicate a formal Europe wide ban but merely the means by which a limited number/certain specified airports can action their own (effective) phase out - the non Stage 4 acft will either have to operate to airports not entitled to such action and most of those anyway will no doubt jump at the business

[GotTheTshirt]

Non Aviation
But very French EU
Please answer the following current questions.
1. Which EU country is trying to ban large 4x4 SUV's from its cities.
2. Which EU country does not manufactur a large 4x4 SUV.

EU ? Moi !