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-   -   The End of HK as we know it (https://www.pprune.org/fragrant-harbour/625125-end-hk-we-know.html)

mngmt mole 1st Sep 2019 06:36

The End of HK as we know it
 
Well, a cursory look at the airport at the moment tells me that we have now passed the point of no return. The protest movement will not abate, and it will lead to the overwhelmingly crushing force of the mainland security forces at some point. CX is probably permanently out of favour with the mainland Govt (until the inevitable "announcement" of a mutually agreed sale :/ ). Regardless of the ebb and flow of current events, it does not take much of a fortune teller to surmise that HK, it's way of life and the fate of its citizens is now on a path to irrevocable change. I cannot see a forecast that would now include CX as a "career" airline. A broken company, crippled politically, financially and operationally is not a place to store up hopes and dreams. It is over.

mngmt mole 1st Sep 2019 06:55

Oh, you mean the Government then?

Okihara 1st Sep 2019 07:02


Originally Posted by Small cog (Post 10559044)
If you disrespect the rule of law then you are a supporter of anarchy and all that it brings with it.

Wait a minute buddy. The Nazis passed antisemitic laws. Just how does disrespecting these laws makes me a "supporter of anarchy and all that it brings with it"?

I uphold basic and universal human rights and despise any law with little regard for this. And I think that everyone should too.

OK4Wire 1st Sep 2019 07:05

The American war of Independence and the French Revolution, not to mention the overthrow of the USSR, would not have been possible without disrespecting the rule of law.

A grey area, if there ever was one, and one which I hope my kids will never have to experience.

mngmt mole 1st Sep 2019 07:15

There's a reason this guy is a "small cog". Small cog in an oppressive machine, that only survives without critical thinking, something this "useful idiot" provides the tyranny that has brought HK to this point.

Mill Worker 1st Sep 2019 08:26

Sadly for the people of HK they live on Communist real estate. If they don't like that or don't want to work with it its time to leave (for the ones that can). Judging by the protests at the British High Com I would think a few have arrived at the same conclusion.

TheGreenDragon 1st Sep 2019 09:16

I just called in sick for 10 days. Bugger this lark, I'm off to protest, all be it via my keyboard.

p.s. reports just coming in of Lufthansa crew being harassed at the airport. , They have been surrounded by angry militants for the last hour.
If they are injured, then this is the start of the end game.

Arfur Dent 1st Sep 2019 09:31

How do you leave if the protesters boycott and close the Airport?

Brian304 1st Sep 2019 09:53


https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....2a1e870f9.jpeg

​​​​​​​Just got got this from the sky news website. Guess it’s just a matter of time before Hong Kong airport is closed again...

AerialPerspective 1st Sep 2019 11:00


Originally Posted by OK4Wire (Post 10559050)
The American war of Independence and the French Revolution, not to mention the overthrow of the USSR, would not have been possible without disrespecting the rule of law.

A grey area, if there ever was one, and one which I hope my kids will never have to experience.

Not to mention the Eureka Stockade on the Victorian Goldfields... a failed battle but an enormous political impact felt to this day... it was the diggers who could not be convicted by any Jury, who caught the attention of the people and who, later in the Parliament of Victoria, passed some of the most progressive laws in the Empire at that time. Not only the franchise for all men but the removal of income and/or property qualifications and other social progress. That small skirmish had an enormous effect and influence even on the formation of the Federation, even arguably to the insistence on the name "Commonwealth" of Australia against vehement objections of both the British Royal Family and the British Government.

Disrespecting the law when it is wrong usually ceases to be disrespecting the law when that law is changed.

As for HK, it is sad, but anyone who thinks China will get away with this scot free is not thinking it through... they are killing the goose that laid the golden egg and shooting themselves in the foot. Everything changes, there is a good chance at this point that Trump will be gone at 1 minute past noon on 20th January, 2021 and a harder but more sane line will be taken against China. China should think long and hard before it brings out the big stick. History is replete with dictators and bullies who took one step too far and tipped the scales... e.g. the girls kissing the Soviet soldiers standing on their tanks in the streets of Moscow... the moment the tanks went back to the barracks was the end of the USSR and Communism in Russia.

Ultimately, the same will happen in China. If the USSR showed us anything it's that you simply cannot educate people to the point that they can build nuclear weapons and smart bombs, stealth aircraft and radar, etc. and not inevitably have them start asking "Hold on, why are we being run by these gangsters..." It WILL happen in China. The country, even as separate provinces has a rich and long cultural history of which the last 70 years under communism is the proverbial pimple on an elephants bum... 70 years versus 1000s...

Copenhagen 1st Sep 2019 13:37

I fear a Northern Ireland situation here soon.

Over ‘zealous’ policing is resulting in an ever more violent backlash which keeps repeating itself.

Shutterbug 1st Sep 2019 17:43


Originally Posted by Small cog (Post 10559044)
If you disrespect the rule of law then you are a supporter of anarchy and all that it brings with it.

I'm glad we all agree. Violating their own bloody contractual agreement enshrined in the binding Mutual Agreement to recognize the principle of One Country, Two Systems has unleashed a hell of anarchy marked by government forces intimidating, threatening, assaulting, raping, imprisoning, persecuting bullying citizens, employees, corporations, and free people of this once great city. It's nice to have consensus on these self-evident truths.

oicur12.again 1st Sep 2019 19:25

“....they are killing the goose that laid the golden egg and....”

Im interested to know what golden egg HK has that is so valuable to China?

Less Hair 1st Sep 2019 19:37

US Dollar based hard currency?

bigPONDsmallfish 1st Sep 2019 20:42

“Blood Letters” book written by Lian Xi...excellent background reading into the psyche of our crony capitalists oop North

Onya’ Hong Kong

Che Xindamail 2nd Sep 2019 03:12


Originally Posted by oicur12.again (Post 10559444)
“....they are killing the goose that laid the golden egg and....”

Im interested to know what golden egg HK has that is so valuable to China?

Prawn wonton noodles, BBQ pork rice, Hong Kong style milk tea. And that’s just off the top of my head.

And Then 2nd Sep 2019 06:02

I've a friend managing one of the big luxury retail brands. Sales are down 70% on last year. This is just the start of it. Small retailers will start walking away from commercial leases in the months ahead and Hong Kong is facing a depression like retail slowdown. Job losses to follow.

For young Hong Kong people, the stark reality is their grandparents worked in sweatshops for a hope of a better life for their children, yet their grandchildren may face dreary economic prospects. This may cause further significant social upheaval and hardline intervention.




Air Profit 2nd Sep 2019 07:52

Beijing will never let HK off the leash again. They will put permanent pressure on companies like CX. HK economically is heading for a sever recession, even a depression. CX will be lucky to survive without a major shake-up and I think any idea of a career here is now effectively over. Never mind the reality of what HK is now going to be like going forward: civil unrest, disaffected youth, economic stagnation and the slow death of the city in nearly all areas of commerce and social structure. The year 2047 is actually 2019. Surprised it's taken this long to be quite honest.

krismiler 2nd Sep 2019 10:04

With the Chinese mentality, Hong Kong will have to be punished for all this. Something targeted at the economy would be my guess.

Paul852 2nd Sep 2019 12:09

Maybe Mrs Lam will be sent to a re-education camp"?

Slasher1 2nd Sep 2019 13:20

Communism.

It makes smoking look healthy.

cxorcist 2nd Sep 2019 13:51


Originally Posted by Slasher1 (Post 10560047)
Communism.

It makes smoking look healthy.

Ironically, there is nothing, strictly speaking, Communist about any of this situation. The Chinese are a one party dictatorship, but in no way communist, except in name. Such is the problem with “communism” and, to a lesser extent, socialism. Political power is consolidated within the government and away from the people. Eventually, it always leads to oppression. That so much of the globe fails to learn from history is remarkable. I guess the allure of free stuff is just too great.

anxiao 2nd Sep 2019 17:05

triple7driver (now there's a handle to ponder...) Ummm I think that the vile word "racist" is apt for those who see other races as virulently different from themselves. The last time I looked the vast majority of, "Hong Kong locals" as you call them are of the same race as those who live in the mainland.

When you wish to use words loaded with bile, be sure to check your premises.

Oh and I disagree with the other paragraphs of you post too, FWIW

Flex88 2nd Sep 2019 17:14

Money Laundering
 

Originally Posted by triple7driver (Post 10560181)
China will never intervene. They will not send in the PLA (which is already in the Hong Kong garrison btw). For China this would kill the concept of One China Two Systems for Taiwan.

End of the day, China just doesn't need Hong Kong anymore... they will let Hong Kong slowly destroy itself and rot. The only thing that would cause the PLA to come in is if there was a serious threat of independence - which there isn't. The people who think independence is a viable, good thing for Hong Kong are in the minority.

China will focus their time and efforts on developing the other regions of the Greater Bay Area and leave Hong Kong as the forgotten city that will look back on it's past days of glory.

All the problems in Hong Kong now are of its own making - expensive housing, lack of social assistance, lack of social mobility - it's not China but China makes for an easy target.

I think deep down most Hong Kong locals are just racist and think they are better than the Mainland. They don't see themselves as Chinese... yet the rest of the world only sees them as just that - that's the sad part.

HK has been the spigot for the $ Trillions that have gushed out of China, they know this but once across the border, hard to catch those that do - UNLESS you pass this law..
Also Carrie Lam crying crocodile tears is BS.. She was a "pre-approved" yes person by the PRC BEFORE she took the job. Every CE for HK since the first one has been.. Communism MO at its finest !!

BTW "Greater Bay Area" - MISAPPROPRIATED (copied) from the USA.. Same as most of the IP across the border..

CodyBlade 2nd Sep 2019 17:27


The last time I looked the vast majority of, "Hong Kong locals" as you call them are of the same race as those who live in the mainland.
Tell the Cantonese they are same as mainland? You definitely don't know the Chinese culture.

cxorcist 2nd Sep 2019 18:50

This isn’t about race imo. It’s about freedom. The HK people (all races) have it and wish to keep it. The Chinese government doesn’t like freedom because it threatens their hold on power. They rule with absolute power expressed via coercion and oppression. Freedom threatens that form of governance. I don’t think the CCP really cares much about HK one way or another, but they do care about its symbolism as an example for Mainland cities and Taiwan. That’s why this uprising must be crushed. They are hoping to do it with as little force as possible so as to not upset the international community, but they will use whatever is necessary (including the PLA and outright martial law).

krismiler 3rd Sep 2019 00:46

Singapore Chinese look down on those from mainland China, why would Hong Kong be different.

Air Profit 3rd Sep 2019 04:55

After observing the mainlanders in HK over the past decade, it's not too difficult to understand why the HK chinese loath them. From their attitudes, vulgar manners, aggressive behaviour, complete lack of understanding of HK culture and their distortion of our local property market, they have effectively come across as an invading army. On top of that, you have the mainland Govt threatening the entire established culture of HK and it's citizens. Not too difficult to understand that the great guerilla war of 2019 has begun. Just walked by a sign in Soho: "Give me Democracy or give me Death". Most of the young in HK realise that they must fight, or die trying. More strength of character than the average CX pilot I must admit (and a 100% more than any of our management).

mngmt mole 3rd Sep 2019 05:00

Nice to see that CX is now publicly smearing the entire cabin crews involved in the oxygen tank depletion incidents. Another "own goal". CX, poster child of incompetent management. BTW, how's your day going CK.

deja vu 3rd Sep 2019 07:28


Originally Posted by krismiler (Post 10560480)
Singapore Chinese look down on those from mainland China, why would Hong Kong be different.

Singapore Chinese look down on EVERYONE. I do recall though when KA first employed the first of a few mainland CC the locals were horrified, mostly because they were to be paid the same as the Hongkanese.

The Range 3rd Sep 2019 11:38

And what is the HK culture?
I'm just an ignorant bystander here.

CodyBlade 3rd Sep 2019 13:15


Originally Posted by The Range (Post 10560776)
And what is the HK culture?
I'm just an ignorant bystander here.

Cantonese with the 6 unique tones.

Enuff said..

AerialPerspective 3rd Sep 2019 16:23


Originally Posted by oicur12.again (Post 10559444)
“....they are killing the goose that laid the golden egg and....”

Im interested to know what golden egg HK has that is so valuable to China?

You mean aside from the fact it is one of the most significant financial capitals in the world, on top of being one of the most significant trading ports and a host of other "most" and "best" in various categories... a window to the world for China and a very rich place. If you think that doesn't matter, I suggest you look again.

Brian304 3rd Sep 2019 18:28

It won’t be for long... Sanya (the island next door) is already expanding there ports as per government planning quietly. They publicized it to be the next Shenzhen, but in reality there using the docks to replace the import/export of Hong Kong. The step next year will be to reduce the import/export taxes lower than HK so that businesses will go over to use them. It’s all part of the government planning in PEK, just wait for reality next year...

cxorcist 3rd Sep 2019 20:11


Originally Posted by Brian304 (Post 10561040)
It won’t be for long... Sanya (the island next door) is already expanding there ports as per government planning quietly. They publicized it to be the next Shenzhen, but in reality there using the docks to replace the import/export of Hong Kong. The step next year will be to reduce the import/export taxes lower than HK so that businesses will go over to use them. It’s all part of the government planning in PEK, just wait for reality next year...

Nobody wants to ship their transit cargo through Mainland China or worse, do banking there. The events in HK are just further reinforcement of this fact. The problem is that HK now is looking more like the Mainland and capital flight is a real threat. That capital sure as hell ain’t going to Sanya!

Dan Winterland 4th Sep 2019 03:31


Im interested to know what golden egg HK has that is so valuable to China?
Billions of dollars in bank accounts, investment portfolios and properties their owners would rather the mainland authorities not to know about.

Brian304 4th Sep 2019 04:55


Originally Posted by cxorcist (Post 10561120)

Nobody wants to ship their transit cargo through Mainland China or worse, do banking there. The events in HK are just further reinforcement of this fact. The problem is that HK now is looking more like the Mainland and capital flight is a real threat. That capital sure as hell ain’t going to Sanya!

As the old saying “Money is king”, Mainland has the finances to reduce prices to a new low to attract investments.

GMEDX 4th Sep 2019 06:21


Originally Posted by Dan Winterland (Post 10561360)


Billions of dollars in bank accounts, investment portfolios and properties their owners would rather the mainland authorities not to know about.

Including the authorities as individuals themselves Dan! They want to teach HK a lesson but not scupper it completely. CX in its current form will have a tough time surviving but again I’m sure they don’t want to destroy it.

ACMS 4th Sep 2019 08:11

You guys have short memories, we’ve been through this before multiple times where we thought the end was coming.........and we’re still here.

sorry to disappoint a few of you but CX will survive.

The Range 4th Sep 2019 10:29


Originally Posted by ACMS (Post 10561488)
You guys have short memories, we’ve been through this before multiple times where we thought the end was coming.........and we’re still here.

sorry to disappoint a few of you but CX will survive.

The future looks real complicated this time. Or this "HK revolution" could spread to other parts of China.
I don't know. I'm just a bystander with some interest in what's going on there. Watching history as it happens.


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